International Relations

What's the difference between unfair advantage and vote rigging?
- @fluffy2560

One was decided upon by someone with a dog in the race, but the other was legal and above board.

The people funding propaganda claimed the government used propaganda to win.

What's the difference between unfair advantage and vote rigging?
- @fluffy2560
One was decided upon by someone with a dog in the race, but the other was legal and above board.
The people funding propaganda claimed the government used propaganda to win. - @Fred

No difference in rigged outcome which is what matters.

Thank goodness the people that do read this Forum, are bright enough and live in the real world, and if they are residents in the EU are fully aware of what's happening.

It's just a pity you don't Fred, all it does, makes you look silly.

No difference in rigged outcome which is what matters. - @fluffy2560

Not really. A political group trying to rig a legal vote by funding propaganda is complaining that propaganda gives an unfair advantage.

Trump's illegal attacks against Iran, a nation with no ability to attack the US, is helping to isolate his rogue nation in the world.

https://news.sky.com/

One more very expensive nail in a likely to be bankrupt country's coffin.

No difference in rigged outcome which is what matters. - @fluffy2560 Not really. A political group trying to rig a legal vote by funding propaganda is complaining that propaganda gives an unfair advantage. - @Fred

Yes, it gives an unfair advantage to rig the system, therefore it's not a legitimate result.

We all know what Orban is up to.  Unless you are following it intently and in detail, you're not providing any value added with your comments.

European gas prices jumped Monday as Qatar halted LNG production at the world’s largest plant amid escalating Middle East tensions.

Dutch TTF rose up to 45% to around €46/MWh, with UK NBP also surging in volatile trade.

European gas prices jumped Monday as Qatar halted LNG production at the world’s largest plant amid escalating Middle East tensions.
Dutch TTF rose up to 45% to around €46/MWh, with UK NBP also surging in volatile trade. - @SimCityAT

Of course this should not affect the US of A as it's self-sufficient in oil.

I can imagine many economies having kittens over this Iran debacle.

Hello everyone,

I have noticed there have been some tensions in the discussion, so I have decided to set aside a few inflammatory posts. Let’s all try to keep the conversation genuine, respectful, and friendly.

Thank you for understanding!

Cheryl

Of course this should not affect the US of A as it's self-sufficient in oil. - @fluffy2560

The US produces the wrong type of oil for its refineries,  that's why they have to import so much.

The girls school deaths is not a good look. The school was part of an Iranian naval base. They should have had better intel. - @fluffy2560

No, it was near a base, but not on it.

The misinformation you posted should be corrected

The girls school deaths is not a good look. The school was part of an Iranian naval base. They should have had better intel.  - @fluffy2560
No, it was near a base, but not on it.
The misinformation you posted should be corrected - @Fred

The situation regarding the school in Minab is part of a larger conflict, and the information regarding whether it was part of an Iranian naval base is still being investigated. The claims that the school was part of an IRGC base are being evaluated, and the use of schools as military sites is a serious concern, as it puts civilians at risk.

The girls school deaths is not a good look. The school was part of an Iranian naval base. They should have had better intel. - @fluffy2560 No, it was near a base, but not on it.The misinformation you posted should be corrected  - @Fred The situation regarding the school in Minab is part of a larger conflict, and the information regarding whether it was part of an Iranian naval base is still being investigated. The claims that the school was part of an IRGC base are being evaluated, and the use of schools as military sites is a serious concern, as it puts civilians at risk. - @SimCityAT

The only people claiming the school was being used by the military are Israeli.

Since they are the people who killed dozens of kids, their word is rather suspect.

Photographs and videos of the school show it as in open ground, and even anti-Iranian sites such as Hengaw show the reality of the situation.  The school was not being used by the military in any way other than to educate little kids.

Some more pro-Iranian, or at least anti-Israeli, sites are suggesting the attacks were deliberate murders committed to demoralise the navy, but these claims are to be treated with the same suspicion as the Israeli versions.

The girls school deaths is not a good look. The school was part of an Iranian naval base. They should have had better intel. - @fluffy2560
No, it was near a base, but not on it.
The misinformation you posted should be corrected  - @Fred

The situation regarding the school in Minab is part of a larger conflict, and the information regarding whether it was part of an Iranian naval base is still being investigated. The claims that the school was part of an IRGC base are being evaluated, and the use of schools as military sites is a serious concern, as it puts civilians at risk. - @SimCityAT

https://www.theguardian.com/global-deve … sual-guide

Apart from what I have already posted, readers might like to note the nearest military buildings are a medical center and a gym.

You might also like to note the lack of naval vessels, or water to float them in.

No boats, no ships, no rivers, no sea - Nothing

However, Israeli run sites say it was a navy base, so it must be. The sad thing is that some people actually believe the propaganda over facts ... and their own eyes.

The girls school deaths is not a good look. The school was part of an Iranian naval base. They should have had better intel. - @fluffy2560
No, it was near a base, but not on it.
The misinformation you posted should be corrected - @Fred

The situation regarding the school in Minab is part of a larger conflict, and the information regarding whether it was part of an Iranian naval base is still being investigated. The claims that the school was part of an IRGC base are being evaluated, and the use of schools as military sites is a serious concern, as it puts civilians at risk. - @SimCityAT
https://www.theguardian.com/global-deve … sual-guide
Apart from what I have already posted, readers might like to note the nearest military buildings are a medical center and a gym.
You might also like to note the lack of naval vessels, or water to float them in.
No boats, no ships, no rivers, no sea - Nothing

However, Israeli run sites say it was a navy base, so it must be. The sad thing is that some people actually believe the propaganda over facts ... and their own eyes. - @Fred

This means nothing.  There are plenty of inshore naval bases.   

When I was in the RAF, we were attached to an airfield but there are  RAF installations without airfields.

This means nothing. There are plenty of inshore naval bases. - @fluffy2560

Yes, the new land based ships are amazingly difficult to sink.

You clearly didn't read the link (or more likely didn't want to). It very clearly explains it was a school (separated), a fitness area, and a medical facility with NOTHING ELSE.

I don't understand how you can refuse to accept solid evidence from photos, videos, publically available sites covering many years, and independant reporters.

No, you choose to take the killers' point of view, even when it has been proven false.

This means nothing. There are plenty of inshore naval bases.  - @fluffy2560
Yes, the new land based ships are amazingly difficult to sink.
You clearly didn't read the link (or more likely didn't want to). It very clearly explains it was a school (separated), a fitness area, and a medical facility with NOTHING ELSE.
I don't understand how you can refuse to accept solid evidence from photos, videos, publically available sites covering many years, and independant reporters.
No, you choose to take the killers' point of view, even when it has been proven false. - @Fred

I don't usually read your output.

HU:

Terry Reintke vs Viktor Orbán: We always choose freedom over fear.

She doesn't hold back.   And she's totally correct.   EU is the only thing between Orban and dictatorship.

I don't usually read your output. - @fluffy2560

I'm aware. It doesn't fit what you want to be real, so you ignore it.

This is the reason politicians such as Trump end up in power.

HU:Terry Reintke vs Viktor Orbán: We always choose freedom over fear.She doesn't hold back. And she's totally correct. EU is the only thing between Orban and dictatorship. - @fluffy2560

She's a far left politician so of course she disagrees, but opinions are not facts. She pushes feminist and LGBTATOZ ideals and assumes her political thoughts are right for everyone. That makes her as deliberately short sighted as Trump.

The thing I dislike about her is she's all about freedom and democracy, but she doesn't believe opposing voices should be heard. She wants Orban banned from his right to speak because she disagrees with him.

She opposed Brexit, even though a majority vote wanted it. That means she's willing to replace democracy with what she feels is best.

That makes her potentially very dangerous, or at least she would if she every grabbed any real power.

At the moment she's just a pointless, noisy, opinionated, hypocrite.

HU:Terry Reintke vs Viktor Orbán: We always choose freedom over fear.She doesn't hold back. And she's totally correct. EU is the only thing between Orban and dictatorship. - @fluffy2560
She's a far left politician so of course she disagrees, but opinions are not facts. She pushes feminist and LGBTATOZ ideals and assumes her political thoughts are right for everyone. That makes her as deliberately short sighted as Trump.
The thing I dislike about her is she's all about freedom and democracy, but she doesn't believe opposing voices should be heard. She wants Orban banned from his right to speak because she disagrees with him.
She opposed Brexit, even though a majority vote wanted it. That means she's willing to replace democracy with what she feels is best.
That makes her potentially very dangerous, or at least she would if she every grabbed any real power.
At the moment she's just a pointless, noisy, opinionated, hypocrite. - @Fred

You are so out of touch with what is happening in the EU and Europe; it is quite sad, really.

I don't usually read your output.  - @fluffy2560 I'm aware. It doesn't fit what you want to be real, so you ignore it.This is the reason politicians such as Trump end up in power. - @Fred

Nah, it's mostly b***s.  People don't have spare time to flush down the toilet.

HU:Terry Reintke vs Viktor Orbán: We always choose freedom over fear.She doesn't hold back. And she's totally correct. EU is the only thing between Orban and dictatorship. - @fluffy2560
She's a far left politician so of course she disagrees, but opinions are not facts. She pushes feminist and LGBTATOZ ideals and assumes her political thoughts are right for everyone. That makes her as deliberately short sighted as Trump.
The thing I dislike about her is she's all about freedom and democracy, but she doesn't believe opposing voices should be heard. She wants Orban banned from his right to speak because she disagrees with him.
She opposed Brexit, even though a majority vote wanted it. That means she's willing to replace democracy with what she feels is best.
That makes her potentially very dangerous, or at least she would if she every grabbed any real power.
At the moment she's just a pointless, noisy, opinionated, hypocrite. - @Fred

I liked what she said.  She  definitely wasn't wrong.   

Polls show people don't like OV's stance.  It's dinosaur thinking.   My Mrs is going to meet the opposition leader (Magyar Peter) on Saturday.  She knows a few politicians as some of them live in the village - like MPs and Ministers.  She sees them in places like Aldi and engages with them on the fly.  I've often said she should stand for parliament.

Anyway, the Greens in the UK are probably more dangerous - like Corbyn's attitude to NATO etc.   He'd have killed us all given the dangers of the world right now.

I'll play a bit as it's a tea break.

What's your LGBTQI+ perspective then? 

How much is of that do you think is formed by religious beliefs and/or where you live? 

US/IR:

US sub sinks Iranian warship in Indian Ocean

This reminds me of the General Belgrano sinking.

They could have easily signalled the IR warship to head to a Sri Lanka port and to remain there until hostilities end.  There was no way that ship was a threat to anyone where it was.  People are are saying it's a war crime. I am tending towards that argument.  Unnecessary loss of life.

US/IR:US sub sinks Iranian warship in Indian OceanThis reminds me of the General Belgrano sinking.They could have easily signalled the IR warship to head to a Sri Lanka port and to remain there until hostilities end. There was no way that ship was a threat to anyone where it was. People are are saying it's a war crime. I am tending towards that argument. Unnecessary loss of life. - @fluffy2560

The Belgrano was a ship of war from an attacking force. It was a serious danger to the British fleet.

It was sunk as such, and quite rightly so.

The Iranian ship was from a defending country, and a very long way away from the war zone. Had a US ship been sunk by the Iranians, it would have been both similar to the Belgrano, and equally justified.

The girls school deaths is not a good look. The school was part of an Iranian naval base. They should have had better intel. - @fluffy2560
No, it was near a base, but not on it.
The misinformation you posted should be corrected - @Fred

The situation regarding the school in Minab is part of a larger conflict, and the information regarding whether it was part of an Iranian naval base is still being investigated. The claims that the school was part of an IRGC base are being evaluated, and the use of schools as military sites is a serious concern, as it puts civilians at risk. - @SimCityAT
https://www.theguardian.com/global-deve … sual-guide
Apart from what I have already posted, readers might like to note the nearest military buildings are a medical center and a gym.
You might also like to note the lack of naval vessels, or water to float them in.
No boats, no ships, no rivers, no sea - Nothing

However, Israeli run sites say it was a navy base, so it must be. The sad thing is that some people actually believe the propaganda over facts ... and their own eyes. - @Fred

To ID real targets is often hard.

As a matter of fact by international standards Israel is really good in most cases to ID targets properly.

Still false ID happens. Or just a decision to risk on suspected probability.

Remember when after oct 7 they killed their own escaped hostages? There are even friendly fire - in war that happens, it is a reality.

@Fred

Why do you care about what the enemy tells, like the mentioned "PM"?

About BREXIT: better to remember it happened actually because of a festival season, because that many who btw wanted to remain EU did not vote, but did party at concerts/ festivals. So vast majority votes - bit of overstatement regarding the general will of people. It was more about who actually attended on the vote.

@Fred
Why do you care about what the enemy tells, like the mentioned "PM"?
About BREXIT: better to remember it happened actually because of a festival season, because that many who btw wanted to remain EU did not vote, but did party at concerts/ festivals. So vast majority votes - bit of overstatement regarding the general will of people. It was more about who actually attended on the vote. - @sjbabilon5

Critical thinking changes lives. Trump is in power because his support base don't want to think. They see what they want to see, not what is really happening. It's a very common form of stupidity.

As for people who fail to vote, that's their problem so they have nothing to complain about.

@Fred
Why do you care about what the enemy tells, like the mentioned "PM"?
About BREXIT: better to remember it happened actually because of a festival season, because that many who btw wanted to remain EU did not vote, but did party at concerts/ festivals. So vast majority votes - bit of overstatement regarding the general will of people. It was more about who actually attended on the vote. - @sjbabilon5
Critical thinking changes lives. Trump is in power because his support base don't want to think. They see what they want to see, not what is really happening. It's a very common form of stupidity.
As for people who fail to vote, that's their problem so they have nothing to complain about. - @Fred

Trump is in power because people believed his lies and told them what they wanted to hear.

@Fred
Why do you care about what the enemy tells, like the mentioned "PM"?
About BREXIT: better to remember it happened actually because of a festival season, because that many who btw wanted to remain EU did not vote, but did party at concerts/ festivals. So vast majority votes - bit of overstatement regarding the general will of people. It was more about who actually attended on the vote. - @sjbabilon5

Those of us British who live in Europe were forbidden from voting in the referendum.  If we had been able to vote, Brexit wouldn't have happened.  We also weren't given a 2nd referendum to confirm the intention (compare with Irish referendum on treaty amendments).  The UK politicians who pushed it through should be banged up in jail.

No-one didn't vote because they were at festivals.  No way that can be substantiated.

But you are right about the will of the people - 48% stay, 52% leave.  On that basis, it wasn't definitive enough.  They should have had another round.

As for votes:

I think will is more important than votes.

What is even more important than base will/ stance: for what important enough for someone to fight for/ die for.

As for history (example): The Soviet Union existed because a tiny minority of Bolsheviks had a will to fight and die for their ideology, where the majority failed in the civil war.

As for Trump voters/ supporters:

Have their own bias and stupidity, like stupid conservative concepts, like law and order, or solve nothing in root just cover/ sweep under the rug.

Generally: most voter/ supporter base for any party, ideology, leader based on: "told what they wanted to hear".

Many politician after wins does something else, the rare ones who actually do what they promised are praised in history, even when promise blood and tears, or cuts and restrictions with a chainsaw. 

US/IR:US sub sinks Iranian warship in Indian OceanThis reminds me of the General Belgrano sinking.They could have easily signalled the IR warship to head to a Sri Lanka port and to remain there until hostilities end. There was no way that ship was a threat to anyone where it was. People are are saying it's a war crime. I am tending towards that argument. Unnecessary loss of life. - @fluffy2560The Belgrano was a ship of war from an attacking force. It was a serious danger to the British fleet.It was sunk as such, and quite rightly so.The Iranian ship was from a defending country, and a very long way away from the war zone. Had a US ship been sunk by the Iranians, it would have been both similar and justified. - @Fred

Like the Iranians could sink a US warship.  Get real.  They wouldn't get within range.

Belgrano was steaming away from the combat zone.  I remember it clearly being discussed.   It posed no threat according to history of the Falklands War.  Admittedly it could change direction but it was be shadowed all the time.  It was an easy target.

Like I said, the Sri Lankans could have advised the Iranian ship to come into port otherwise they might be sunk by hostile forces in the neighbourhood.   Then the Sri Lankans could have just interned it until the end of the war.

No-one didn't vote because they were at festivals. No way that can be substantiated.

But you are right about the will of the people - 48% stay, 52% leave. On that basis, it wasn't definitive enough. They should have had another round. - @fluffy2560

https://www.straitstimes.com/world/euro … rexit-vote

Not the only one.

IF that time would no festivals/ parties the vote could be like 0.5% difference instead of 2% to any direction.

@Fred
Why do you care about what the enemy tells, like the mentioned "PM"?
About BREXIT: better to remember it happened actually because of a festival season, because that many who btw wanted to remain EU did not vote, but did party at concerts/ festivals. So vast majority votes - bit of overstatement regarding the general will of people. It was more about who actually attended on the vote. - @sjbabilon5
Critical thinking changes lives. Trump is in power because his support base don't want to think. They see what they want to see, not what is really happening. It's a very common form of stupidity.
As for people who fail to vote, that's their problem so they have nothing to complain about. - @Fred
Trump is in power because people believed his lies and told them what they wanted to hear. - @SimCityAT

That's exactly what I said. The really sad thing is that so many people have seen what he really is, but don't want to believe it.

I'm amazed people manage to be that stupid and still remember to breathe,  but they are and do.

Now back to that school that was separated from a military medical center and gym with no sign of any weapons anywhere near it.

The truth has been laid bare by independent journalists,  but some people are still defending the lies.

I can't work out why that is. It defies logic.

The UK politicians who pushed it through should be banged up in jail.

But you are right about the will of the people - 48% stay, 52% leave. On that basis, it wasn't definitive enough. They should have had another round. - @fluffy2560

No, they were proven to be in line with the majority who were interested enough to vote.

They should be rewarded for the justified escape plan they enacted.

Prison for those who agree with the majority ?

Prison for people who promote their point of view?

Or is it Prison for those who are foolish enough to disagree with you?

Stalin was into that. How does it feel to be in the same club as that monster?

As for the second, third, fourth whatever number until you win vote - Only because you lost. If you had won, you would have agreed that is was democracy in action.

The level of your posts has dropped to advocating  tyranny. Those are very dangerous positions to take.

@fluffy2560

To ID real targets is often hard.As a matter of fact by international standards Israel is really good in most cases to ID targets properly. - @sjbabilon5

https://www.theguardian.com/global-deve … n-who-says

Israeli attacks are identified with care. They have badly damaged a good number of hospitals.

The defending Iranians are making a mistake in targeting cities when they should be aiming at Israeli water supplies. The Sea of Galilee is a major water source so facilities there should be attacked as a priority,  then work on the five largest desalination plants. Israel will lose 80 to 90% of its fresh water supply - That's the way to dump that somewhat nasty country.  Minimal deaths, but a devastating blow that would be very likely to force a mass exodus on a biblical scale.

I do find strange that the most notable jumps in oil prices actually happen in Azeri/ Kazakh.

There were just 2 drone strikes on the first one, none on the second.

While Gulf states with notable hits on production/ refineries have far less price jumps in their blends. 

This means nothing. There are plenty of inshore naval bases. - @fluffy2560

It might mean someting. The BBC have said it was a US cruise missile that hit the children. They say it's a type that the Israelis don't have, thus it seems to be a US attack, not Israeli as everyone first thought.

Their warmonger in chief has been pushing for AI to be used whenever possible, so this attack might well have been the result of utter stupidity.