Unusual work permit question

iankinsey wrote:

Hi everyone

My name is Ian and I'm from the UK, now living in Hanoi.  I have an unusual question about work permits. I searched previous topics, but I couldn't find the answer. I'm hoping one of you fine, informed folks will know.

I have a business visa and my work are allegedly applying for the work permit.  I gave them all the documents, however the person at my work is utterly useless and has done nothing with them for two months. Now the end of my visa is looming.

Does the work permit have to be granted before your visa expires or only applied for?

Many thanks

Ian

Please clarify some things so that someone more informed than me can answer:

1. What is the source and category of your business Visa?

Did you apply for it through an Embassy/Consulate, listing your employer as your sponsor?

Or did you get a Visa on Arrival approval letter for a DN business visa, without needing a sponsor (it was provided by your VOA agent)?

2. Are you being paid cash, or has your employer helped open a bank account for you, and paying you through that same account?

AFAIK, your work permit should have been completed by now, and the new application for a Temporary Resident Certificate should at least be in the works.

HOWEVER, if the source of your Visa was a VOA approval letter through your agent, and you are being paid cash, then your "employer" may not be legally employing you...yet.

Anecdotally, I've now heard from four different foreigner teachers who (for lack of a better phrase) are being "slow-rolled" by their employers.

The "employers" apparently want teachers to prove their intent to stay longer than six months, because it costs the employer money to get themselves a work permit for you, and they don't want to spend the money if you aren't serious about long-term employment.

Also, a good employer will assist with you obtaining a temporary resident certificate, sometimes paying part or all of the fee.

So although others know this scenario better than me, I'm guessing you are being slow rolled.

I'm also guessing (until you confirm otherwise) that your business Visa does not legally allow you to work for them.

I hope I'm wrong, but it's becoming an all-too-common story.

Cheers!

Obtaining for work permit is not that difficult. In my experience it takes about 3 weeks max. If they're not willing to do it for any reason, you can either prepare the stuff on your own or hire some service to do it. Piece of cake.

Ngan Khanh wrote:

Obtaining for work permit is not that difficult. In my experience it takes about 3 weeks max. If they're not willing to do it for any reason, you can either prepare the stuff on your own or hire some service to do it. Piece of cake.

Isn't that likely what the employer wants, Ngan Khanh?

Please correct me if I am misinformed. I have read multiple times on this forum that a work permit is for/belongs to the employer.

(Of course, I realize that posts on this forum do not constitute 'authoritative' information 😉 )

So I further understand that normally, the employer applies for AND PAYS FOR the work permit necessary for legal employment of a person.

However (as I previously mentioned in my first reply in this thread) from my anecdotal observations of situations involving foreigner teacher friends, some employers appear to be attempting to 'save' money by forcing a situation where the teacher employee must pay for the employer's work permit in order to retain their desired job.

It's common knowledge/no secret that in certain desirable areas (such as Đà Nẵng, Hội An, etc) there is currently a glut of foreigner English language teachers.

The aforementioned employers appear to be betting that foreigners such as the OP will pay the extra money to insure their ability to live in their preferred location AND be able to obtain a coveted Temporary Residence Certificate (Temporary Resident Card ~ TRC).

I've read back through some of your forum posts, Ngan Khanh, in order to understand how you might be involved in the application for work permits.

Again, definitely correct me if I am mistaken, but you appear (to me) to be an agent of sorts or "service", involved in assisting foreigners with the process of obtaining a TRC.

I have the impression that you include the work permit application process in the services you provide to the foreigner, in order for them to obtain a TRC.

Are you, in fact, an 'agent'/'service' helping foreigners obtain (pay for) TRC's, in situations where the foreigner is paying all fees, including an agent's fee and, perhaps, a fee or kickback to the employer who may or may not be providing actual employment?

If I'm totally off base, I apologize.

However, for the sake of the OP (and future casual readers) I hope to clarify IF you are suggesting that one scam is best dealt with by using another scam.

Cheers!

Oh Boy.....
Brace yourself OB

That woman’s no fool.  She’ll come out swinging.😆😆

Yogi007 wrote:

Oh Boy.....
Brace yourself OB

That woman’s no fool.  She’ll come out swinging.😆😆

Yeah, but will she be able to do it without going round in circles.

)))

lovely long post, OB!  Sorry to disappoint you but I am no agent. I work for a global company and in charge of compliance issues here in Vietnam. There are a LOT of regulations and laws to follow from Ministry of Health, Ministry of Labor, Ministry of Finance, etc. in Vietnam. So it's a small part of my job to make sure all foreigners have necessary paperwork before my company moves staff to Vietnam.

I'm just curious how did OP got his business visa in the first place....From business visa to work permit is not a lot of work since he said he had his documents already done....

Ngan Khanh wrote:

I'm just curious how did OP got his business visa in the first place....From business visa to work permit is not a lot of work since he said he had his documents already done....

That was my question as well.

I have a hunch he may have a category DN business visa, acquired through a Visa on Arrival agent.

If...IF that's so, he can't use that visa for employment with the school.

As I understand the process (perhaps incorrectly) if he wants to work but has a VOA supplied "sponsor" (an 'XYZ' company provided by his agent) for his current Visa, then he technically needs a new Visa before applying through the school for the TRC.

As I understand it, he can only use his current Visa to apply for work with his current sponsor IF he's here on a VOA category DN business Visa.

As an aside, one school administrator in Tam Ky told me that it's better for ESL teachers to come here on a tourist Visa and then apply for the work permit and TRC through the employer.

That is, of course, unless the prospective employer agrees to sponsor a business Visa through an embassy/consulate.

Your thoughts? Please correct any misconceptions on my part.