Solar and LED Lighting

Sometimes things are fine just as they are. Did you ever consider that.

On Solar power generation, it is probably lack of knowledge and money.
If some solar expert with time and very deep pockets were to jump in at the deep end, I suspect they could make a difference, if they were willing to take the time and spend the money.

In a poor country that has problems turning money into basic infrastructure such as roads rather than going into someones pockets, solar power must seem like sending a man to the moon.   

On LED lighting, the only LED lights I have been able to find in Placencia are really cheaply made 5000K lamps  that fail, quickly or fall apart, and are expensive compared to CFL. Its bad enough, that folks that bought what is available are put off by the crap and think all LED lighting is crap based on what the local merchants sold them. 

Again I see a business opportunity, if the import duties don't totally kill the economics.

I bring a few decent 3000k lamps down for my own use each time I come.

GuidoBisogno wrote:

My guess would be the govt. is in bed with the power companies and discourages or taxes and duties improvements out of reach?

I don't think it is fair to say "they are in bed with the power companies" when they actually own "it". Yes BEL is the only one. Solar power equipment is available and sold through a few companies, however the high import taxes on imported solar equipment including LED lights, and laws that state you must hook up to the electric grid if it is available, makes the costs of solar prohibitive for most locals and even many expats except for the occasional traffic sign or other similarly small loads.

I have a friend that built a house where an electric connection was not available and paid US$50,000 for a just barely adequate solar production and storage system to be installed, with a backup generator that he needs more than occasionally. My highest monthly electric bill is BZ$80.00 (US$40.00)/ mo. Not even factoring in maintenance costs of the solar system it would take more than 104 years to pay off that investment.

I met folks that had a $20k system that took care of their needs, although it had no storage for nigjt use.  Prior bills ran $150-200 a month so their payback was much shorter. 
Didn't know there were junk LEDs in the market.  Seems many products I saw were Chinese second rate stuff compared to what they send to the states.  The fixtures we used were not cheap but use 1/10 the power and essentially never need replacement.  Again, a much shorter time to recover costs.
Thanks for the input and theory.

GuidoBisogno,
Not to be argumentative, but it sounds like we are comparing apples to oranges here. And yes the system costs I'm sure are accurate because the storage portion of the system is a substantial portion of the cost. A $150-200/mo. bill indicates to me (especially if that is US$), that these folks previously used power at night (after dark) and extensive A/C. or had high demand for some other reason during the day that they obviously don't have now on solar. So in reality that has to change the relative pay back time.

In Belize dark falls around 6 PM all year round (give or take a bit). So what they considered adequate would be different to my definition. No storage for night use would mean no inside lighting (other than candles or expensive batteries), no water pump, no TV, computers etc., No fridge, no security lighting and so on. In all fairness the figures I quoted for us are based on a gas range, no clothes dryer, and a gas heat on demand hot water boiler (three of the four major electricity draws). Our daytime usage is the washer a couple of loads per week, electronics, and an AC unit for a half hour per day (before bedtime) during a few of the hotter months of the year. The situation you have described would not fulfill my needs or the needs of most people I know, so that is also relative when considering the cost of solar. But like everything, everyone's reality and comfort level is different. I would be surprised if we didn't cut our consumption by at least half again if we shut the power off at 6:00 every evening increasing that relative pay back time even more.

Yes many of the products in all sectors here are of a lesser quality at a higher price. In my experience even popular US brand name tools and appliances that can be found in the Belize market are often the second run stuff that is produced for the big box stores or products that don't meet the quality control standards we are used to in the US and Canada. I think having a government owned power supplier also contributes to the higher costs of energy saving products and the ability for most people to purchase them. I'm not sure what the difference in cost is between a LED and a CFL, but at 10- 15 dollars for a reasonably sized CFL lamp (I presume a comparable LED is considerably more), that is about a half a days pay for many locals, creating a situation that makes energy savings prohibitive for most ultimately reducing availability based on  demand.

What is the cost per kiliwatt hour there?

BZ$64.32 for 187 kWh last month or about BZ$0.34 (US$0.17)/kWh

I have  had solar at my place for 2 and a half years, there are companies that are very professional  here in Belize. I use Pro Solar based in Belmopan. They parent company is California based and I have only had the best experience with them.  I now have the BEL power to my property too and Pro solar installed the automatic switch so the power goes from one to the other as needed, typically if the Battery power is low due to very cloudy weather in the rainy season. My Bel bill is always very low, even when my builders have been using power tools all day.

My set up was approximately 10k but when the inverter blew (probably our fault overloading it, and we had an old  second hand water pump that drew a huge start charge,  so we replaced that  ) Pro Solar  replaced  the inverter under the full warranty no charge, and we have had no problems since.

Thank you!  I saw the advertising and display in Belmopan near a main road.  My understanding was that the cost per kilowatt hour was much higher than quoted above.  As a matter of fact that quote is a penny less than PG&E in northern CA which, I think, is ridiculous.  But you have to cull through the chFf on a forum!  Thanks for your input.  Makes good sense.

A little current information that might influence some: Chinese LEDs are simply not worth the risk of failure - 60 watt LEDs are regularly available for between $1-2 ea on sale in the US, and WalMart has some @ about $10 per pack of 4. Can be sent USPS International priority, or carried in airline luggage (even if bulbs are broken they work - 'bulb' just serves to diffuse light of the LEDs). LED prices have become ridiculously cheap now, and I would buy nothing but LED, except in the higher wattages (above 60 watts), where costs are now quite high, due to lower demand. Prices of those will fall significantly with increased demand, only a matter of time in my opinion. One can run a ton of LED lights on a decent sized AGM car battery. I plug my car battery into my camper each day in the US, and never have a problem with a low battery. It recharges when I go to town, or.
It is interesting that Guyana has duty free solar installations; perhaps some contact with the BZ government might do the same - a considerable portion of the country's income is spent on electricity, although evidently there is sufficient electricity to be purchased from Mexico at present. And, of course, there is a 'take' to be had for every KW sold!
You are well advised in using gas for any heating (water, drier, cooking), as those use a great deal of electricity, as does AC.
I will be installing considerable solar, being in an area without any hope of electricity, using a forklift battery for storage (until current storage options get sorted out), and thin-film collectors. A good quality forklift battery (Crown) will have the same lifespan of most solar components (20-25 yrs).
I suspect that the lack of expertise has most to do with the lack of solar power; it is difficult to find someone who is really competent even to service a refrigeration compression. I had to get a compressor for friends in Placencia, over $1,000 total cost, only to find that their 'technician' later discovered it wasn't the compressor, but rather a cheap thermostat. Inexcusable, but this is the only way locals gain experience to become competent. The ones who work in any field are likely among the most competent souls available, and we must simply await the time it takes them to gain the experience to become really competent. But as we used to say of the cold weather in Montana: At least it keeps the Californians out .......  Now I am in deep doo doo!!!!
But in the end, Bill's advise is very good; the best solution is to live differently, more like the locals. It is not nearly as 'bad' as it seems, and that lifestyle makes for a relaxed atmosphere in a country where the atmosphere supports BEING RELAXED!!! If you don't like RELAXED, for heaven's sake, don't ruin the country! Find someplace un-relaxed, and you'll feel more at home!!! And I've stepped in it again!! Best wishes to you all.

I have solar on a small house built in an off the grid development in the Santa Ignacio area. At the time the house was built (2009), there was no in-country dealer to buy the system from. The first system available  was a Chinese system that was order but never actually arrived in country. After several missed delivery dates, we imported a system from the U.S. thru a dealer in Mexico.  The system has worked reasonably well but is a little undersized.

Lesson learned is that  I should have gotten a second opinion to verify that the system ordered would suffice. Second lesson was that nobody locally actually know how to set the system up. We did find an expat that know enough about solar systems to install it; he has established a small shop and installs a couple of systems a year along with doing maintenance on the systems he has installed but he's more interested in being semi-retired than in building a business.

An noted above, now there are a couple of companies that are now available to install and maintain systems so it is easier to find someone to do an installation now than there was until recently.

Another factor is that your payback calculation does not seem to account for the fact that to get a system installed in Belize you have to add transportation cost from the U.S. thru Mexico or via ship from the U.S to the border of Belize, customs clearance and fees, local transport from the import point to the system installation location, etc., plus the 12% VAT on the price of the system, all above and beyond what you are paying in CA.

Can solar work in Belize? Certainly, but it's not a no-brainer situation. Given the actual electrical power rates as noted above, the payback period is considerably longer than your assumptions seem to indicate.  Given that costs will vary in different parts of the country, you would need to run the number and see if it work for your particular case.

Hi everybody,

Just to inform you that some posts have been removed.

Thanks,

Priscilla 

Like your reply Bill. Very practical.
Just thought I'd put my 2 cents in re power costs. I am from Alberta, Canada. A few years ago, the government decided to privatize power there and private companies took over. It was supposed to lessen our power costs. Well it did as far as KWH goes, but whereas when the government ran it there was the Kwh charge and a small charge (about $12 CAN) for administrative costs, the private companies decided they couldn't do it all on their own. So now we pay the Kwh plus the same amount for the power line company and the same amount again for the billing company plus the small administrative charge. So we are now paying triple the costs we used to pay. And there is no such thing as choosing your company as they keep telling you. Each company has their area and if you live in that area you have to choose that company. So I, for one, am all for government run power companies.
Also, I run exactly the same appliances here in Belize that I have in Alberta, so I can compare oranges to oranges. My last bill in Belize was $96 BZ ($48 US) for a month. My last summer bill in Alberta was $126 CAD ($167 U) for a month. I LOVE the electricity prices down here!

Electricity in Belize costs three times what it should. I would say the country is broken when it comes to utilities and phone and internet service. IT NEEDS FIXING.

kstarre wrote:

Electricity in Belize costs three times what it should. I would say the country is broken when it comes to utilities and phone and internet service. IT NEEDS FIXING.

kstarre;
I'm not trying to be antagonistic, I am Just wondering why you would say it is broken. What needs to be fixed? And, how would you fix it? 

Here is a link for  the current electrical rates in $BZ.

http://www.bel.com.bz/Rate_Schedule.aspx

Be sure to try the Bill calculator giving results for old and new rates with a breakdown of charges.

"Caribbean Time" 

Today Jan 24, 2017  I received confirmation of my request to open a BEL E-Service account with the electric company to be able to pay this bill online. I made this request back in September of 2016.  Four and a half months... even in Caribbean Time WOW.

I am in and out of Belize 2-3 times a year so paying it remotely was very important to me. I had paid extra to hopefully cover the small usage while I was gone.

I just paid the bill with the new account, it will be interesting to see how long it takes to credit the account. Also they have SERIOUS SECURITY problem with this E-Service...they sent confirmation of my password change including user name, account number and password in CLEAR text. There is absolutely no excuse for such a security lapse in this day and age.

That it took so long is unusual. If you pay your bill online, either through your bank account or with a credit card, your account is credited the same day. You will even get an email confirmation. We've been using the online service since it has been offered by BEL, and never had any kind of security issues. It's a great service.

Hi, I have solar power, and it works just fine.  There is a guy in Bullet Tree that gets great panels from China, and does a great job.  The expense of the solar power is one reason people do not have solar. Electricity is expensive here, but so is solar initial output.  The batteries are expensive too, but if a person can afford solar, there are great benefits.

I have LED lights throughout the house.  The bulbs have never burned out yet.  In my area, there is no electricity, and I only know of one other family that has solar, and she has one panel for her house.