Why is it that most vietnamese i meet are untrustworthy?

Lol

colinoscapee wrote:

Does she take Paypal.

Mrs hELLnoi is Vietnamese. She only takes VND or USD.
I have always wondered why "CASH ONLY"???

is there any correlation between poverty and trust worthiness or the direct act of stealing?

disclaimer: not all poor people are bad just as not all poor people         
            are good

Ok, well I dont have cash, what about three chickens and a Celione Dion cd.

Khanh44 wrote:

is there any correlation between poverty and trust worthiness or the direct act of stealing?

Nope!  I know some farmers in Can Tho, who are far from being wealthy.  Yet, they don't want anything from anyone, unless they have earned it.

I bought them some liquors once.  Then, shortly thereafter, they sent me some very good "ruou de."  Ounce for ounce, theirs were not the financial equivalence of mine.  But when you take our circumstances into consideration, theirs cost a lot more.

They are what Vietnamese are about.

colinoscapee wrote:

If you read the teachings of Uncle Ho, what has evolved in Viet Nam is not what he wanted. Seems they keep using him as a figurehead but dont follow his teachings. I have asked locals what Uncle Ho would think if he came back to Viet Nam now, most say he would be disgusted at the greed that has taken over the country.As the saying goes,if socialists understood economics,they wouldnt be socialists.Lets hope that the average Vietnamese will obtain better health care and infastructre in the coming years.

Can you pls introcude me to those locals you mentioned? Cant more agree!

Ashard Deen wrote:

I have a theory, i think part of it due to communism in the past. Religion was not freely allowed to practice and like it or not most religions teach basic tenants like not stealing, honesty etc. I also think when the markets opened up it became a dog eat dog race with a lot of corruption like in most developing countries. You had to keep up if you wanted a piece of the pie.  Like i said it is just a theory.

Theory always sounds good but in daily life, practical solutions are required, right?

hELLnoi wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

Does she take Paypal.

Mrs hELLnoi is Vietnamese. She only takes VND or USD.
I have always wondered why "CASH ONLY"???

Just a small note: using cash foreign currency without approval from Vietnamese competent authorities is illegal in VN... So, VND is preferable - lol

aibiet150204 wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

Does she take Paypal.

Mrs hELLnoi is Vietnamese. She only takes VND or USD.
I have always wondered why "CASH ONLY"???

Just a small note: using cash foreign currency without approval from Vietnamese competent authorities is illegal in VN... So, VND is preferable - lol

Vietnamese competent authorities: Who are the authorities?

The official currency of Vietnam is Dong. Official invoices HAVE to be in VND.
However, PAYMENTS can be in USD and is openly accepted in the tourist and gold jewelery industries.

hELLnoi,

They are the drunkards living all around you, who the Vietnamese Communist Party has labeled "competent."  Got it?

Hey man, don't ask me how!

Wild_1, Question wasn't directed at you, unless you are also aibiet150204 who zapped me with Vietnamese competent authorities. I wasn't clear who these authorities are. I understand they can range from the local ward to the prime minister's office.

hELLnoi wrote:

aibiet150204 wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

Mrs hELLnoi is Vietnamese. She only takes VND or USD.
I have always wondered why "CASH ONLY"???

Just a small note: using cash foreign currency without approval from Vietnamese competent authorities is illegal in VN... So, VND is preferable - lol

Vietnamese competent authorities: Who are the authorities?

The official currency of Vietnam is Dong. Official invoices HAVE to be in VND.
However, PAYMENTS can be in USD and is openly accepted in the tourist and gold jewelery industries.

Haha, I have no idea who are those competent authorities but you can see every coner of the streets in VN on... the paper... You are not allowed to do this or do that without permission of competent authories or if you are not falling in the below categories etc. but in fact, everyone does that without any permission )))

Well, let me remember, the contract in VN have to state in VND, the price must be in VND, the payment must be made in VND if the transaction is performed within the VN territory.  I cant recall any exception for "PAYMENTS can be in USD and is openly accepted in the tourist and gold jewelery industries?!?". But pls correct me by showing me the source to check this!

Aibiet,

How are we to know that you are not an informant??? 

Where and how we spend our money are "top secrets."  We can tell you, but then we will have to kill you...

Wild_1 wrote:

Aibiet,

How are we to know that you are not an informant??? 

Where and how we spend our money are "top secrets."  We can tell you, but then we will have to kill you...

Wao, how smart you are! Im an INFORMANT - otherwise I didnt give my valuable note (well small but valuable tho, I forgot to mention earlier!) to hELLnoi... Haha

Just so you know, I am brave enough not to fear of being killed by a human being but the words "competent authorities" sounds dangerous to me : )))))))) so, just tell me then!

aibiet150204 wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

aibiet150204 wrote:

Just a small note: using cash foreign currency without approval from Vietnamese competent authorities is illegal in VN... So, VND is preferable - lol

Vietnamese competent authorities: Who are the authorities?

The official currency of Vietnam is Dong. Official invoices HAVE to be in VND.
However, PAYMENTS can be in USD and is openly accepted in the tourist and gold jewelery industries.

I cant recall any exception for "PAYMENTS can be in USD and is openly accepted in the tourist and gold jewelery industries?!?". But pls correct me by showing me the source to check this!

You might also know that officially, you have to add two zeros after the decimal. VND 1,000,000.00 in your invoice.
The next time you buy gold jewelery, ask your goldsmith if you can pay in USD.
When you stay at any of the "non-Vietnamese" hotels in Vietnam, check how the foreigners pay their hotel bills besides credit cards.

hELLnoi wrote:

aibiet150204 wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

Vietnamese competent authorities: Who are the authorities?

The official currency of Vietnam is Dong. Official invoices HAVE to be in VND.
However, PAYMENTS can be in USD and is openly accepted in the tourist and gold jewelery industries.

I cant recall any exception for "PAYMENTS can be in USD and is openly accepted in the tourist and gold jewelery industries?!?". But pls correct me by showing me the source to check this!

You might also know that officially, you have to add two zeros after the decimal. VND 1,000,000.00 in your invoice.
The next time you buy gold jewelery, ask your goldsmith if you can pay in USD.
When you stay at any of the "non-Vietnamese" hotels in Vietnam, check how the foreigners pay their hotel bills besides credit cards.

Uhm, not sure if its legal? Should check with lawyers first! Issue in VN is everyone does 1thing all the time but not sure if such thing is legal?

colinoscapee wrote:

I will just say this,if the locals are so honest, why is it that all the houses have major security and locked up. You cant park your bike somewhere without a guard,security guards have to sleep in businesses at night,my friends tell me not to trust anyone. If the locals are so honest then why is there so much theft or is it that everyone is paranoid here.

Exactly, even my mom's vacation home which is walled in has locks and security bars all over the place. My granny carries around a key chain loaded with so many keys like a janitor!

i didn't realize how important a local newspaper is when you are new to the area and want to find suppliers, lease land, find workers etc...Also i think it is really important to create a sense of community and be a excellent platform for community projects and public policy.
I know the internet and free news has been the death of many a newspaper, but this is less the case for local news. People want to know what is happening in their neighborhood, where the Vet is, what the cost of a bag of pig feed is , who got robbed last week etc...
I live in Cu Chi and it has a population of 350 000 people and no local newspaper. Every time i need to find something or need information from someone, i have to ask someone who ask someone else etc...alot of the time i have had to ride around and ask the people that run the local cafe's. It is really inefficient. I am serously looking at publishing a local weekly paper if the powers that be gives me the go ahead.
My wife thinks i am crazy.

bongolongo wrote:

... i have had to ride around and ask the people that run the local cafe's. It is really inefficient.
...My wife thinks i am crazy.

That is the local BBC.
You will be surprised how fast the wind can carry any news.
Not many "farmers "in the province read and write" but the wind carries the news very efficiently.

Bongolongo,

I hate to break it to you, but the wife is once again dead on.

Where do you think you are, mate???  This is the great Socialist Republic of Vietnam, where no one touches the media, except the grand drunkards of the Party. 

You are in a very small town.  You might want to slow down a little there.  In such areas, it is not very wise to ruffle up feathers or step on toes...  Things can get really complicated, really quick.

The land in cu chi is surprisingly expensive. To buy 1 hectare on a main road you are looking at over $200 000. Most people i have met are literate. Their are alot of wealthy people their and alot of poor. but it certainly isn't destitute as some other places i been too. Does anyone else think a local newspaper modelled on your weekly neighborhood newspaper in the west will work?

i would strictly stay our of reporting on politics..or have anything controversial. More like a classified with a few feel good stories thrown in. it is just an idea at this stage...

she is more against it because she thinks it would lose money and i would have no chance in getting the necessary permits to go ahead... Assuming i do get the permits and they don't cost too much, i don't think it is a forgone conclusion it would lose money. i think it could be a massive hit....

I have yet to see a Vietnamese, without Party membership, obtained such a permit. 

But Vietnam is changing, if you have the time and the energy, go for it...

MIA2013 wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

I will just say this,if the locals are so honest, why is it that all the houses have major security and locked up. You cant park your bike somewhere without a guard,security guards have to sleep in businesses at night,my friends tell me not to trust anyone. If the locals are so honest then why is there so much theft or is it that everyone is paranoid here.

Exactly, even my mom's vacation home which is walled in has locks and security bars all over the place. My granny carries around a key chain loaded with so many keys like a janitor!

my mom sewed my underwear with inner pockets...

bongolongo wrote:

she is more against it because she thinks it would lose money and i would have no chance in getting the necessary permits to go ahead... Assuming i do get the permits and they don't cost too much, i don't think it is a forgone conclusion it would lose money. i think it could be a massive hit....

There are too many mouths to feed.
Newspapers are propagandare machines. Can you guarantee everything you print is "true"? You will not only lose your money, but your freedom. You are no longer in the USA. Even the USA is changing its stance to "freedom".
"Either you are with US, or you are against us"!

khanh44 wrote:

MIA2013 wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

I will just say this,if the locals are so honest, why is it that all the houses have major security and locked up. You cant park your bike somewhere without a guard,security guards have to sleep in businesses at night,my friends tell me not to trust anyone. If the locals are so honest then why is there so much theft or is it that everyone is paranoid here.

Exactly, even my mom's vacation home which is walled in has locks and security bars all over the place. My granny carries around a key chain loaded with so many keys like a janitor!

my mom sewed my underwear with inner pockets...

. I put my cash in my bra...Ha..Ha.. My twins can secure anything.

aibiet150204 wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

aibiet150204 wrote:

I cant recall any exception for "PAYMENTS can be in USD and is openly accepted in the tourist and gold jewelery industries?!?". But pls correct me by showing me the source to check this!

You might also know that officially, you have to add two zeros after the decimal. VND 1,000,000.00 in your invoice.
The next time you buy gold jewelery, ask your goldsmith if you can pay in USD.
When you stay at any of the "non-Vietnamese" hotels in Vietnam, check how the foreigners pay their hotel bills besides credit cards.

Uhm, not sure if its legal? Should check with lawyers first! Issue in VN is everyone does 1thing all the time but not sure if such thing is legal?

Like driving the wrong way on a one-way street, quoting prices in non-dong is illegal.  This is to prevent the concept of "dollarization" where everybody just uses dollars in business transactions; this diminishes the authority of the local currency.  It's the law, but in practice...well, do you still see people driving the wrong way on a one-way street?

hELLnoi wrote:

bongolongo wrote:

she is more against it because she thinks it would lose money and i would have no chance in getting the necessary permits to go ahead... Assuming i do get the permits and they don't cost too much, i don't think it is a forgone conclusion it would lose money. i think it could be a massive hit....

There are too many mouths to feed.
Newspapers are propagandare machines. Can you guarantee everything you print is "true"? You will not only lose your money, but your freedom. You are no longer in the USA. Even the USA is changing its stance to "freedom".
"Either you are with US, or you are against us"!

bongolongo is Australian dude.  You should say "You are no longer down under, mate"

Tran Hung Dao wrote:

aibiet150204 wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

You might also know that officially, you have to add two zeros after the decimal. VND 1,000,000.00 in your invoice.
The next time you buy gold jewelery, ask your goldsmith if you can pay in USD.
When you stay at any of the "non-Vietnamese" hotels in Vietnam, check how the foreigners pay their hotel bills besides credit cards.

Uhm, not sure if its legal? Should check with lawyers first! Issue in VN is everyone does 1thing all the time but not sure if such thing is legal?

Like driving the wrong way on a one-way street, quoting prices in non-dong is illegal.  This is to prevent the concept of "dollarization" where everybody just uses dollars in business transactions; this diminishes the authority of the local currency.  It's the law, but in practice...well, do you still see people driving the wrong way on a one-way street?

I trust you do not need my answers?!?

aibiet150204 wrote:

Tran Hung Dao wrote:

aibiet150204 wrote:

Uhm, not sure if its legal? Should check with lawyers first! Issue in VN is everyone does 1thing all the time but not sure if such thing is legal?

Like driving the wrong way on a one-way street, quoting prices in non-dong is illegal.  This is to prevent the concept of "dollarization" where everybody just uses dollars in business transactions; this diminishes the authority of the local currency.  It's the law, but in practice...well, do you still see people driving the wrong way on a one-way street?

I trust you do not need my answers?!?

I can tell you that your lawyers won't be able to give you satisfactory answer. You HAVE to direct this to the Ministry of Finance and Treasury.
1. The Vietnamese banks are offering accounts in USD.
2. Walk into any casinos in Vietnam, you will see USD.
3. If you are working for a multinational, many expat are paid in USD as stated in their employment contract.
If you drive on the wrong side, the traffic police can arrest you and pull you off. I had the rare opportunity to witness that being done twice! Once in Hanoi and the other in HCMc.

aibiet150204 wrote:

Tran Hung Dao wrote:

aibiet150204 wrote:

Uhm, not sure if its legal? Should check with lawyers first! Issue in VN is everyone does 1thing all the time but not sure if such thing is legal?

Like driving the wrong way on a one-way street, quoting prices in non-dong is illegal.  This is to prevent the concept of "dollarization" where everybody just uses dollars in business transactions; this diminishes the authority of the local currency.  It's the law, but in practice...well, do you still see people driving the wrong way on a one-way street?

I trust you do not need my answers?!?

Right.  The final question is a rhetorical question.  My post was answering your question on it being legal or not.

I have quoted examples where non VND transactions are done legally.
I ALSO know we are way out of topic.

hELLnoi wrote:

aibiet150204 wrote:

Tran Hung Dao wrote:

Like driving the wrong way on a one-way street, quoting prices in non-dong is illegal.  This is to prevent the concept of "dollarization" where everybody just uses dollars in business transactions; this diminishes the authority of the local currency.  It's the law, but in practice...well, do you still see people driving the wrong way on a one-way street?

I trust you do not need my answers?!?

I can tell you that your lawyers won't be able to give you satisfactory answer. You HAVE to direct this to the Ministry of Finance and Treasury.
1. The Vietnamese banks are offering accounts in USD.
2. Walk into any casinos in Vietnam, you will see USD.
3. If you are working for a multinational, many expat are paid in USD as stated in their employment contract.
If you drive on the wrong side, the traffic police can arrest you and pull you off. I had the rare opportunity to witness that being done twice! Once in Hanoi and the other in HCMc.

Yes, there are exception for those that conduct business internationally.  But hotels outside D1 cannot quote prices in dollars just because there is a huge foreigner presence there.

There are casinos in Vietnam?  I only know of one and they do not allow Vietnamese citizens to gamble there.  It's only for foreigners so I can see why it's quoted in dollars.

Why don't you put out a sandwich board sign outside your house tomorrow morning with "$1 USD / bowl of pho" and see where that gets ya?

Tran Hung Dao wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

aibiet150204 wrote:

I trust you do not need my answers?!?

I can tell you that your lawyers won't be able to give you satisfactory answer. You HAVE to direct this to the Ministry of Finance and Treasury.
1. The Vietnamese banks are offering accounts in USD.
2. Walk into any casinos in Vietnam, you will see USD.
3. If you are working for a multinational, many expat are paid in USD as stated in their employment contract.
If you drive on the wrong side, the traffic police can arrest you and pull you off. I had the rare opportunity to witness that being done twice! Once in Hanoi and the other in HCMc.

Yes, there are exception for those that conduct business internationally.  But hotels outside D1 cannot quote prices in dollars just because there is a huge foreigner presence there.

There are casinos in Vietnam?  I only know of one and they do not allow Vietnamese citizens to gamble there.  It's only for foreigners so I can see why it's quoted in dollars.

Why don't you put out a sandwich board sign outside your house tomorrow morning with "$1 USD / bowl of pho" and see where that gets ya?

I thought D1 is in HCMc in VIETNAM. Are the hotel laws different for D1?
There are many casinos all over Hanoi and HCMc. It is not material if the disallow Vietnamese, they ARE operating in VIETNAM. (Overseas Vietnamese are permitted into the casinos)
If I put a sign: USD1- bowl of pho.
The pho guy next door will kick my sign in, even though I won't be able to sell, because nobody in my neighbourhood carries USD. The guy next door is selling at 40k VND! Plus I don't speak any Vietnamese.

Tran Hung Dao wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

aibiet150204 wrote:

I trust you do not need my answers?!?

I can tell you that your lawyers won't be able to give you satisfactory answer. You HAVE to direct this to the Ministry of Finance and Treasury.
1. The Vietnamese banks are offering accounts in USD.
2. Walk into any casinos in Vietnam, you will see USD.
3. If you are working for a multinational, many expat are paid in USD as stated in their employment contract.
If you drive on the wrong side, the traffic police can arrest you and pull you off. I had the rare opportunity to witness that being done twice! Once in Hanoi and the other in HCMc.

Yes, there are exception for those that conduct business internationally.  But hotels outside D1 cannot quote prices in dollars just because there is a huge foreigner presence there.

There are casinos in Vietnam?  I only know of one and they do not allow Vietnamese citizens to gamble there.  It's only for foreigners so I can see why it's quoted in dollars.

Why don't you put out a sandwich board sign outside your house tomorrow morning with "$1 USD / bowl of pho" and see where that gets ya?

Tran Hung Dao: well said!

hELLnoi: I trust you see a lot of things in daily life that everyone does but it is not legal! If you sign the labour contract with foreigner who is "internal transfer" then you can pay in USD but from
Overseas source and I doubt that they can quote the labour contract with VN Employees under VN Law in USD since 1 Jan 2011 up to date, previously it may be okay, but now at least you need a conversion into VND, or the transfer to bank acc must be made in VND at the exchange rate of the transfer date. Dont trust me? Then, find a real lawyer who only talks to you about VN laws in theory but show you how to do in practice!
Currently, gamebling is illegal in VN, how can you suppose to have VNese people in a casino? Well, if they are VK and they hold another citizenship or they have lot of money/power! They now have pilot scheme for gambling business, but, in practice, you can see VNese people gamble at many coners in the city - go to Huynh Thuc Khanh! Its next to the police office but sorry, who cares they are illegal gamebling?

hELLnoi wrote:

I thought D1 is in HCMc in VIETNAM. Are the hotel laws different for D1?
There are many casinos all over Hanoi and HCMc. It is not material if the disallow Vietnamese, they ARE operating in VIETNAM. (Overseas Vietnamese are permitted into the casinos)
If I put a sign: USD1- bowl of pho.
The pho guy next door will kick my sign in, even though I won't be able to sell, because nobody in my neighbourhood carries USD. The guy next door is selling at 40k VND! Plus I don't speak any Vietnamese.

The Hotel in D1 was an example I read recently in Tuoi Tre newspaper about hotels/motels in D1 posting their prices in USD and getting fined.  I'm saying it's illegal in this case because they need to quote the price in VND.  It goes for all hotels, whether in Da Lat, Nha Trang, or HCMC. 

This law is for general domestic transactions to strengthen the authority of the local currency.  There are exceptions of course.

40K VND for a bowl of noodle soup?  Talk about inflation and high cost of living in the big city! 

So where's a legal casino in HCMC?

aibiet150204 wrote:

Tran Hung Dao wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

I can tell you that your lawyers won't be able to give you satisfactory answer. You HAVE to direct this to the Ministry of Finance and Treasury.
1. The Vietnamese banks are offering accounts in USD.
2. Walk into any casinos in Vietnam, you will see USD.
3. If you are working for a multinational, many expat are paid in USD as stated in their employment contract.
If you drive on the wrong side, the traffic police can arrest you and pull you off. I had the rare opportunity to witness that being done twice! Once in Hanoi and the other in HCMc.

Yes, there are exception for those that conduct business internationally.  But hotels outside D1 cannot quote prices in dollars just because there is a huge foreigner presence there.

There are casinos in Vietnam?  I only know of one and they do not allow Vietnamese citizens to gamble there.  It's only for foreigners so I can see why it's quoted in dollars.

Why don't you put out a sandwich board sign outside your house tomorrow morning with "$1 USD / bowl of pho" and see where that gets ya?

Tran Hung Dao: well said!

hELLnoi: I trust you see a lot of things in daily life that everyone does but it is not legal! If you sign the labour contract with foreigner who is "internal transfer" then you can pay in USD but from
Overseas source and I doubt that they can quote the labour contract with VN Employees under VN Law in USD since 1 Jan 2011 up to date, previously it may be okay, but now at least you need a conversion into VND, or the transfer to bank acc must be made in VND at the exchange rate of the transfer date. Dont trust me? Then, find a real lawyer who only talks to you about VN laws in theory but show you how to do in practice!
Currently, gamebling is illegal in VN, how can you suppose to have VNese people in a casino? Well, if they are VK and they hold another citizenship or they have lot of money/power! They now have pilot scheme for gambling business, but, in practice, you can see VNese people gamble at many coners in the city - go to Huynh Thuc Khanh! Its next to the police office but sorry, who cares they are illegal gamebling?

ok we are way off topic.
and you totally miss the point.
the transactions i quoted above are LEGITIMATE transactions conducted in Vietnam daily!
1. The Vietnamese banks are offering accounts in USD.
2. Walk into any casinos in Vietnam, you will see USD.
3. If you are working for a multinational, many expat are paid in USD as stated in their employment contract.

Tran Hung Dao wrote:

So where's a legal casino in HCMC?

This law is for general domestic transactions to strengthen the authority of the local currency.  There are exceptions of course??

You mean different laws on transactions within Vietnam!

Sheraton, Metropole, Caravelle, New World.

hELLnoi wrote:

....
ok we are way off topic.
and you totally miss the point.
the transactions i quoted above are LEGITIMATE transactions conducted in Vietnam daily!
1. The Vietnamese banks are offering accounts in USD.
2. Walk into any casinos in Vietnam, you will see USD.
3. If you are working for a multinational, many expat are paid in USD as stated in their employment contract.

So I'll bring it back on subject.  Here goes..

Do you think "most vietnamese you meet are untrustworthy" because they see prices quoted in USD instead of VND?

Tran Hung Dao wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

....
ok we are way off topic.
and you totally miss the point.
the transactions i quoted above are LEGITIMATE transactions conducted in Vietnam daily!
1. The Vietnamese banks are offering accounts in USD.
2. Walk into any casinos in Vietnam, you will see USD.
3. If you are working for a multinational, many expat are paid in USD as stated in their employment contract.

So I'll bring it back on subject.  Here goes..

Do you think "most vietnamese you meet are untrustworthy" because they see prices quoted in USD instead of VND?

Go to BT market where they sell mostly to foreigners.
1. They are happy to quote in USD!
2. They will even convert their price to VND happily - USD10.00x21,000 = 210,000 VND!!! (and service with a smile)
You walk down the road, and what do you find?
Same article at half price!

Get into a taxi at the airport.
You will be given an unscheduled tour to your destination.

Sadly, it is acceptable for local Vietnamese to collect "export tax" on foreigners.