Any advice welcome on buying second hand car?

Great question! We want to buy a vehicle soon too and are wondering where to start.

Depending on how much you want to spend, it's worth looking at the main dealers. You WILL pay a bit more but you're less likely to end up with a lemon and can usually get a 6-24 month warranty. If you're browsing dealer listings, look for "Закупен нов от България" (Bought new in Bulgaria). If the vehicle is a new import there are databases on-line where you can check a vehicle's history using the VIN number.

The second-hand car market everywhere is a jungle, and BG is certainly no exception - if you can afford it, buy new! I'm a great fan of the Dacia Duster..

We have found a car and secured it with a deposit but we now have to gather together some cash as the dealer is selling for a person who bought a new car and her accountant advised this.

We then meet up and go to the notary office to get the contract. The car has insurance until June next year so I under that stays with the car.

They did say that we would keep the number plates but on checking as we are in different districts - buying from Ruse and living in Silistra one - that we will have to have a new number.

After we get everything from the Notary I believe we then go to the KAT and a form - talon? needs completing.

Question - will we be ok without a translator? 

What is the price of the car? If it's 10,000 BGN (~€5,113) or more you cannot pay for it, wholly or partly, in cash; that includes a deposit.

Are you a resident, ie the holder of a residence permit? If so, you can register the vehicle personally and get an "XX" number plate but it's tied to the validity of your residence permit and has to be renewed when your permit does.

The vehicle keeps the original registration number if it's bought by your EOOD, but you really don't want to do that..

The notary should insist on a declaration from you, in Bulgarian, that you can read and understand Bulgarian well enough to read the contract and understand what you're signing; otherwise they should insist on a qualified translator.

PS You'll get two talons, a small one that you should always carry when driving, and a big one that you'll need when registering/MOT-ing/insuring etc it. You'll also need a vignette if you venture out of your local administrative area.

ALWAYS have your licence, small talon, and insurance card with you; you'll get stopped by the police from time to time and you can have a problem if you haven't got your documents on you. It's also a good idea to carry a copy of the confirmation of payment for your talon. If you ever park in a town or city with parking zones, you'll probably have to pay for parking via your smartphone - check that you've got your registration number correct before uou hit Send. If you make a mistake you'll get ticketed/clamped/towed and the onus is on you to get it right - the "spider" doesn't care if you're dyslexic..

@JimJ

€3000 bank transfer, €6000 cash. The seller has it tied to her company.

The dealer said we would keep that number but as Ruse and Silistra are different provinces I think she is wrong.

It’s not straightforward with car purchase here 🤣

@JimJ
€3000 bank transfer, €6000 cash. The seller has it tied to her company.
The dealer said we would keep that number but as Ruse and Silistra are different provinces I think she is wrong.
It’s not straightforward with car purchase here 🤣 - @jeanmandredeix

That's totally illegal - and if you find a notary to complete the deal, you should report them, although I'd say it'd be very difficult to find a notary who'd break the law for such a paltry return. Part-payments in cash for any purchase of over the figure I mentioned carry hefty penalties for both parties. As a person you'd be fined 25% of the amount involved, if it's in the name of your company it's 50%. You're also looking at tax evasion and document fraud - you'd find yourself an ex-resident of Bulgaria..

If you're buying in your own name, as a TCN you have to reregister on XX plates as I said earlier; if it's through your company, there's no requirement to change the registration anymore regardless of being in a different region. Offhand, I'd be inclined to suspect that it's a rather weak attempt to muddy the waters about the car's history un case you get stopped by the fuzz one fine day.

Hand on heart, I'd be jogging, not just walking, away from this extremely dodgy deal...

😯 It sounds extremely complicated!

So, @JimJ, can I clarify -- is it possible to buy and register a vehicle while on yearly residence permits, it's just that the registration is tied to the permit and needs to be renewed when the residence permit is renewed? And you recommend that over the company buying the vehicle?

Hubby badly wants to have a car in Bg, but it's looking as if I need to abandon my hopes of getting a digital nomad D visa this year. In March, the London Embassy posted the earnings requirements on their website with a minimum figure based on last year's minimum wage. But I was told yesterday when I went to apply that no, it's really decided based on this year's minimum wage and I need to show evidence of earning the higher figure last year. Looks like I wasted all that time, money, and hope getting all the documents.  😆

So I need to decide whether to let hubby register a car on my EOOD, or make him wait till he has a residency card (most likely not till next summer) which will frustrate him immensely.

PS I would have suggested you ran rather than jogged but since I was talking about what I would do, I'm taking into account my one kackered and one recently- replaced knees...😎

😯 It sounds extremely complicated!So, @JimJ, can I clarify -- is it possible to buy and register a vehicle while on yearly residence permits, it's just that the registration is tied to the permit and needs to be renewed when the residence permit is renewed? And you recommend that over the company buying the vehicle?Hubby badly wants to have a car in Bg, but it's looking as if I need to abandon my hopes of getting a digital nomad D visa this year. In March, the London Embassy posted the earnings requirements on their website with a minimum figure based on last year's minimum wage. But I was told yesterday when I went to apply that no, it's really decided based on this year's minimum wage and I need to show evidence of earning the higher figure last year. Looks like I wasted all that time, money, and hope getting all the documents. 😆So I need to decide whether to let hubby register a car on my EOOD, or make him wait till he has a residency card (most likely not till next summer) which will frustrate him immensely. - @janemulberry

Yes, you can register your car as a TCN but it'll have an XX registration, renewable as and when your permit is renewed as it's tied to both your Lichen Nomer and Residence Permit. As you move on to 5/10 year permits and then to Petmanent, so does your car registration.

You CAN buy it thtough your company and try to wing it vis-à-vis the "no transactions" issue but if you're caught it gets expensive and you can't do it again.

Another alternative is to buy the car in the name of an EU/Bulgarian mate; that way it goes straight onto normal white plates. Drawbacks are that they own the vehicle and it's registered, taxed and insured in their name; drawbacks for them include being liable for any parking/driving infractions committed by you (including points removed from/loss of their licence)... 😁

Sorry about the typos in my posts above - I have a "fancy" phone case which presses against the edges of the phone and plays havoc when I type. I have some new ones but the old one has numerous document and zipped compartments which are very handy for small tools and other bits'n'bobs that probably make things even worse... 😁

No problem, I read and write fluent Typo!

Thanks for the information. I will pass it on to hubby. Yesterday he was talking about starting his own business to own the car. I suspect he will go for that option now he has it in his head (he's something of a stubborn cuss, gotta love him!) as the odds of me getting residency this year appear to be shrinking.

That'd work fine.  I'd suggest that he makes a Manager’s Authorization / Order (in Bulgarian) on plain paper, setting out his authorisation of himself to operate the company's vehicle (specifying make, model, VIN, and registration plate), signed by himself and bearing the company stamp.  He needs to keep that, and a copy of the Current Company Certificate (Актуално състояние), ie a printout from the Commercial Register proving he is the registered Manager of the company owning the car, in the vehicle to keep the Fuzz happy if/when he gets stopped for a check. It'll save a world of hassle and roadside time-wasting.  Cops here are pretty old school, so a company stamp (or notarised declaration where relevant) goes a long way with them..😎

My wife and I still laugh about the time decades ago when I was stopped for speeding and produced my UK pink paper licence; they were totally mystified at first and then delighted at the idea of driving with a folded piece of paper without a photo - so much so that not only did they let me off for the speeding but they didn't notice that I'd forgotten to buy a vignette... 😂

LOL, a lucky escape there!

I thought he'd probably need a notarised document stating that the company authorised him to drive the car. Thanks for clarifying exactly what's needed.

@janemulberry

For a nice change, the Company Declaration doesn't need to be notarised - technically-speaking it doesn't even need the company stamp as the Company Certificate is the official recognition that he is an authorised person who can sign any and all documents on behalf of the company and it has an example of his signature on it; the stamp is just to impress any cops/pen-pushers you might encounter on your travels 😎

It's a bit of a Balkan Tradition: in Greece you get Hartosima, which are basically postage stamps which are stuck on official documents and then over-stamped with ink stamps for good measure (although nowadays the government is saving money by introducing the "e-Paravolo" system of electronic stamps, which are still referred to colloquially as hartosima, just to confuse things but somehow also cost more).  Bulgarian bureaucracy is still in its infancy compared to the Greek version and Bulgarian pen-pushers frequently refer admiringly to the labyrinthine Greek system as "Byzantine" in its complexity and ability to bring those pesky citizens to their knees with often-invented rules and regulations...

Now I'm more confused! It doesn't take much! There's a bewildering range of paperwork on the company registration site, though most say I can't access them!

Which one is my company certificate?

The page I land on when I put in my company number has the company's current status and my name, but no signature. The signature is on the scans of the paperwork I signed when the company was set up, labelled Дело in the sidebar.

And is there an official way to get a company stamp, or do I just get one made up?

You can keep the license plates. I kept mine as well. I live in Nessebar, and my license plates are also from Sofia.

It’s completely normal for a lot of things to be paid in cash here in Bulgaria. Even notaries sometimes deal with cash payments. 😉 The laws officially apply to everyone, but sometimes you get the impression that they are mainly meant for foreigners. 🫣

@janemulberry

In Bulgaria, there isn't generally a government office that issues a company stamp. You normally have one made by a stamp-making company using your company's official details.

Typically, the stamp includes:

1. Company name
2. EIK/UIC (company registration number)
3. Optional: registered address
4. Optional: company logo

A company stamp is generally not legally mandatory for most private companies in Bulgaria, although some banks, institutions, or counterparties may still ask for one in practice.

@Alexander Susdorf

It's perfectly acceptable for ANY transaction under the equivalent of 10,000 leva to be in cash. However, the days of notaries breaking the law for transactions where they get absolutely zero extra for risking their livelihood are long gone, as should be absolutely obvious; being stupid isn't one of the qualifications required for the profession.

As in other civilised countries, the law applies to everyone in Bulgaria, unless you're vastly wealthy - and even then you can't count on the impunity you buy lasting forever.

The days of "Foreigner Prices" are likewise long gone, but "Sucker Prices" certainly still exist everywhere and always will.

It's also considered bad form to "Like" your own posts, especially since doing so is often a sign of a scammer or spammer.. 😎

@JimJ

He's a real estate agent! Make of that what you will....

@janemulberry

Glib talker, forked tongue, white socks, models himself on Janus, regurgitates "slop" from an AI agent with a taste for magic mushrooms? 😎

Am I getting warm?

I didn't know AI agents went in for magic mushrooms! Interesting! Though I did read that psychedelics are back in fashion.

You know we are going to make this post get the weirdest SEO!

I didn't know AI agents went in for magic mushrooms! Interesting! Though I did read that psychedelics are back in fashion. - @janemulberry

🍄😵

https://www.ibm.com/think/topics/ai-hallucinations

LOL, true, they do hallucinate.  Though possibly they are simply lying, rather than admit they don;t know something.

Now that bit has been sorted can I ask if we need a translator with us when we go to the KAT as if there is a form.yo.fill in then Google translate isn't necessarily useful especially if it's in government lingo.

@jeanmandredeix

You'd certainly find it easier: KAT isn't renowned for having English-speaking clerks, and the queues are usually long anyway.. They'll give you one or two forms to fill out in Cyrillic. Make sure to take the bill of sale and get the full details of whoever you bought it from (should be on the notary deed).

What @JimJ said. As far as I know, you must have a helper/ translator for the notary part of the purchase to sign that you understood what you're signing. It's not legally required for the KAT but will make things far easier.

Just wondering-- were you able to buy the car as a private individual, or did you use your company to buy it?

@janemulberry

We bought as a private individual. We did not need a translator at the Notary as he spoke perfect English and translated all the documents. It was very straightforward.

Have now found a local translator so will be sorting out KAT tomorrow.

I hope it all goes well at the KAT!

Interesting about the notary. Our usual notary only speaks a little English, though her admin person is fluent. But they insist I have to bring someone else in to translate and sign that they translated for me and I understood.

@janemulberry

That is correct procedure; it's actually not permitted for the notary, or any of their staff, to act as an interpreter for a transaction.  I doubt anyone will question it but it IS irregular..

One way or another nothing is going smoothly. Went to KAT at Silistra, car docs are fine but after hours of waiting and initially them saying their computer wouldn’t accept my residency card then we were called over and said because my residency card didn’t have the EU on it then we will have to drive to Sofia to do it!  Translator suggested maybe try Ruse first. I am at a loss with it all.

@jeanmandredeix

Is it a Permanent Residency permit?

@jeanmandredeix

Nothing works on the first attempt in Bulgaria, usually. I had to return 4 times to the Migration department and I was rejected by 4 banks that used the 'compliance excuse and the supposedly origin of funds that were not even transfered to the country's ! lame excuses each time. As an EU citizen, it's unacceptable to be treated so suspiciously by all the administration. It's a 'patience test's.

@JimJ

It's the Prolonged Residency the you renew annually for five years before you get longer.

Non EU but I know lots who haven't had a problem.

Oh, I am so sorry! How frustrating! I hope you can resolve the issue.

Advice for any non EU person - do not try to buy it under your name, buy it through the company. Made an expensive rookie error. Sole reason I tried it as an individual was I wanted company to remain ,'dormant'.

Not completely resolved yet as I now need to see a Notary again to sell it to the company.

Then back again to KAT .

Love Bulgaria - hate bureaucracy 🤮😭

That's not right!  If you hold a 5-year residence permit then under Ordinance No. I-45 you are entitled to register it under your own name, but only at the KAT regional headquarters dealing with your registered address, and you will only get an XX plate. If you're being told any different you need to insist on speaking to a more senior person in KAT.

@jeanmandredeix

Thank you for sharing your frustrating and expensive experience! It's hugely helpful for us to know before we risk making the same mistake when we buy a vehicle. Hubby is agitating to get one fairly soon. But I am so sorry you learned the lesson the hard way.

You have the one year annual renewable residency card because it's not long since you moved, and you weren't in France long enough to get a five year card there, is that correct? Not a got five-year residency yet?