Legal Will

22POSTS

9 years ago

PR Follows Euro Law, that automatically divides estate to children. I'm told I need a will to ensure surviving spouse has a majority share.
I have a small condo here... not a complicated deal.
A Lawyer quoted me $2,000. To draw up
Will! That seems extreme; any suggestions
Thanks

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adlin20 ViP

1057POSTS

9 years ago

PattiAnn wrote:
PR Follows Euro Law, that automatically divides estate to children. I'm told I need a will to ensure surviving spouse has a majority share.
I have a small condo here... not a complicated deal.
A Lawyer quoted me $2,000. To draw up
Will! That seems extreme; any suggestions
Thanks

Highway robbery!! As Rey mentioned, in PR your spouse will be entitled to 50% and the other 50% will be divided between your kids. You cannot exclude your kids from the will, even if you leave them less than 50% it will be legal.
I was quoted $150 for a will for our properties in PR since all my bank and other valuables are in the states and in Texas the wife will get 100% unless specify on a will. and in Texas even a will writen by me is completely legal(not that that's what we did).
I will shop around, specially outside of the metro area.

ReyP ViP

5509POSTS

9 years ago

Run from that lawyer

SawMan Serial expat

577POSTS

9 years ago

PattiAnn wrote:
PR Follows Euro Law, that automatically divides estate to children. I'm told I need a will to ensure surviving spouse has a majority share.
I have a small condo here... not a complicated deal.
A Lawyer quoted me $2,000. To draw up
Will! That seems extreme; any suggestions
Thanks

I found this subject very interesting and believe the LegalZoom type forms and easy-to-draft Wills in the mainland just won't work in PR. So, costs will be higher I am sure. But, definitely check around. There is some helpful news for you. First, if the property is jointly owned between husband and wife, the surviving spouse retains his or her ownership interest in half the property and, under "forced heirship" the children of the deceased (or their descendants) get pretty much get the other half in equal shares. everything whether there is a Will or not. So, the surviving spouse owns 1/2 the house and 1/2 of personal property with the deceased spouse's children or the children's children or their brothers, sisters, nephews, and nieces. As a practical matter, houses and property would likely need to be sold to "buy out" your nephews' and nieces' ownership of "your" house.

Even with a Will, the forced heirs are entitled, in equal proportions, to one-third of the Puerto Rico Estate (the "legitimate portion"). Another third of the Puerto Rico Estate (the "betterment portion") is distributed in proportions determined by the testator in the Will. The testator is free to bequeath the remaining third of the Puerto Rico Estate (the "free disposition portion"). So, it seems that the surviving spouse - even with a Will - might be able to receive no more than 1/3 of the deceased spouse's estate.

I then began wondering if the reason you were quoted so much is because it included preparation of a Trust (jointly with your spouse or perhaps separate) that MIGHT be a device that can be used to disinherit relatives of the deceased spouse and ensure the surviving spouse receives all of the estate. No idea if this works, but effectively if the deceased spouse does not own anything at death (it's all owned by the Trust of which the couple are beneficiaries) there's nothing for the "forced heirs." Find out what's included and what's not because it might be more than just a Will.

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SawMan Serial expat

577POSTS

9 years ago

The larger point here is for people with Wills in the mainland who move to PR thinking that their Wills providing that each spouse leaves all their property to the surviving spouse are still effective might need to re-think that because the Wills may not effect a disposition in violation of PR law. So, no matter what the Wills state, it will not accomplish the intended result if there is any claim by any heir seeking their proportionate interest in 1/2 the estate. PR law exclusively governs disposition of (i) real estate in PR and (ii) personal property anywhere in the world if the deceased was a resident of PR.

SawMan Serial expat

577POSTS

9 years ago

Researched more and found plenty of verification on some points:

- A Will drafted, either outside or in Puerto Rico, must be declared valid and must go through a court process to be validated in Puerto Rico. One article stated: People usually bring a foreign will from another state and expect it to automatically transfer and give rights in Puerto Rico. The bottom line is that you will have to go through the probate system to settle estates in Puerto Rico. The main reason for this is that, for Puerto Rico property or estates, the court will have to evaluate if the heirs of the decedent (the person who died) received their required shares. Puerto Rico has a forced heir system where the children, for example, must receive a percentage of the inheritance by law.

- The probate process in PR should be avoided, if possible - even more than in the States. It seems clear (at least from PR attorneys claiming to do estate planning work) that probate can be avoided, I suspect with a properly established Trust.

frogrock Serial expat

509POSTS

9 years ago

My cousins agreed, legally and with a Puerto Rican attorney, to renounce (?) their inheritance to their share of the property, before their parents died here in Puerto Rico. It prevented a potential heartbreaking situation.

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NomadLawyer Serial expat

693POSTS

9 years ago

Very good points by SawMan and others above. I cannot add to what has already been said specifically regarding PR.

Forced heirship (a civil law concept) is one reason why you see so many abandoned properties around PR. For example: a Man dies. The Man owned a modest house. He has five kids. One kid died before the Man died. The deceased kid had three children.

Result: 7 people inherit but at values that don't justify them paying upkeep on the house. The house is left to rot. Or, three want to sell and four don't, so the house doesn't get sold and is left to rot while the dispute continues.

Forced heirship is one reason why the offshore trusts (trusts come from the common law) business is strong in BVI and Cayman. Wealthy Venezuelans want to put their wealth outside of the forced heirship regime so they set up an offshore trust in Cayman. Added benefits are that their property cannot be arbitrarily seized by the Venezuelan government, they can protect their wealth from local currency debasement, and they can gain protection of their assets from creditors.

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frogrock Serial expat

509POSTS

9 years ago

#10

Generally speaking, if someone has no heirs, no spouse, no living parents, who would inherit the property?

SawMan Serial expat

577POSTS

9 years ago

#11

frogrock wrote:
Generally speaking, if someone has no heirs, no spouse, no living parents, who would inherit the property?

If no children, grandchildren or other descendants, then, as you note, you go up to "ascendants" - first to the parents of the deceased and then to the deceased's brothers and sisters and their children (the deceased's nieces and nephews) and their children, etc.

If that entire lineage has no one, then you go up yet another generation to the deceased's grandparents and the brothers and sisters of each of them and their children (the deceased's cousins) and their children, etc.

After that (seem unlikely to get this far) it goes to the surviving spouse and after that to a trust fund for the University of Puerto Rico. Or, at least that's how I read it.

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