Salary adjustment switch to part time

It is correct that the salary threshold to join the private health insurance scheme is currently 66600 €/year.

Please explain why you are doing this - the only reason for going below that threshold (that I can think of) is that you are currently privately insured and want to change into the public insurance.

If so, please note that there are several other factors that might prevent such a change (e.g. your age, how long you were privately insured, etc.) - and the public insurers cover less treatments and services. So you should consult an independent professional adviser (for a fee - the free ones only want to sell you something!) before doing anything that could backfire!

I cannot follow your argumentation about salary (maybe you can explain your calculation?), but if you reduce work time (which you are entiled to by law, by a percentage of your choice), then the gross pay must be reduced by the same percentage - your hourly rate would remain the same. There are pitfalls, so you should consult a lawyer experienced in labour law if you want to do things right.

Please note that part time is not well liked by many employers, so your career progession might suffer after this.

hey so I'm privately insured,  I have one child I spent a year paying private health for the monthly share of employer and myself so already do have first hand experience - I'm pregnant with second child, I have a insurance broker that wants to benefit..  im really tired of the constant exhaustive filing and paying of my own health bills and my child's and I need to reduce this pre second baby !

the only benefit I can see is I can walk into any practictioner without a referral and get a fast appointment and that my 1st child untill then has had an amazing doctor but I'm confident it's not reduced to only private health.

you are right tho and tips re percentage is completly correct - it should be my choice and I seem to be being bullied into a lesser rate.

but they way you put it makes sense and I will use this in my argument it should be a percentage I agree to and comparable to my contracted gross

i have already engaged a lawyer just need to push along, thanks for the tips !

Seems like the main conflict is that the employer is supposedly offering not just less hours but at a lower hourly wage to do so. Your lawyer should be best able to advise you about that.

But the minimal threshold to get private insurance is to initially start. Generally, once one has a private insurance option then it continues and one is NOT allowed to change to a public option. But they will be still paying their 50% share of the same cost, as is the employer. Again, a lawyer should know for sure but I don't think an empolyer can avoid paying their half of the insurance just by reducing one's hours to slightly below full time.

No reason an insurance broker should be involved. To inquire if a change to a public option would be allowed, just contact one and ask; no broker needed.

But as I have often said, the extra perks of private insurance are questionable. Certain perks can be obtained while on a public option by adding a private supplemental policy. Having another child also brings up the huge disadvantage of private policies that minor children and non-working spouses are not covered for free as under a public option. But other than civil servants, nobody is usually required to take a private option. If one has high enough income one is allowed to do so but can rarely later change. One should have been aware of all of this when they choose in the first place.

Hey thanks for your tips .. I had a company employed broker, it is actually written into my agreement that while I work for the company they need to arrange my insurance  .. it was said it's better to have a family on public but the pros and cons were never explained in detail .. they also never explained the big factor which was a mother in maternal period is responsible for both her and employers share..

I felt like this was cheating really.

having not been from this country I didn't understand the depth of the decision I was taking and the broker had a record of pushing people into private especially expats for bonus purposes I assume.

I will have 2 children in 6 months and what weighs on me the most is the painful paperwork invoice processing and paying bills - it's exhaustive and I really don't now and will not have the time.

i know you can change with the threshold below and reasoning and you are not above a certain age - I also received the same info from TK.

I also am not far over the threshold - and my partner is a low earner so I'm what circumstance is it fair to expect a mother of 2 who is the main earner to cover all annual costs on maternity with a reduced elternsgeld income that is capped -

the rule is outdated and needs reviewing and I was misinformed when I signed up for private aswell.

the reduction issue is that the renumeration is not correct, i now need to negotiate that with the help of an employment lawyer.

can't explain how much I wish I have opted for public insurance when I first moved here.

@Pearl 12345 I am sorry for your situation.

But telling us that the legal rules are unfair and should be changed will certainly not achieve anything (other than annoyance on the part of people who disagree). The rules are made in a democratic process and you, as a foreigner, have no say in this!

However, next time you make any such decision, make sure you inform yourself appropriately - and do not ever trust an insurance broker who gets commissions from the insurance! (Note: Public insurers do not offer any commission.)

They are unfair, when you are a married to an eu citizen paying tax and security in a country I beleive they should factor in household income for insurance calculation as a support system for those that A- are misinformed B-having financial difficulties.  they base it on the traditional system of male main earner that can cover entire family on insurance … it should go both ways.

so are you here to police or support ?

people come here for free unbiased advice tips and guidance, it's an expat forum after all -

and I don't think judgement is a part of that conversation.

People come from countries with completely different set ups and those  from my country is not used to making a decision that will affect their entire families life within 1 week of arriving.

the rules are out dated and I'm entitled to that opinion having lived here for 7 years.

but I don't say it to offend I say it cause I'm allowed to form an opinion in an open forum.

I really question if an employer is responsible for the employers contribution during a pregnancy; doesn't make sense or sound legal to me... I would definitely bring that up with a lawyer. I know one cannot join a public option over a certain age but that is NOT the the only cut off criteria. Once one is on a private plan, it's difficult to change to public. I'm not positive but have in mind that after 5 years private one has no chance to go public.

You can of course have your opinion, but that won't make a difference here. You have to follow currently valid rules, just like everybody else.

In my opinion, the system (while certainly not perfect) is much fairer than in most other countries. I see no bias towards male earners - but in the public scheme a social preference of families (kids and non-working partners are covered for free) and the basic rule that everyone who has an income should contribute evenly. The private scheme, on the other hand, is a commercial free market, where everyone is charged according to the insured risk, regardless of any social or fairness considerations - but that was clear from the beginning (and a legal principle is "Ignorance does not protect from punishment").

While you are right that national systems are often not geared towards foreigners' wrong expectations, in this case you had not just one week but three months to choose a health insurer. That is certainly enough to get informed about the available choices.

Health insurance is also not a topic "that will affect their entire families life" - and if you face "financial difficulties" at 60000 €/year income (almost double the German average for a family), then the problem likely lies elsewhere!

The Statistisches Bundesamt or German Bureau of Statistics currently shows the average gross household income as € 4,979/month or € 59,748/year. So € 60,000 is almost exactly average. And once one has established costs for home and vehicle etc. then it can be indeed difficult to get by if one's income is reduced.

That said; the government is not a baby-sitter for all cases. In extreme cases like loss of a job then they can help for a while. Otherwise even getting social assistance like Herz 4 only happens once one has depleted most of their financials assets. Even private insurance is not unregulated but the fact that public options exist already puts in place a system of health care cost based on income. 90% of Germans have public options.

Any expat should start to research how the system works before even coming. The government cannot be expected to save people from the downside of choosing private over public. All such information is freely available. One need just look at Wikipedia for a good overview of the German system, in either German or English, and the disadvantages of private insurance are obvious.

But I am still confused by the claims that one has to suddenly pay the employer's half of the insurance. I don't know the details of maternity leave but don't think it possible one has time off, or reduced hours, due to a pregnancy suddenly having to pay the employers part. And this sounds like an issue with workers' rights and compensation rather than the insurance. The question as I understand it is not being insured but who pays for it.

Tom is right: The average GROSS household income is almost 60k€/yr - the number I had in my head (3.4k€) was nett (after taxes and deductions). I apologize for my mistake!

But Pearl is right that, during maternity leave, the employer is no longer obliged to pay half of the health insurance premium. In my case (public insurer), I had to pay the approx. 180€/month (minimum rate for non- or self-employed) from my own pocket when I took time of after the birth of my son. The authorities give you "Elterngeld" (two thirds of your previous salary, subject to a min. of 400€ and max. 1800€/month) for12 months, plus "Kindergeld" of approx. 200€/month per kid - which easily covers this and more.

thanks @beppi and @tom  you points are valid,  thanks  for you support but I would suggest you expand you knowledge a bit on the facts cause they seem a little bit outdated, but nonetheless thanks. Also remember you don't know anything  about an individuals personal finances so don't just assume it's plenty to ‘get by' everyone has different situations.

also I asked a simple question about laws surrounding reduction of hours at an employer - I don't really need all the other points - I think it was answered in both your first replies..

thank you !!! 

The Statistisches Bundesamt or German Bureau of Statistics currently shows the average gross household income as € 4,979/month or € 59,748/year. So € 60,000 is almost exactly average. And once one has established costs for home and vehicle etc. then it can be indeed difficult to get by if one's income is reduced.
That said; the government is not a baby-sitter for all cases. In extreme cases like loss of a job then they can help for a while. Otherwise even getting social assistance like Herz 4 only happens once one has depleted most of their financials assets. Even private insurance is not unregulated but the fact that public options exist already puts in place a system of health care cost based on income. 90% of Germans have public options.

Any expat should start to research how the system works before even coming. The government cannot be expected to save people from the downside of choosing private over public. All such information is freely available. One need just look at Wikipedia for a good overview of the German system, in either German or English, and the disadvantages of private insurance are obvious.

But I am still confused by the claims that one has to suddenly pay the employer's half of the insurance. I don't know the details of maternity leave but don't think it possible one has time off, or reduced hours, due to a pregnancy suddenly having to pay the employers part. And this sounds like an issue with workers' rights and compensation rather than the insurance. The question as I understand it is not being insured but who pays for it.
-@TominStuttgart

@beppi

2200 approx elternsgeld depending on how much you would like to utilise month wise, 10% bonus I think on second child

250 kindergeld per child from jan 2023 due to inflation and rising costs

🙂

German private health is f*d up if you want a family .. unless you have a ton of savings and time - do not do it !!!

fyi you also need an assistant cause the filing is like a minijob and the payment return is often skimmed.

your welcome expats 😘