Monthly support to Vietnamese GF a mistake?

Anyone who doesn't think either of these scenarios happen all the time here, all around us everyday, has his/her head buried in the sand.

saigonmonkey,nice to read a voice of reason. I wanted to reply few times in the last 2 days but but then I realized what a bizarre mentality this is where a man in sixties chasing a girl in twenties and she and even her parents being all for it is seen as normal and people who call it as it is are seen as weird,haters and everything in between. If you read from the start there are actually some people agreeing with me but they just backed out when the things got more heated. It is no coincidence that my most vocal opponents are men in their 60ties who have found themselves in what I say. In another thread we have a ancientpahtos who basically made a prostitute out of his young maid then went to a dinner with her parents and clueless people are giving him advice on what to bring as a gift. There are countless examples of expats buying themselves into parental approval and their daughters pants. In a lot of cases parents even have no idea what is going on or they choose denial. Over years I met several older expat,giving me "tips" on the easiest way to bed girls here..Bringing old mobile phone is classic,give this and that and of course the joker card: just buy something or give some money to her parents.. Are people like this integrating into a "culture" or are they,as you said it, abusing and taking advantage of it,making joke out of it?. It is not hard to guess what I think (this goes both ways of course, expats->locals and locals->expats). Point this out and you are seen as hater,judgmental and weird. I have seen old western pedophiles playing with children and no one gave a fuck about it,Vietnamese I was with always laughed it off. Do we really just need to "get over everything" and just go with the flow?

bta87, (partially) I do not agree with "either accept it or GTFO" mentality. I am sure that every westerner here on this forum is upset about something or disagrees with something that is normal in Vietnam but not in west. I would not want that they get all the western values but I disagree with you that we should just go with the flow. I am sure when you were half your age you had some different opinions or standards too no matter where you stayed. We don't need to accept,get over or respect things happening here like pissing anywhere,spitting,picking the nose, being late,trying to rip someone off,gold diggers,GFEs,predators,pedophiles,parents selling their own daughters, people driving carelessly,corruption and lots of daily occurrences to live in Vietnam. Disagree about any of these and you should already get back to your country? What if we move to one of those Muslim countries?The same?

Being critical of something is not something that one should be ashamed of or looked down on. It is positive trait because it can bring the change for better,eve if you are in another country. I am sure you agree that Vietnamese abroad can be critical of some of the traditions or laws of their new country too. I only wish Vietnamese people would be more critical when it comes to their government,parents,officials and even foreign weirdos coming here,taking advantage of the culture or unfortunate situations. No one is badmouthing country or people, just saying how it is about the small portion of it. I do agree that if one does nothing else than just badmouth country and its people should maybe better go out.

The world does not spin on the axis of the USA.

I'm not even from USA but be sure that USA is still number one country for many Vietnamese. Most real southerners would much prefer if USA won because they lived much better before the war.Do not mistake me for someone who would want to make west out of Vietnam. I found myself in countless situations where Vietnamese are raving about USA and are profoundly disappointed (about me!) when I try to tell them USA is overrated and over glorified.It's Vietnamese who love American crap fast food chains coming to Vietnam,not me. Countless times when I prefer Vietnamese I get strange looks because they are sure that what is theirs is inferior. The first thing many ask you is if you are from USA. Everything from USA is ten times better than what is Vietnamese to them. It's not me who is glorifying USA/foreign,it's the opposite usually and I find myself defending Vietnamese on countless occasions.

solo1:Let the young women, their families and older men enjoy their arrangement

Don't worry,you won't see me on the street protesting it! Enjoy it and be happy SE Asia exists. Just don't expect me to respect this kind of arrangement ( and parents who allow it) and allow me to have my own opinions about it.

bta87 wrote:

ah the love abounds around the world. Are we all happy now. I feel we have really solved the problems of the world today. What a wonderful feeling!!

Let's have a group hug!!

bta87 wrote:

Or could father a child with blue eyes

bta87, Thanks for responding courteously to my post. It's fine with me if you or anyone here disagrees with any or all of what I post. It's just an opinion. The main reason I post anything here is to try to educate those who haven't lived here, or have only lived here a short time, about life in Vietnam. As I said earlier, I was of the impression that's what Tito12 was trying to do also. Some people are just a little more blunt and direct than others. (Can't we all just get along? )

As for your quote above, I seem to recall from my high school biology class that people with brown eyes have a dominant gene, and those with blue eyes have a recessive gene, or something like that. Given that Vietnamese families are likely to ALL have brown eyes, (there may be a few recessive blue eye genes floating around in VN families as leftovers from the war) any blue-eyed westerner who fathers a child with a VN woman will not likely have a blue-eyed child.

CTVN wrote:

Hey... I easily spend $1000 per month in VN

And you think that's a typical spending habit for a local person?

CTVN wrote:

All this nonsense about salaries of 200 to 300 usd per month are highly exaggerated.

You think so? My company employes around 3000 people, for the vast majority that's about average wage and we pay well.

The more highly skilled and office based staff range from 300-1000usd and trust me there are only a handful near the top end of that mark.

And I'm fairly sure non of them live in grass huts.....

CTVN wrote:

All this nonsense about salaries of 200 to 300 usd per month are highly exaggerated. There are people who live in grass huts who make that much and also have fruit trees, veggies, fish and chickens all around them... they are highly del-sufficient and don't actually need to buy much in the way of food... But I don't want my girlfriend living in a grass hut climbing trees for food.

Lord, $1000 is enough to live in Vietnam, thank god, because that's about all I can afford.

My wife is a degreed professional who works 5-1/2 days a week and only makes $500 per month.

Every girl who you see working in the cafes, shoe stores, and other misc. jobs only make 50,000 to 100,000 vnd per day. All the entry level unskilled city works start out at minimum wages. All in all I would bet the vast majority of people in Vietnam earn less than $300 per month.

VungTauDon wrote:

Those red flags that are waving are not Vietnamese flags...lol

LOL!

NashCat, perhaps suggesting a reduction of her allowance to see how she reacts?

Just my 5 cents worth.

VungTauDon wrote:

I am renting a 3 story house at $350 a month. Electric is $50
Food maybe $150 TV/Internet $15 water $10, Fuel for motorbike $50

Thats only $625 per month....You can save money buy supporting me, I will stay home and chat with you if you like

LOL

CTVN wrote:

Vietnamese are the *BEST* women on Planet Earth... you will never find a more loyal, trustworthy, hardworking, and loving companion in your dreams, much less in this lifetime.

They can be. But they can also be deceptive, manipulative and cruel. Nationality is irrelevant. I'm just sticking up for my Western girls

Back to the original post, I vote for stop sending her money and see what happens. Sometime's the truth hurts, or maybe she'll stick by you and then you won't have these doubts.

CTVN wrote:

All this nonsense about salaries of 200 to 300 usd per month are highly exaggerated. There are people who live in grass huts who make that much and also have fruit trees, veggies, fish and chickens all around them... they are highly del-sufficient and don't actually need to buy much in the way of food... But I don't want my girlfriend living in a grass hut climbing trees for food.

I hate to beat a dead horse with another "My wife/girlfriend story", but my wife is a doctor, and doctors get paid on average about $500/month thanks to socialized medicine. Her salary is higher because she has studied some in the US and speaks English, but even with all of that, her salary would be under $1K per month.

CTVN wrote:

Vietnamese are the *BEST* women on Planet Earth... you will never find a more loyal, trustworthy, hardworking, and loving companion in your dreams, much less in this lifetime.

Amen to that! None of my American girlfriends were as loyal, trustworthy, hardworking and loving as my wife. She is truly amazing.

Citsym wrote:

I'll take $400 and you can donate the other $400 to whoever

Ahem, I can use some donation right about now. LOL

VungTauDon wrote:

I am renting a 3 story house at $350 a month. Electric is $50
Food maybe $150 TV/Internet $15 water $10, Fuel for motorbike $50

Thats only $625 per month....You can save money buy supporting me, I will stay home and chat with you if you like

Not sure if you were just joking with him but these are very conservative estimates, especially food. Even Vietnamese, living in cities,spend more on food monthly unless they are quite poor. 100 000 VND per day for food is only possible for 1 person and if they only eat (let say 3 times per day) basic street food all day,every day. Decent pho, com tam and bun bo hue and you are already over 100 000. That does not count drinks,beers, going to normal expat restaurants, smoothies, fruit.. It is possible of course but then you really have to only eat street food constantly (or cook at home but Vietnamese usually cook for more people so the costs go up anyway).

This of course is only for 1 person and we know in most cases westerners are supporting and paying for all kinds of expenses of their better half and her parents. Even in this thread we have most of people paying monthly from $200 and up for their gf for whatever reasons so this needs to be added to expenses.

For an average expat living here $700-$900 is really average amount unless they have free housing or they rent some really cheap place and only eat street food. Then you can manage with less than $700 but barely. This does not include any kind of payments or expenses for girls in any form,visa costs,medical expenses,insurance and so on. There are a lot of hidden costs that many expats do not even take into account and they get surprised how quickly money goes despite living in a third world country.

CTVN if course wrong about how much average Vietnamese earns. It is like VungTauDon and others said. How can Vietnamese live with ~$200/month?  Lots of those not living with parents rent with their friend,splitting the cost,living modest life or they rent very cheap room. The others live with their parents so everyone puts some money together and it adds up.

However do not think everyone earns very little despite them looking poor. Street food business,small restaurants owners and so on can earn quite nice sum of money,more than the ones with degrees and "real" jobs. For example I know 2 or 3 people selling bang trang tron on good places and get profits more than $500 and even more. Sure,the are in minority but it is possible.

jakejas wrote:

khanh44 wrote:

Just want to keep myself on a Vietnamese budget.

Good plan; my wife and I use the same technique. The easiest way to become rich is to spend less than you make.

Or in my opinion. Make more than you can spend. My motto!

NashCat wrote:

Yes $800USD. She's asking for more to pay for a new place to live, furniture, moped, and etc. Her previous job was paying $800 a month.

She had a restaurant business. She is NOT a $500 salaried employee.
Even, some are already saying they earn more than USD1,000 a month.

OzOzOz wrote:

jakejas wrote:

khanh44 wrote:

Just want to keep myself on a Vietnamese budget.

Good plan; my wife and I use the same technique. The easiest way to become rich is to spend less than you make.

Or in my opinion. Make more than you can spend. My motto!

you're rich when you don't have to worry about wanting things

hELLnoi wrote:

NashCat wrote:

Yes $800USD. She's asking for more to pay for a new place to live, furniture, moped, and etc. Her previous job was paying $800 a month.

She had a restaurant business. She is NOT a $500 salaried employee.
Even, some are already saying they earn more than USD1,000 a month.

did I miss out on a part how she's attempting to make income or start up another restaurant business?

khanh44 wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

NashCat wrote:

Yes $800USD. She's asking for more to pay for a new place to live, furniture, moped, and etc. Her previous job was paying $800 a month.

She had a restaurant business. She is NOT a $500 salaried employee.
Even, some are already saying they earn more than USD1,000 a month.

did I miss out on a part how she's attempting to make income or start up another restaurant business?

She already lost her restaurant.
Now she wants to move into an apartment and asking for more.

khanh44 wrote:

OzOzOz wrote:

jakejas wrote:

Good plan; my wife and I use the same technique. The easiest way to become rich is to spend less than you make.

Or in my opinion. Make more than you can spend. My motto!

you're rich when you don't have to worry about wanting things

Not sure what everyone defines as rich. For me, not worrying about wanting things doesn't necessarily means you're rich. You're rich, when you do not have to work at all and still don't have to worry about what you want.

CTVN wrote:

How do these people afford houses?

My in-laws own several houses (mainly in D11). The family worked very hard and saved as much as they could to buy a little land and a “fixer-upper” house. After they were done fixing the house, the property value in Saigon started to raise and they started to build houses on the land that they owned. They were very frugal and saved almost all of the rent to buy other houses.

It is possible to do if you are willing to work hard and save… but let me clarify, you have to work VERY hard and save EVERYTHING YOU CAN. Here is a good example: I don’t know exactly how much money my parents-in-law make per month, but I assure you it is much higher than your average English teacher, yet my mother-in-law gets onto my wife for using paper towels because you can’t reuse them. They live in a five-story house that has two air conditioners, but refuse to use the air conditioners because they don’t want to pay the higher electricity bill. We eat rice with almost every meal. I like to hang out with the guys in their alleyway at their neighbor’s coffee shop, but my mother-in-law will make me a cup of coffee at the house before I go so that I don’t have to spend so much money on the “expensive” coffee next door (although I still do). These are just a few examples of the lengths they go to in order to save a little extra money.

Before they quit their day jobs, they made more than $250 per month, because they combined all of their income and my father-in-law learned Japanese at night classes so that he could teach in Japanese for extra money. I don’t think that someone making $250/month total household income will be able to afford a house in a reasonable time period, but if you have a household that is willing to live in a house with dirt floors, combine their income, and not spend any more than they absolutely have to; they will be able to afford a house.