Is there a love between a foreign older man and a vietnamese girl

hELLnoi

I really don't know why you reference me and my family with "boat people". You don't know me, so you shouldn't make that statement. FYI, I came by plane with a visa. The rest is none of your business. Besides I don't think you really read the young lady's dilemma. Do you have any daughters her age in her situation? Tell me if you do, then maybe I will listen closely to what you have to say. I was simply stating my opinion as a woman and mother.

Have a great day annointed one!!

MIA2013 wrote:

hELLnoi

I really don't know why you reference me and my family with "boat people". You don't know me, so you shouldn't make that statement. FYI, I came by plane with a visa. The rest is none of your business. Besides I don't think you really read the young lady's dilemma. Do you have any daughters her age in her situation? Tell me if you do, then maybe I will listen closely to what you have to say. I was simply stating my opinion as a woman and mother.

Have a great day annointed one!!

I am sure you meant well.
You are correct. I DONT know you just as you DONT know the girl.
You are a person who has everything and should be more understanding to those less fortunate. There are 80 million here. How many will even have a chance to ride in a car? What car is your son driving?
You are stating your opinion at a way different level to a destitue girl who has nothing except a dream that she can get out of the poverty trap, and help her family with only her limited English and body!

hELLnoi

Do you know me? The answer is emphatically "NO"! You are assuming all Vietnamese people are "Boat People". The young lady was seeking 2nd opinions on her dilemma. As a woman and mother I gave her mine. I don't know where your statement stems from but I suggest you know whom you are talking to before you open your pie hole!!


Have a great day anointed one!

Excuss my redundancy, I was really fired up on your statement towards me but I have to say that I am very compassionate towards the unfortunate people in the world. I have lots of experiences of my own and also people that I know. Remember, I was born in Vietnam and still have many family members (females) who fall in her situation.

I could write a book in blasting your lack of understanding for exactly what I was conveying in my statement but you seem to be fixed on the idea that this young lady has no other choices in life. I am a firm believer that we all have choices in life, and in the end we either choose to make the right ones or the wrong ones.

Perhaps you still can do something for the future generations of girls who would otherwise be asking this question in the future.

We have choices when we can afford to choose.

hELLnoi wrote:

We have choices when we can afford to choose.

If I remember correctly she mentions that even her parents are against this so she has choices,it's more her mindset and mentality that keeps telling her that is the only choice she has.

MIA2013 also raises an interesting question that I am sometimes tempted to ask such men - how open minded would they be if their 18 year old mixed race daughter would be followed by men in 40,50,60ties? I have a feeling they would be far less tolerant than they are in their own case. At least I'm hoping they would be, just like every parent that loves their child should.

Solo1 wrote:

However, younger women are not yet jaded compared to most older women. They have not experienced a list of failures and disappointments that come with life. Consequently there personalities are fresh, open minded and full of excitement. They also laugh much more easily and more often. They are not set in there ways and can be more open minded.

I call that youth; and, for better or for worst, I believe that it should not be tainted.

Furthermore, in the States, there are a lot of these "not yet jaded" women; and they come in much wider varieties as well.  Hit up on one and see what she, her families and the rest of the American public, tells you.

Tito12

I have a niece in Vietnam who married a foreigner to financially support her family. She regrets it now, but she has a child with this man and she stays for the child's sake. Her husband is so much older than she. The rest is so sad I can't even begin to explain.




Cheers to you!

MIA2013 wrote:

Tito12

I have a niece in Vietnam who married a foreigner to financially support her family. She regrets it now, but she has a child with this man and she stays for the child's sake. Her husband is so much older than she. The rest is so sad I can't even begin to explain.




Cheers to you!

Sad you niece "sold" herself for a hope to better her family's lives. What are YOU doing to help her?

We judge others with our values.
Are we doing anything to change or help any one of them?
You probably seen mothers selling their daughters in the hope that they get a chance in life. This is happening in the provinces today. I don't hear anyone opening a refuge.
We are also already way off topic.

hELLnoi

Help her??? She lives in Taiwan! She is married to a business man. I don't think that she needs any financial help from anybody!!! She is miserable because she is married to an old man whom she does not love or is happy with, that is it.

Remember, I said people make choices in life. She made hers. I didn't have a say so. That is on her and her family. I didn't know until after the fact.

You still don't get it do you?

MIA2013 wrote:

hELLnoi

Help her??? She lives in Taiwan! She is married to a business man. I don't think that she needs any financial help from anybody!!! She is miserable because she is married to an old man whom she does not love or is happy with, that is it.

Remember, I said people make choices in life. She made hers. I didn't have a say so. That is on her and her family. I didn't know until after the fact.

You still don't get it do you?

You are perfectly correct. I DON'T get it. You can advise her to leave IMMEDIATELY since she is unhappy NOW. There is such a thing called divorce. You can always correct a wrong DECISION, especially when you can easily afford to help her today.
You know the fact NOW so take the appropriate action NOW.
Sorry, I stopped alchohol, but ca phe any time

PS By the way, your niece achieved what she set out. Her family benefited. Next generation will not have to experience what she went through.

MIA2013 wrote:

hELLnoi

Help her??? She lives in Taiwan!

That deserves a whole new topic on it's own. Very sad what's happening there with those men physically abusing the wife. At least with the older Western men they don't physically abuse their wife or gf.

I guess it's just too late to say respect each other's opinion because no one person has the same opinion. Yes it's a forum to debate differences of opinion but we should leave out personal attacks as it doesn't really accomplish anything other than hurting each others feelings.

That deserves a whole new topic on it's own. Very sad what's happening there with those men physically abusing the wife. At least with the older Western men they don't physically abuse their wife or gf.

where did you get the idea that he is physically abusing her? Maybe he is ,I don't know but I seem to have missed where she mentioned this. Did you mean in general? In that case yes,I too have read and heard several stories where men (and their mothers) abusing wives in Taiwan and Korea. She probably made the wrong decision,she might be financially better but she is regretting it, wasting her youth like that. It might have not even been only her own decision,parents might have pushed here. Once the money  situation is resolved the reality of the decision can sink in.

There is such a thing called divorce

I don't know why do you think aunt can do something from the distance ,I am sure the girl is aware of this option without the need of aunt telling her this. Yeah ,it's easy to say divorce but in reality it is much harder,there comes a shame with this and much more. Vietnamese traditions can be very unforgiving in such cases. There are stories of women having their passports taken away and much more. Not knowing the language they have little chance filling  for divorce and sadly her parents don't help in many cases because the money is still coming in and the shame would be too big. Even in the west we have so many women staying in unhealthy relationships, even when they are beaten,yet they do not file for divorce. There are lots of Vietnamese girls from southern Vietnam (I forgot the name of the province,it's south of HCMC) marrying old Korean or Taiwanese men,that area even became famous for this and many times it's parents pushing it once they see shiny new things that their neighbors got after pimping their daughter to some old Taiwanese men. Do not (in my opinions stupid) forget the importance of face in Vietnamese culture,it is a powerful force causing a lot of bad things in Vietnam.

PS By the way, your niece achieved what she set out. Her family benefited. Next generation will not have to experience what she went through.

Ouch,and I thought my remarks were insensitive in some posts;) This way you can excuse even worse things like prostitution,abuse in marriage and so on so this is a bad argument.

I meant in General and regarding divorce in Taiwan. It's not as easy as you think getting a divorce in Taiwan. Both sides have to mutually agree to divorce otherwise it's extremely difficult to get one. And the father gets custody of the kid in a contested case.

if I had a daughter, and if she chooses/decides to marry a man older than her (10,20,30..50years), I will respect her decision.
if I had a daughter, and if she chooses/decides to marry a man of another race/faith, I will respect her decision.
if I had a daughter, and if she chooses/decides to marry a rich, millionaire, billionaire, I will respect her decision.
BUT if I was poor, and my daughter chooses/decides to marry an ELDERLY Man of different Religion/Race, who is better off, I will give her my blessings.
I will want what is best for my daughter, and I will RESPECT her choice and decision, whether I agree or not.
What is important is my love and relationship with my daughter whoever she marries!
Divorce is difficult anywhere if contested, and more so, where children and properties are involved. It is not impossible. At worse, each can go their own ways with a court injunction on the other spouse.

I will want what is best for my daughter, and I will RESPECT her choice and decision, whether I agree or not.

Those two things don't necessarily go together but you don't seem to make this connection. If you had a real daughter you would say otherwise,just like any responsible parent would. I know that you speak hypothetically and want to give the impression that as a great parent it would be entirely up to her but that is not responsible parenting at all. Not when she would want to marry some dopehead,some guy 40 years older than her,some guy who mistreats her and so on. A 18 year old girl can ruin her life with some stupid decision without parental guidance and even restrictions in some cases.

As a man, I wish misery and poverty upon no one, let alone my own daughter.  So, if I learn that my little daughter is heading toward such perilous waters, I will do all I can to stop her.

Wild_1 wrote:

As a man, I wish misery and poverty upon no one, let alone my own daughter.  So, if I learn that my little daughter is heading toward such perilous waters, I will do all I can to stop her.

and I wish you never have to.
I also wish everyone in Vietnam can afford to as well.

Tito12 wrote:

I will want what is best for my daughter, and I will RESPECT her choice and decision, whether I agree or not.

Those two things don't necessarily go together but you don't seem to make this connection. If you had a real daughter you would say otherwise,just like any responsible parent would. I know that you speak hypothetically and want to give the impression that as a great parent it would be entirely up to her but that is not responsible parenting at all. Not when she would want to marry some dopehead,some guy 40 years older than her,some guy who mistreats her and so on. A 18 year old girl can ruin her life with some stupid decision without parental guidance and even restrictions in some cases.

if you had been a responsible parent, you will hopefully never come to this.
this is not a 2 second decision when the girl turns 18.
In Vietnam, a girl becomes an adult when she turns 18.

In my opinion, many VN girls would wana marry foreigners to get out of poverty & get a ticket out of VN. This is not wrong as they wana provide the best for their families.

Never force yourself to do things you dont like just because of gratitude, repay his good deeds, etc.

lostsouls wrote:

In my opinion, many VN girls would wana marry foreigners to get out of poverty & get a ticket out of VN. This is not wrong as they wana provide the best for their families.

Never force yourself to do things you dont like just because of gratitude, repay his good deeds, etc.

Fortunately, many girls HAVE a chance to got to universities today.
Unfortunately, not all get to complete their studies.
Lets hope things improve with each generation.

hELLnoi wrote:

lostsouls wrote:

In my opinion, many VN girls would wana marry foreigners to get out of poverty & get a ticket out of VN. This is not wrong as they wana provide the best for their families.

Never force yourself to do things you dont like just because of gratitude, repay his good deeds, etc.

Fortunately, many girls HAVE a chance to got to universities today.
Unfortunately, not all get to complete their studies.
Lets hope things improve with each generation.

Very true...............

hELLnoi wrote:

lostsouls wrote:

In my opinion, many VN girls would wana marry foreigners to get out of poverty & get a ticket out of VN. This is not wrong as they wana provide the best for their families.

Never force yourself to do things you dont like just because of gratitude, repay his good deeds, etc.

Fortunately, many girls HAVE a chance to got to universities today.
Unfortunately, not all get to complete their studies.
Lets hope things improve with each generation.

Things will improve. That's why I want to live in Vietnam. I've seen so much growth and devlopment in Vietnam just in the last 11 years alone. And not just the infrastructure and economy but their way of thinking too.

khanh44 wrote:

hELLnoi wrote:

lostsouls wrote:

In my opinion, many VN girls would wana marry foreigners to get out of poverty & get a ticket out of VN. This is not wrong as they wana provide the best for their families.

Never force yourself to do things you dont like just because of gratitude, repay his good deeds, etc.

Fortunately, many girls HAVE a chance to got to universities today.
Unfortunately, not all get to complete their studies.
Lets hope things improve with each generation.

Things will improve. That's why I want to live in Vietnam. I've seen so much growth and development in Vietnam just in the last 11 years alone. And not just the infrastructure and economy but their way of thinking too.

It may take 1-2 generations to change.

Hello,

I just happen to fall on this post and read some of the messages... Too much to read...
To give a hint to miss Wind...
I am the opposite...^^
I am 42, was dumped 7 month ago by my wife and finally with a lot of luck find myself talking with vietnamese young women...
I was dumped by my wife because she wanted to live another life (midlife crisis), something typical from our western countries...

First thing I need to share is that in 7 month I've met a lot of women that tried to take money from me (Some succeeded because I was charmed and a bit stupid...)
I have seen a lot of scam, video scam,... so I can say I am pretty used to that and know all the basic trap...

On the other way, there are a lot of old white pervert guys. They think that showing money, making compliments, being nice is enough to seduce girls and then fall them into their trap...

One constant among fake people, they used the same vocabulary, same attitudes, same trick to seduce... If you want to see if they are real, try to ask tricky questions, ask them to show who they really are. You need to see their flaws. We all have flaws and it is normal to know them if you want to persue...
That is very important for you Wind. You need to know his flaws, ask him how is his country for real... if he doesn't talk about that, then he hides something and his afraid of your bond...

When I meet a girl/woman, I don't try to hide things, to look better. I just show myself. I don't talk about my career, house,... first, because I want that she becomes interested by me first and not by my way of living. If she is interested by me, then the rest is a bonus...

I discussed a lot with vn women and I saw that they are different. And then I felt on one in particular.
That one showed me herself like she was without any problem.
And I directly saw she was different...
Yes I was afraid by age difference, because this can bring some problem in the future, because the mentality, because the experience,...
But with discussing with her I saw she was mature enough (she is 23)...
So I decided to go to vietnam rapidly, because I wanted to see if what I felt was real and if she was what she said...

And that is another point for you Wind... Dating foreigner is expensive, but if we love, we can do anything for that...
I get up in the night every day to talk to her. I changed my abbits, my way of living to speak with her...
I would never come in the past and I did it, without any preparation, without any trouble, I came and trusted her completely...
Of course with my previous experience I saw that she was not telling false things...

This experience in Vietnam was very thrilling... I can say that I love vietnam, I like the culture, the food, I like the people and I am in love with her, but also with her country...
For the moment I can't come and live there because I have two kids...
When I went there, I meet her mother, her daughter and her cousin. I ate and drink with them all and was rapidly accepted... I love the simplicity of those people, they don't judge like we do here...

Wind, I am really in love with that woman... we talked about marriage but in the future. We want to see first if everything is ok, and also prepare everything so that the marriage would be great.
I have difficulties to live separated with her, but this is also a test for you...
What I want to say is that love is possible, that exists, nice older guys exist too, but you need to be careful. There are a lots of jerk and you are taking a risk...
Let him come in your country, live with him, show him the real country, show him the real food (I asked to eat like her in normal restaurant...), see how he reacts to everything, to the normality...
You will learn a lot of things... First if you can sleep with an old guy... If your life at the hotel is nice or boring. If he is ready to accept your culture (I will accept budha in my home for her...), how he reacts to normality, to day to day things...

As I read before here, I am ready to embrace the vietnamese culture. Do you think he is ready for that ?
Wind, there is no shame to meet and date older guys, foreigner,... but you really need to know who they are and what they are ready to do for you. Sending money is easy. This is not a proof...

I will go again at the end of the month, and this time longer.
Then She will come here 3 months. I already prepared a lot of paper for her and we will go together at the ambassy...

Then we will see. She wants to marry first in vietnam, but I know that after 3 month here she will have difficulties to go back...
All this is for the future...

Have a great evening all...

very touching oh and welcome to Expat.com

By the way, it is not a problem for me that poor women, girl try to get out of poverty...
I should say it is quite normal to try to live better. The ones saying that is not true are liar...
We have confort, we have some bonus, I have no problem to share them.
When my love will come here, she will learn french and I will push her to take any formation that she can. We will provide a goof education for her daughter and of course I will see that her mother is taken care of.
We pay enough taxes for getting back some priviledges... ^^

Thank you khanh44.

I just begin a new life. I've met new cultures, new people and I see too that expat are special people.
I am not expat yet, but I already feels like one.

^^

I'm in similar situation as you. I'm not an expat yet too but excited to be one in January. Even though I'm Vietnamese I left Vietnam at the age of 1 so it will be a new environment for me.

Lots of uncertainty how it will work out living in a different country than the one I'm used to from culture to the weather. But I think I've made the right decision.

My fiance is very similar to yours in that I felt she opened herself up to me in every possible way and I never once felt like she was hiding anything from me. She will tell me everything from personal hygiene and man girls got lots of hygiene issues to her views on life.

I can emphasize with your situation in thinking is she real or not because I harbour those same thoughts. But we eventually have to let our heart do the talking and it's a very vulnerable situation to be in.

I wish you all the very best with your newfound life.

Thank you.
I see we share common experience... ^^
Sometimes distance is difficult...
But in the end, love wins... ^^

Belsteak wrote:

Thank you.
I see we share common experience... ^^
Sometimes distance is difficult...
But in the end, love wins... ^^

Sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn't.

I know what you want to say...
To arrive here where I am, I needed 2 long relathionship and the last one was a marriage with childs...
So if I look back I can say love doesn't win...
If I look forward. I will say yes...
All those years were only preparation for me for what is ahead of me...
with my experience I can understand now what is needed, I can use the many differences as asset...

"If she is interested by me, then the rest is a bonus..."
I have found that most will be interested in a foreigner anyway in hope of what ever.

Nice story, glad u found the right lady for you.
Hope all goes well

If you believe in a Higher Being, then whatever happens between human relationships, timing, location etc is not within your control. However, the institution of marriage has been so corrupted here in the quest towards "filial piety" that is lamentable. Parents, feeling fully justified, just pressure their daughters and use them as tools to better their lives, just so that they have 'face' and can look good in the relatives' circles! These women then just adopt a distorted direction and purpose in their existence on earth. They thus believe after all the brainwashing since young, that their life's meaning and purpose is solely to capture by whatever means, some form of conveying happiness (money only buys material happiness) for their parents, ready to sacrifice if so needed. Elsewhere in the post, someone mentioned that girls are more educated these days and being more exposed to Western ways and culture. However, it will really need decades to change thoughts and behavior and GUILT for disobedience is a crippling force to reckon with. Hopefully, the next generation of parents here will be more enlightened towards the pursuit of individual happiness for their children.

Hi belsteak firstly welcome , good to hear a person with good attitude. I am starting to see there is many people who are not xpats yet, maybe we should form, a  "not yet xpat, meet up?"

Hi sploke 77, you seem to know much! what happens when both parents die or killed, who takes responsability for family 5 young people??

Well, I do not claim to have that many answers. Perhaps, we as expats, should not even comment at all about life in Vietnam. The prevalent culture is a result of wars and destruction and who knows how families have struggled very hard to survive, in the aftermath. Like you said, if both parents knock off, it's a real sad case. I suppose that deep down in every expat's heart, we look at things here and feel drawn to be a 'change agent'. But, really its up to the citizens to seek their own survival niches. We only lament at the way they do it, and feel sorry they have to resort to unethical ways to get things done.(what is ethics anyway?)  But the survival of the fittest is the name of the game. This is not really an open society and God forbid, who are we to tell them what to do..