Potential Budget

07/10/24 @lalajaja.  Good morning.  A monthly budget of a little over US$3600 should serve a single person very well indeed in any Brazilian city, and Curitiba is far from being the most expensive one.  You'll undoubtedly have to shift funds from one "pocket" to another from time to time and not be TOO extravagant (too often, anyway), but there's enough room in your budget to enjoy all that the city has to offer without having to obsess too much about funds.

@lalajaja as the unofficial Outlier for Expat.Com my journey was different.  I built my house for about $20k USD on my wife's property in Northeastern Brazil and I gave her $20k USD (which she only used a portion of) to buy a 2022 I think it was Chevrolet Sedan. We have no debt and only pay for electricity (which includes internet) and our two caretakers each month.  We are debt free.

I would also like to know more about your "Visa Stuff" - $35" What Visa are you speaking of and what is that amount for, especially on a monthly basis.

Roddie in Retirement

@abthree Thanks, that's helpful.

It's very hard to know how much is really enough. I've been to Brazil multiple times, but living somewhere long term is so different from visiting. You will hear locals say that a small amount is enough. Everyone is different of course, so there's no true final answer. I've been doing a lot of research though using numbeo and anything else I can find.

Were you able to determine an accurate budget before you moved?

@roddiesho That's supposed to be to cover visa renewals and processing fees, etc. It may be way off, I'm not even sure.

07/10/24    @abthree Thanks, that's helpful. Were you able to determine an accurate budget before you moved?        -@lalajaja

No, I didn't bother with much detailed budgeting because I had a pretty good idea of what costs were and I knew how much money I'd have, since I was moving here permanently.  I and several other members broke our 2022 costs down by category in this thread:

https://www.expat.com/forum/viewtopic.p … 52#5385529

Mine haven't changed much.  Doing a search on Cost of Living on the Forum page (https://www.expat.com/forum/viewforum.php?id=511) will show you more current threads with the same title.

The amount that you're considering is equal (at today's exchange rate) to over thirteen times the Minimum Salary for 2024, and well within the top two  categories into which Brazilian statisticians group national income, so it should be more than ample for one person.

What kind of visa will you be coming on?

@lalajaja In that case we need to ask the expert...@abthree .... since it's all Greek to me.

I would also like to know more about your "Visa Stuff" - $35" What Visa are you speaking of and what is that amount for, especially on a monthly basis.

@roddiesho That's supposed to be to cover visa renewals and processing fees, etc. It may be way off, I'm not even sure.

Roddie in Retirement    '

@lalajaja

I live in a large house on the beach of a tropical island in NE Brazil, and it does not cost me that much per month! So I am sure you will be fine.

But what visa are you thinking of applying for? Your long term immigration security is of as much importance as your budget.

@abthree I saw those posts. Thank you for taking the time to do that breakdown.

My understanding is that I can get a retirement visa based on the assets I have in my investment accounts. i.e. my IRA, etc. I have enough to generate the income for my living expenses for the length of my retirement.

I know the retirement visa is typically geared toward people with a fixed pension, but I saw a youtube recording done by an immigration attorney there in Brazil who said it can be done this way. According to him, the government is mostly concerned that you have the means to cover your expenses.

@Peter Itamaraca Please see my response to abthree above.

   07/11/24 @abthree I saw those posts. Thank you for taking the time to do that breakdown.
My understanding is that I can get a retirement visa based on the assets I have in my investment accounts. i.e. my IRA, etc. I have enough to generate the income for my living expenses for the length of my retirement.

I know the retirement visa is typically geared toward people with a fixed pension, but I saw a youtube recording done by an immigration attorney there in Brazil who said it can be done this way. According to him, the government is mostly concerned that you have the means to cover your expenses.
       -@lalajaja

My reading of the law agrees with yours, but I'm not aware of anyone who has made use of the Retirement Visa while still younger than about 60, so I'll be very interested in your progress.  The old Retirement Visa definitely had an age requirement and the current one does not; your biggest challenge could end up being institutional memory, with some officials remembering the age requirement of the old law and assuming incorrectly that it carried over to the current one.

As several of us have written, your planned budget is ample for a pleasant life anywhere in Brazil.  You're in a fortunate situation that may let you establish a lifestyle that satisfies you at a lower cost than you anticipate now.

@lalajaja Please keep in mind the inflation in Brazil in your planning. And then there is the uncertainty of currency exchange rates. Others here may offer you advice on financial strategy.

@alan279 Thanks for your reply. How would you recommend thinking about inflation in Brazil over the long term if your income/investments are in USD?

I’m not qualified to offer financial advice, but some members of the forum may suggest some strategies on living in Brazil with inflation and currency exchange fluctuations.

07/11/24   @alan279 Thanks for your reply. How would you recommend thinking about inflation in Brazil over the long term if your income/investments are in USD?      -@lalajaja

Brazilian inflation and the USD/BRL exchange rate at the individual level are largely independent variables, although they're related at the macroeconomic level.  While both fluctuate up or down, the general trend of Brazilian prices is to gradually rise in BRL terms, and the Dollar tends to gradually strengthen against the Real, so the tendency is for them to offset each other.  The net impact for my husband and me is that for the past seven years, I have been able to transfer a constant number of Dollars to Brazil every month, and if anything, our standard of living has actually improved over time.  Naturally  our spending patterns have changed, but more based on changing tastes (and changes imposed on us by the pandemic) than on price levels.

There will always be months when the Real is especially strong, so it's a good idea not to spend your WHOLE income every month, and to keep some in reserve to tide yourself over those periods.  Over that past 80 or so months, I've had to make a withdrawal  at an ATM from my US account maybe six times to make it to the end of the month, never for more than US$250.  So barring a major crisis, managing your finances at the level you're planning should not be much of a problem.

My wife and I live on half your budget in Copacabana in Rio de Janeiro. We own our condo so no mortgage or rent payments, just condo fees and electricity. We easily have money left over.

When I moved to Brazil in 2008 the exchange rate was 1.6.

I lived in a big oceanfront apartment in Ilhéus for ten years. Rent was R$600 per month in 2008. When the building was razed in 2018 to make way for a four lane highway I was paying R$800 per month. An unusual situation, it isolated me from feeling the real inflation in Brazil for ten years.

The rent on my current apartment with a partial ocean view has gone from R$1.100 to R$1.500 in six years.

That's $376 CAD you pay....my condo fees on the apartment I just sold here in Canada were $545 alone......with a mortgage you'd pay well over $2000 CAD a month..........6 x as much as Brasil.

@Gasparzinho 777 And how much is your energy bill?

Depends on the season. In winter it's around R$100.......summer can cost R$300 a month as we use AC to sleep at night when it's over 30+........we're rarely ever home though during the day, and as our apartment has great natural lighting, the only electricity draw is an empty fridge, TV or AC.

@Gasparzinho 777 How much is your energy bill in Canada?

It's included in my condo fees.......gas, electricity, water......all covered.

@Gasparzinho 777 I've always had a great time when I've visited Rio and it's on my list of places to consider. It's a huge city with amazing beaches which is really rare among major cities in the world. I know Brazil has other cities with great beaches, but I believe they're all much smaller.

It seems like a lot of people online recommend looking outside of Rio or SP (which I also enjoyed visiting) for long term living purposes. I think the biggest reason for this is the perceived high cost, but it sounds like you're doing very well on a lower budget which is great to hear.

Sure, I can live in a multi-million Reais beachfront cobertura on Atlantica.......but why ?

Rio is an experience to be lived in 24 hours a day........it's not Miami.......unless you live in Barra de Tijuca kkkkkkkkk

There are two price structures......one for gringos and one for Cariocas......don't be a gringo.

@Gasparzinho 777

My house, if you are referring to my comment, is certainly not in the multi million real category (unfortunately), but, given time, who knows? !!

The point is, there are huge price-range options for real estate investments in Brazil - from really cheap to super-expensive, and everything in between!

And that's my point too. You can make the big cities as expensive, or as cheap, as you want them to be.