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Real estate and moving (Burgas)

cdw057

Me and my wife live in Turkey now for more than 4 years (before living in the Netherlands, UK, Luxembourg and Hungary, but Ikamet (residence permit extention is like a damocles sword on our heads. We consider moving to Bulgaria (Burgas), buying a property is always serious business, price is one factor, but after sales is also important (perhaps even equally). I do not like these big platforms like Bulgarian properties and as soon as ReMax appears it is already a no go. Considering my limited mobility, we want an appartment/penthouse (definitely not a duplex) in Burgas (close to Sea Garden), and with amnetities close by (restaurants, supermarkets, markets, hospitals, ..). Chess would be of much interest as well for me and my wife.

Requirement, minimum 120m2, minimum 3 bedrooms, max price EUR 280.000.

Apart from the big platforms could you point me to a good real estate agent?

See also
JimJ

I don't know what "after-sales" you're looking for but there isn't really much you're likely to want (or get) following the purchase of an apartment.  You're asking for a "good estate agent" but you're already excluding the big players.  Any "after-sales" will involve a lot of money or a massive amount of goodwill from the broker. You also need to be aware that there are no "estate agents" here like you may be used to in other parts of Europe: you either buy direct from an owner or via a broker.  Either way, you have essentially no come-back if there's a problem with the property or the documents.


Generally speaking, first- and top-floor apartments are avoided by local buyers - the bottom floor is too accessible for burglars (yes, even in closed complexes with "security") and the top floors are liable to problems with the roof leaking or requiring maintenance.  In principle, the roof is every owner's joint responsibility but there's no real way to force the other owners to cough up their share for major repairs (or even the annual maintenance fee, ongoing cleaning costs etc etc); all too often they regard a leaking roof as the problem of whoever is directly underneath it. It's also very common for owners, local and foreign, to be "uncontactable" when it's time for annual maintenance payments or, even worse, repainting the block/repairs to lifts etc. That's not to say that you shouldn't buy a penthouse but be aware that what is supposed to happen very often bears no resemblance to what will. If you can, try to buy in a block where there is no maintenance company or maintenance charge; you're actually more likely to find that your neighbours are prepared to chip in when the time comes, in my experience.  Also bear in mind that the best medical treatment in the country for serious problems is in Sofia; people from all over the country invariably end up there when the chips are down.


I lived for years in a fancy closed complex and was on the management board; I would never repeat either experience...I guarantee that you wouldn't believe the goings-on there!


I'd also say that if you're looking for a "premium" property ("luxury" complex/sea views etc) of the size you describe in Bourgas you'd be looking at a rather higher price range than you mentioned...

cdw057

Thanks a lot, I suppose in Turkiye we were just very lucky.

JimJ

You'd have been lucky here a few years ago but the market's been frenetic for a while now; we've had several property bubbles over the years, usually accompanied by prophecies of price collapse; they've never come to pass. There'll be a dip for a while, after the prices have become unsustainable, and then they'll rise even higher...

gwynj

@cdw057

As @JimJ says real estate after sales is off the table here. Although I'm not actually quite sure what you mean, I reckon that in most places once you've purchased a property it's your problem. :-)


I'm also not sure why you object to the biggies. Usually, they're big because they're good. Even if you don't want to do the deal through one of the big guys, they're great for the initial research to see what you can get for your money in a particular area. I'd say BulgarianProperties (dot com) are good, as is Imot (dot bg), and Property (dot bg). You could also use RightMove which is a big UK portal with international listings, and they have a pretty good Bulgarian selection, many of which are offered by some of the smaller agents which you might prefer. Alternatively, you can go to OLX, which is a big listing site for Bulgarian owners and agents and is popular with the locals. But I'd say it's tougher to make a deal here, so it wouldn't be my first choice (although I have used it, and it's also good for research).


I would say, unfortunately, you might be disappointed. Turkey is still, I believe, cheaper than Bulgaria for both cost of living and property purchase. If you've got a fancy penthouse on a beautiful Aegean beach, you'll have a tough time thinking you'd made a good swap to a Bulgarian apartment on the Black Sea. I used to live on the Med in Cyprus, and I would love to have stayed beachside, but I was just grossed out by the Black Sea... and decided I'd go to Plovdiv instead, and just have a bigger city with easier access to mountains, Sofia, culture (former European Capital of Culture), and international travel.


However, I applaud your location choice (and your taste in apartments). Burgas is a good, large city, and being next to the Sea Garden is a fab location. But as indicated by @JimJ, this is getting into premium territory, especially if you want new (ish), big(ger) and penthouse-styley. I didn't even check the listings, but I reckon the nice stuff is already 3k euros / m2 and up in Burgas. (As that's around the ballpark in Plovdiv, Bulgaria's 2nd largest city.) You probably have to up your budget, or get a smaller/lower/older apartment, or look outside the city.


You can also go Sea Garden in Varna, but that's even more expensive. Personally, while I'd prefer Burgas Sea Garden, I reckon I might be able to find something interesting in maybe Sozopol (very nice town just south of Burgas). Or maybe one of the suburbs/exurbs of Burgas (such as Sarafovo, next to the airport) or Varna (such as Saints Constantine & Helena).


If you do decide to do a search, please note Bulgarian real estate is sold a bit differently to Turkish apartments. In Turkey (from what I've seen) they sell ready apartments, even when new. In Bulgaria, older apartments are (usually) ready, but new ones are sold as Bulgarian Standard - a concrete box for you to finish off (needing time and money). A new apartment at 2k euros / m2 will need another 500 euros/m2 (or so) to finish off. Also, the m2 here included a pretty significant chunk of common area, so if you really need 120m2 internal space (and 3 bedrooms) you're looking more like 140 or 150 m2 of gross area (per the listings)... or more like 450k euros (150 x 3k/m2), as my guesstimate. (And they usually don't include parking, so you also have to factor in your 20k per parking spot.)


Even worse, Bulgarian is not heavily into these larger apartments (i.e. 3 or 4 beds, 150m2 +) as they're not easy sells. There's a lot more folks wanting a one bed or two bed. This adds scarcity value to the equation too, especially if you then narrow it to the penthouses. By coincidence, my two posh mates in Plovdiv have exactly this kind of property, 3 bed/2 bath, 150 m2 ish penthouses, well furnished, in desirable city centre locations (one overlooking the Maritsa river, the other looking directly at Youth Hill). But pretty sure they'd be expecting 500k-ish (if they were keen to sell).


This is rarefied territory, and most Bulgarians would not spend that on a fancy apartment (even when they have plenty of dosh), as they'd prefer to spend such money on a house somewhere nearby (e.g. Markovo about 10km outside Plovdiv, in the foothills of the Rodopes). Some might also consider Bulgaria's "panel" blocks (communist era, I doubt they exist in Turkey, but you've probably seen them elsewhere in the former Eastern Bloc countries). These old buildings can look a bit shabby on the outside, but they often have pretty central locations, and they have generous helpings of green space and parking spots (i.e. don't have to buy one), and the flat's m2 doesn't include much common space (i.e. it's nearly actual interior). You can get big apartments, and inside they can be renovated to look like new.


I love Bulgaria, and I'm very happy here. But property has gotten pretty pricey. Turkey's pretty nice too, so you might just be getting a bit of grass is greener syndrome. Just give it a few days to pass. :-)

gwynj

@cdw057

For giggles, here's a very large 2 bed, looking out of over the Sea Garden. Only 1.15m euros (parking for 3 cars charged extra).

https://www.alo.bg/luksozen-dizainerski … e-10880966

cdw057

@gwynj

My physical condition is so so, and I do not drive a car anymore, hence the preference for centre of Burgas it odes not need to be a penthouse, but minimum 120m2 and a bit modern would be fine, minimum 3 bedrooms.

cdw057

@gwynj

I ran your reply through AI and it largely agrees your post and views (thank you again).

cdw057

@JimJ

Since three years there is a dip in Alanya/Mahmutlar, driven by cost, residency permit and closed districts. Also the relationship with Russia is also less than a few years ago. I hope the bubble will grow again. Neverhteless we bought at the right moment (end of 2021)