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Legality of a foreign car in Belgium

AndresGonnzalvez
#1
Hello everybody,

I have one legal problem with my car, its an spanish car, and I have it in Brussels since two months. I had one day one problem with police, who told me I had to change the residence of the car to Belgian's papers. Due to my unemployment situation I can´t afford to do that in that momment, so I decided to park it untill having changes in my financial situation.

Now I have received a letter from the police(for a police hearing-"audition" in french)so I have to pass there.

So that, I would like to know what are my rights of having a car stopped in the street without using(I am not driving it until deciding to do the belgian papers) even if its spanish plate.

Have someone been in a similar situation?

Any advice will be welcome.

Thanks in advanced,
Andres
See also
S
#2
We spent about 100 euro to re-plate our car, the change of lights (UK car without ability to change lights direction like on new mondels) cost us an awful lot more, with a Spanish car you shouldn't have that problem unless it originates from the UK, Ireland, Oz etc.

If your car is on a public street, whether it is being driven or not, plus you have moved to Belgium, you have I think 6 months to change it to Belgian tax and insurance. If you are within the 6 months, just do it now or move the car back to Spain. Leave it any more and Vehicle Licensing will fine you and the fine will increase and increase.

To be honest, you really don't need a car in Brussels, if you aren't working, unless you have a specific reason like you are disabled and cannot move around with public transport or by bike or on foot.

I'm afraid you are OBLIGED to re-tax if you want to keep your car here. We didn't do it immediately. We were orginally subject to a 300 euro fine. Work and residence is not even in Belgium but we didn't fancy arguing and in the end the fine was reduced to 50 euro for re-taxing immediately and conforming and being apologetic.
hannahhadman
#3
Ok i am in the middle of doing mine. Your are ment to have 6 months to change ur plates. You need your ownership papers and a cert of conformity that you have to get from your own country. It cost me 100 pounds go get it. Then you have to take the car to the local import place were you have to have your car put through a technical then you can get your plates and then retax insure etc. However insurance here is really high. If i were you with no job get rid of the car
S
#4
We got our certificate of conformity for free from Volkswagen UK, brought it with us when we moved.

You only need to put your car though the "controle technique" if your car is a certain age, think it's over 3 years, not certain, as our car is 7 years old, we had to do ours and do it every year. It's not very expensive.

Our insurance costs 3 times what it would do in the UK.
hannahhadman
#5
Yeah citoren charged me 100 for my cert also from uk. I guess it dep on the car company but yeah my insureance is also a joke to
hannahhadman
#6
well got all papers for car however couldnt find out how to tax the car however ive also never had a letter like others have

(Later that day lol) So appently now its registered the tax people will send me a letter on taxing my car
the_blob
#7
Hi all,

I have a question about driving a car with foreign (non EU) license plates in Belgium.

I'm somewhat of a special case and I can't find a definite answer anywhere. I even sent emails (5 days ago) to DIV and an insurance company in Belgium, but didn't get an answer yet. :(

Here's my case:
- I'm employed by a Croatian company and I reside in Croatia
- we work with a Belgian company and that requires me to stay in Belgium for 5 months in a year (not all at once, usually in periods of 1 month)
- due to that, I also have a work permit and a residence in Belgium
- the car is registered in Croatia to my name (not a company car)

Can I travel to Belgium by that car and drive it over there for 1 month before i return to Croatia (and repeat that for 5 times in a year, roughly every second month)?

Importing and registering that car in Belgium is, of course, out of the question because my permanent residence is in Croatia and I spend more time there.

What are your thoughts? :)
S
#8
If you are going to register yourself at the commune, then unfortunately for you, you will have 6 months to re-register your car in Belgium. It's irrelevant to the Belgian Customs that you see your primary residence as Croatia, if you are also a resident of Belgium, then you must re-register the car. It' also irrelevant that you can prove the car is mainly in Croatia. There's no argument. If you don't re-register and get caught, possible big fine. Was in identical circumstances (except not Croatia, another European country). I must say, given your circumstances, I would possibly chance it, if caught then if you at least re-register quickly, the fine is more likely to be reduced.
Sorry.
the_blob
#9
Damn...

I didn't register yet at the Town hall (just recently got a work permit and a visa), but I will have to do it soon because I was told that I'm obliged to do so. Otherwise I won't be able to prolong my work permit after one year.

So, in theory, I can drive a car with Croatian license plates for 6 months after my registration at the commune. Well, that's still better than nothing...
hannahhadman
#10
Yeah you have 6 months however I would make sure u start doing it by about 4 months as it took me quite some time to get it done. Given you have to find insureance and then get them to stamp it and then take it to the DIV be prepered for a long wait at the DIV. As well as the technical etc it can all turn very time comsumeing very quickly. Good luck with it
hannahhadman
#11
Also clearly things are a little different in Brussels than here in rest of Flanders. I never had a warning after over a year I have only just got my car tax letter. They seem to hassle a lot more in Brussels although the downside was getting information was difficult.
S
#12
No they do Customs and Police stops, that's the only way any Belgian authority can catch you driving a foreign car which should have been re-registered. A few tips :
if where you live, you don't need a parking permit and you're driving a foreign car, well don't get one! If you do get one and your caught and over the 6 months since arrival in Belgium and have gone and got a parking permit, well then you can't exactly deny the car has been there for the same time!

You could make enquiries to start the re-registration process, keep whatever forms you need when starting in the car, it will give the impression of imminent re-registration.
hannahhadman
#13
Yeah I ment i just got non of these warning letters and I have only just been sent the letter to tax my car last month so it was still on uk Tax for around a year and a bit. I guess it could of been as i traveled back to uk a lot. However Im glad mines all done and over. But I did have problems making sure I had all papers etc. My insureance broker at one of the fintro banks was really helpful in getting me most of the infomation
hannahhadman
#14
I had also been using a parking permit card thingy (the blue one) from day one but i got that of someone
S
#15
The blue disc is not a parking permit with your name on it, I'm talking about a parking permit which is traceable to an address. If you claim you have just imported the car and in fact Police enquire with the commune where registered and find you've been in possession for a parking permit for your car for the past year, then you're going to be in trouble.
hannahhadman
#16
Ah okies well never needed one of those but good to know
the_blob
#17
Well, I won't need a parking permit so that's one worry less. :)

Also, as I said earlier, re-registering a car in Belgium is not an option because I spend more time in Croatia and my work in Belgium probably won't last longer than a year or two. So. I'll probably use my own car in the first 6 months and then go back to traveling by plane and using a rental car in Belgium (an option I hate because I'm very limited in the amount of stuff I can bring with me on a plane).

schoolmum, that's not a bad idea. I can get the registration forms, fill them in and keep them with me in the car. :)
cyclingdave1000
#18
Well this is all very interesting to me, and frankly I am amazed at the over zealous approach being attributed to the Belgian authorities, but then I am pretty new here.

I have recently had my motorbike here from the UK, it's just gone back for it's MOT and service and a new UK road tax disc.

I didn't get a parking permit, because I've never seen one on a motorbike and I had no issues (parked it on the pavement with a cover on overnight).  Am I right in thinking that I should have declared that I had it here up front and got it re-registered?  I'm due to be here until the end of the year, and the bike will likely be staying at home now due to (hopefully not too soon) impending autumn and winter weather.  There's no way that if I do end up staying longer (into the spring and next summer) I will be re-registering it regardless- I'd rather leave it at home.  Very glad I decided never to bring my car now, though that was due to observing the number of parking dings and scrapes on every car I see in Brussels more than anything else!! :D
S
#19
The rule is quite clear, it's 6 months from arriving to live here. Yes it seems over-zealous, but it's effectively tax evasion. Many people manage to avoid being caught, I know someone here 15 years who has managed to avoid ever being stopped, but I wouldn't like to be in their shoes if and when it happens.
cyclingdave1000
#20
I don't see how it can be tax evasion, I'm paying tax for it in the UK and they are both in the EU, but I'm not going to argue over the technicalities as I'm sure you know what you're talking about. Whichever way I look at it I have done nothing wrong.  I'm within that 6 months, the bike was only here for 2 (a condition of my UK insurance is max 90 days on one trip) and is likely never to be here again if I do finish at the end of the year as anticipated, but thanks for the information anyway :cool:
S
#21
Well I don't think Belgian Customs are going to agree with the tax evasion and they'd argue that UK regs say any vehicle outside  the 12 months when resident elsewhere are no longer eligible to tax their vehicles in the UK.

I don't like this system either, when people are effectively resident and working in 2 countries, being in the same position. But Belgium claims your car as theirs.
cyclingdave1000
#22
It's definitely one of those grey areas, I am a bit like the guy from Croatia above in that I'm working here for now, but don't consider myself 'resident'. My car and bike are normally in the UK and will continue to be UK registered, I will just need to be careful how long they spend 'abroad' I guess.

As I say it's unlikely to be an issue for me as the good weather is unlikely to continue right up until December, and motorbikes don't play well with rain and ice and snow.  After that I should be working elsewhere - or some serious reconsidering may need to be done! :rolleyes:
S
#23
The Belgian Customs do not see any grey area at all. If you have a Belgian residents' card and you have brought your car to Belgium, you are liable to tax it here if it stays longer than 6 months from its first "entry" yes even if it is taken back to another country in between times. If your vehicle is here less than 6 months, well then that's fine. At 12 months outside the UK and officially resident somewhere else.
hannahhadman
#24
To be honest if i were you i would just stop driving it and fly if u dont want to get caught. They love fine books here
cyclingdave1000
#25
Well I now know. I see lots of 'foreign' registered cars here in Brussels they can't all be visiting or recently arrived...

Once again rules are toughest if you play by them. So much for freedom of movement within the EU! :rolleyes:
S
#26
Anyone can move throughout the EU freely, so long as they abide by the laws individual to each country and so long as they carry with them proof that they are an EU national, as non EU nationals (except those with EU family member treaty rights) do not have this freedom of movement, another misconception that you no longer need a passport/national ID. There now, I'm becoming and old woman, putting the world to rights!
hannahhadman
#27
Also i hope u have ur refecltors on or light changed reflective vetes frist aid kit fire extsher triangle etc and all ur car papers in ur car
S
#28
OH Hannah you've forgotten the 2 breathaliser kits you now have to have when travelling over the border to France. Here's a little side-story, France started fining Belgian plated cars for speeding July, whereas Belgium hasn't got its act together yet and has yet to start fining French and Dutch cars, which apparently make up the vast majority of fines not so far imposed on foreign plated cars. So beware with Belgian plates, the cameras in France will catch you now! Oh and I know for fact that the French Police at sea ports actively pick on foreign plated vehicles, actively fine them because they are foreign, not because the officers are themselves racist but because they are given targets and at the end of the month, if they haven't made up the targets, the foreign drivers are easy catches and less likely to give grief. I'm not making that up.
hannahhadman
#29
Id give geif lol. But i have to admit i didnt no the breathaliser one. I best look that one up
S
#30
It's ok, us foreign vehicles have till October to get the breathaliser kits for France. Self breathalisers??? I haven't got my head around the reasoning yet, as if you've had a drink, you'll know you've had one, surely that means you just won't drive, why would you need to test yourself for alcohol levels?
hannahhadman
#31
I from what i read before its if you have had a bear or wine with a meal or earlier in the day you can make sure ur allowed to drive alot of people like to push the limit . I saw something about it but only saw it was advised not the law. But yeah i found it online that it came into law in July. I dont go bk to uk for ages through france but ill be making sure to pick them up before then. Just to find somewhere here that sells them.
cyclingdave1000
#32
But the idea was that you can move AND work freely. These smack of being obstacles to that. How many people want to re-register a car when they are going to be somewhere for 6 months, and then back again when they go back home. It just makes it much harder to do, and means more people are likely to try and 'get away with' not complying.

Anyway I think we agree that it's harsh, but rule is rules eh :/

Btw even motorcyclists are supposed to carry the breathalysers in france.. Though IMO anyone who gets on a motorbike after having a drink has more to worry about than whether they are slightly over the legal limit!
hannahhadman
#33
Nope UK is not Singling territory so you can no travel freely
hannahhadman
#34
Not usually depends on the size of the engine  http://seniortravel.about.com/od/europe … riving.htm this is the article i read
hannahhadman
#35
sorry Schengen thats why there isnt free movement in then uk
hannahhadman
#36
Also theres the article on your free movement rules to be fair it is very free compared with tring to go to america have u ever done that http://www.blurtit.com/q923217.html
S
#37
Free movement has nothing to do with Schengen, it's EU + EEA countries (which are Norway, Iceland, Liechtenstein) + Switzerland.  There is freedom of movement in all these countries, but only for nationals of these countries and any EU/EEA/Swiss family members which non EU/EEA/Swiss who travel on special free visas if travelling to non Schengen countries and will usually be aware of their rights to free travel and the difference between freedom of movement and Schengen than most EU nationals!

Schengen is different to freedom of movement, it's a visa list and inner borders free of border checks, but still you have to carry naitonal ID for random border checks. 5 members of the EU are not part of Schengen or have yet to implement Schengen borders : UK , Ireland, Romania, Bulgaria and Cyprus. In addition, 4 non EU countries ARE members of Schengen : Switzerland, Iceland, Norway and Iceland. It means the outer borders stay around these countries, but freedom of movement still applies, you just have an obligatory ID check instead of a random one in Schengen countries.
S
#38
Freedom of movement has never had any connections with the vehicle you are driving! It's a concept of moving the person, not car or bike or train, these are simply methods of transport.

but there is no legal obligation to re-register a car when it's here for under 6 months.
the_blob
#39
Can someone maybe find a quote directly from the Belgian law which defines that "6 months rule"? I don't speak Dutch or French so it's hard for me to google it. :(

I'm asking this because It's not completely clear to what exactly are those 6 moths referring to.
Is it 6 months after you register at the commune? Or 6 months after the first entry of that car to Belgian territory? Or if that car spends more than 6 months in a year on Belgian territory. Or some other 6 months...
S
#40
No it's 6 months after entry of the car. And no it doesn't mean 6 months one country, 6 months another.

I know someone who works in another EU country, pays taxes and social security there, spends more days there, he is married to someone legally resident in Belgium, has therefore to have legal place of residence as Belgium even though only there for holidays (unless you go to court to request permission to legally live elsewhere), the car unfortunately has to be taxed in Belgium and insured too!

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