Blacklisted?

Apply for a visa and see what happens.

colinoscapee wrote:

Apply for a visa and see what happens.

May i recommend that you apply at the San Francisco Consulate, even if you are not on the West coast.    They offer both loose leaf visas or send in your passport and have it glued in.  They are much more responsive than the Embassy in DC and will answer phone queries.  That said, I would not give them your story; just apply.  If you are OK with the loose leaf by mail you can apply online.

https://vietnamconsulate-sf.org/en/home/

Agreed, I plan on telling no one in the Vietnamese government anything even close to this. Quite frankly I'm a bit fearful and wouldn't even tell a typical Vietnamese citizen. But thanks

bottomofthemap wrote:

Hey all, I recently left Vietnam among the corona crisis for my home in the U.S. and am wondering if I'm blacklisted. My boss had possession of my passport before my departure and was using it to extort me for money and claiming this was necessary for a sudden leave of absence before my planned return in August (suprise, it wasn't!). I got the passport without the payment and made it back home to the U.S. but I'm wondering if I'm blacklisted since we left on bad terms and he never got the money. How would I officially check that and if I were blacklisted what does that mean if I were to try and return?

Were you fully legal with the government working for this guy?  Did he file a work permit for you, withheld taxes from your salary, didn't pay cash under the table and everything?  Or were you working under the table?

The fact that he was holding your passport and that he tried to extort money from you leads me to believe that you weren't working on the legal side of things.

Were you working on a tourist visa?

THIGV wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

Apply for a visa and see what happens.

May i recommend that you apply at the San Francisco Consulate, even if you are not on the West coast.    They offer both loose leaf visas or send in your passport and have it glued in.  They are much more responsive than the Embassy in DC and will answer phone queries.  That said, I would not give them your story; just apply.  If you are OK with the loose leaf by mail you can apply online.

https://vietnamconsulate-sf.org/en/home/

vietnamconsulate-sf. org/en/2017/05/11/visa/

This is the direct link to the online visa application interface.

SteinNebraska wrote:

bottomofthemap wrote:

Hey all, I recently left Vietnam among the corona crisis for my home in the U.S. and am wondering if I'm blacklisted. My boss had possession of my passport before my departure and was using it to extort me for money and claiming this was necessary for a sudden leave of absence before my planned return in August (suprise, it wasn't!). I got the passport without the payment and made it back home to the U.S. but I'm wondering if I'm blacklisted since we left on bad terms and he never got the money. How would I officially check that and if I were blacklisted what does that mean if I were to try and return?

Were you fully legal with the government working for this guy?  Did he file a work permit for you, withheld taxes from your salary, didn't pay cash under the table and everything?  Or were you working under the table?

The fact that he was holding your passport and that he tried to extort money from you leads me to believe that you weren't working on the legal side of things.

Were you working on a tourist visa?

If you (OP) do answer "yes", beware that Visa rules were already changing.

In the future, even if you have a multiple month tourist Visa, you will be limited to 30 days "permission to stay" at a time.

According to my agent, the prime reason for doing this is to catch and stop illegal English teachers.

Every time you exit and re-enter on a border run, immigration is going to be taking a closer look at your situation, asking you specific questions about employment.

If you do come back on a tourist visa:

1. Make sure your tourist visa is changed to a 1 year business visa, with your employer as sponsor, and insist they pay the fee to get this done as a condition of accepting employment.

2. Get a written contract for at least 12 months of work.

3. Make sure the employer completes and pays for their work permit for you before 90 days of employment have expired.

Taking care of those three things will keep you legal, without the need to do border runs, while becoming eligible for a bank account AND ready to apply for a Temporary Resident Card.

Anyone want to hazard a guess on whether their will be a follow-up post from the OP? 

SteinNebraska wrote:

Anyone want to hazard a guess on whether their will be a follow-up post from the OP?

We've got to stop telling people the truth if we want them to hang around longer...

OceanBeach92107 wrote:

If you do come back on a tourist visa:...

No, no, no! There is a 'golden rule' EVERYONE should heed - ANY employer who asks a foreign employee to enter a country for the purpose of employment on a tourist visa is a shyster and a crook. If the employee agrees to enter on a tourist visa, they are putting themselves in jeopardy in more ways than they can probably imagine (depending on the country).

A legitimate employer will do the 'leg work' (and probably pay) to make everything 'above board'. A legitimate employer will always have the employee enter on a work visa.

DO NOT enter a country on a tourist visa for the purpose of employment. Period.

cruisemonkey wrote:

OceanBeach92107 wrote:

If you do come back on a tourist visa:...

No, no, no! There is a 'golden rule' EVERYONE should heed - ANY employer who asks a foreign employee to enter a country for the purpose of employment on a tourist visa is a shyster and a crook. If the employee agrees to enter on a tourist visa, they are putting themselves in jeopardy in more ways than they can probably imagine (depending on the country).

A legitimate employer will do the 'leg work' (and probably pay) to make everything 'above board'. A legitimate employer will always have the employee enter on a work visa.

DO NOT enter a country on a tourist visa for the purpose of employment. Period.

I agree IF the person is coming based on a firm offer of employment.

I was assuming the OP has no such offers, and would be returning to seek a new employer.

He can do a job search on a tourist visa and then follow the steps I recommended.

Or are you also saying no one should come here to work without first having a confirmed offer of employment including sponsorship of a business visa?

OceanBeach92107 wrote:

Or are you also saying no one should come here to work without first having a confirmed offer of employment including sponsorship of a business visa?

In the case of ESL employment, entry on a confirmed offer maybe represents 5% of all hiring and that could be too high an estimate.  The reality is tourist visa>job search>job>work permit>TRC or business visa with some overlaps between segments.  Many employers may be willing to assist with the WP but still need you to start the next day which does put the teacher in some jeopardy for being outside the rules.

THIGV wrote:

OceanBeach92107 wrote:

Or are you also saying no one should come here to work without first having a confirmed offer of employment including sponsorship of a business visa?

In the case of ESL employment, entry on a confirmed offer maybe represents 5% of all hiring and that could be too high an estimate.  The reality is tourist visa>job search>job>work permit>TRC or business visa with some overlaps between segments.  Many employers may be willing to assist with the WP but still need you to start the next day which does put the teacher in some jeopardy for being outside the rules.

I'm sure you are correct about the 5 percent figure.

As I understand it, 90 days of employment is allowed without a work permit.

I've assumed that's to give the employer time to get it fully approved.

The question I've heard more than once:

Can that initial 90 days of employment be done while on a tourist visa?

It should be a moot point:

Any Visa agent can usually get a VOA letter of approval issued within a matter of a few days.

I've even seen 24 hour approvals advertised.

So a local employer should be able to assist a new hire to get their visa changed within 72 hours by working directly with local immigration.

As long as the employer is providing a legal letter of sponsorship.

I arrived on a 3 month visa with the agreement that I'd have a resident card before my arrival visa had expired. A couple weeks before the expiration they instead did a visa extension but that may be due to the changes in visas amid corona. My employer changed course and claimed we'd get a resident card in August and extend my visa until then.

As for the contract we did it was 12 months and outlined that they'd assist with anything visa related.

bottomofthemap wrote:

I arrived on a 3 month visa with the agreement that I'd have a resident card before my arrival visa had expired. A couple weeks before the expiration they instead did a visa extension but that may be due to the changes in visas amid corona. My employer changed course and claimed we'd get a resident card in August and extend my visa until then.

As for the contract we did it was 12 months and outlined that they'd assist with anything visa related.

Based on what you just said, your ex-employer is a crook

OceanBeach92107 wrote:

bottomofthemap wrote:

I arrived on a 3 month visa with the agreement that I'd have a resident card before my arrival visa had expired. A couple weeks before the expiration they instead did a visa extension but that may be due to the changes in visas amid corona. My employer changed course and claimed we'd get a resident card in August and extend my visa until then.

As for the contract we did it was 12 months and outlined that they'd assist with anything visa related.

Based on what you just said, your ex-employer is a crook

Yep.

The good thing is, you probably won't be blacklisted.  For that to happen the people that were trying to illegally hire you would have to report you.

That's like calling the police to report that someone broke into your house and stole your cocaine.  You should be fine to come back.

That is, unless the guy that hired you does have a friend in immigration and he just wants to screw with you just because he can.

SteinNebraska:  You are lucky you didn't put any hard currency behind your forecast in post #8.   

Magic 8 ball does not know all...

I suppose it could be hard for my boss to report this but I'm struggling to think that I was not hired under the correct paperwork. Our English center supplied all the schools in our town with their English teachers and was very chummy with the leaders of the province. Before Tet the local party leader came by our offices for an official visit and my boss works in and has strong governmental connections. As an example 2 of our teachers were about to leave for a vacation on Tet and realized they hadn't gotten their resident cards yet, our boss forgot to do that for them. Last minute, less than 48 hours before they're departure he was able to call up a friend in the government and get them each a 1 year multi-entry visa. And this was right before the busiest time of the year. If he wanted to call up a friend about me I feel he could.

The ultimate truth is that you will never know by just asking on this forum.  Post #2 pretty much sums it up.  Apply and see what happens.

bottomofthemap wrote:

I suppose it could be hard for my boss to report this but I'm struggling to think that I was not hired under the correct paperwork. Our English center supplied all the schools in our town with their English teachers and was very chummy with the leaders of the province. Before Tet the local party leader came by our offices for an official visit and my boss works in and has strong governmental connections. As an example 2 of our teachers were about to leave for a vacation on Tet and realized they hadn't gotten their resident cards yet, our boss forgot to do that for them. Last minute, less than 48 hours before they're departure he was able to call up a friend in the government and get them each a 1 year multi-entry visa. And this was right before the busiest time of the year. If he wanted to call up a friend about me I feel he could.

You should also consider that the issuance of a visa in your home country means very little in that only cursory checks are done, mainly to clear Interpol and terrorist connection lists etc etc. You will not really know until you present yourself to immigration on arrival, it is only then that any minor objections to your entry or possible arrest are flagged up.
Why not go and teach somewhere else ?

I'm very seriously considering teaching elsewhere. I liked Vietnam and am interested in going back but the more I look into it the more risk I feel I'm putting on myself. I might have to look elsewhere

OceanBeach92107 wrote:

SteinNebraska wrote:

Anyone want to hazard a guess on whether their will be a follow-up post from the OP?

We've got to stop telling people the truth if we want them to hang around longer...

Who's we?