New Taxes are coming to finance all that stimulus spending!

So what will be taxed?

Practically Everything we directly/indirectly consume!

Pension payouts may just not be enough to see us through our old age!

Was only discussing this with my wife last night.

I do agree that something will need to be done to recover the lost balance sheet.  How they will do this, is the question.

As we are aware they have just raised a considerable amount ($2.35 billion USD) of funds through the sale of government bonds.  They needed it as they only had another month to go with available funding for there SS projects, how much of this money will be left after SS payments will be interesting and pin the whole future economy, having said that the bonds were over subscribed.   If people (Organizations) external to the Philippines are prepared to buy these bonds, at low coupon rate, which they have, external investors have some faith in the future of the Philippines and that the Philippines will be able to pay the bond yields.  I would be interested to know who these bonds were bought by.

Of course the Philippines, as any country needs to, will have to be able to pay the Bond's yield, and would be hoping for news business to be established here, or back to step one and raise taxes.


Old sayings on increasing taxes in a 3rd world country:

*   If you want to see an economy stall and even fail, increase business taxes.  This will of course put people out of work and drive the economy into a worse situation, without external funding.

*   If you want to see people starve increase the tax on low income earners.

*  If you want to lose the next election increase the tax on the rich.

Increasing any of the above taxes will make it more expensive here. 
Increase foreign business tax, will drive away foreign business.



We are no where close to seeing the financial impact of COVID on the Philippines or the rest of the world for that matter. 

i.e. will your home country still be able to pay the pension at the same rate in 12 months time as they do now?  Of course they don't have to drop the current payments, just not increase them to have the same effect.


Over all, i believe the Philippines and other 3rd world countries will either:
Slip back 15 years in time or sell themselves to China, i think that the 2nd is more likely.

Interesting times ahead.  Wait it out and buy up the cheap house's in 3 to 9 months time when the banks call in the debt's.  Or head back home and do the same.

*  If you want to lose the next election increase the tax on the rich.

In many countries thats exactly what they intend to do....hold elections "NOW" during this covid 19 crisis so as to secure a mandate & then when the dust settles all the bad news/
taxes/revised pension plan will be reset!

pej1111 wrote:

Was only discussing this with my wife last night.

I do agree that something will need to be done to recover the lost balance sheet.  How they will do this, is the question.

The answer is simple, print more money, deflate the value of currency. Pay back old hard debt with new soft debt.

So all your savings of old, will have less purchasing power.

Wait it out and buy up the cheap house's in 3 to 9 months time when the banks call in the debt's.  Or head back home and do the same.

This will be ugly for many overleveraged  but a great time for other prudent investors!

W9XR wrote:

pej1111 wrote:

Was only discussing this with my wife last night.

I do agree that something will need to be done to recover the lost balance sheet.  How they will do this, is the question.

The answer is simple, print more money, deflate the value of currency. Pay back old hard debt with new soft debt.

So all your savings of old, will have less purchasing power.

Valid point!

W9XR wrote:

pej1111 wrote:

Was only discussing this with my wife last night.

I do agree that something will need to be done to recover the lost balance sheet.  How they will do this, is the question.

The answer is simple, print more money, deflate the value of currency. Pay back old hard debt with new soft debt.

So all your savings of old, will have less purchasing power.

Yep back to my final point,   ***  "Over all, i believe the Philippines and other 3rd world countries will either: Slip back 15 years in time"

Mate if they print more money here and deflate the PHP, i will be sooooo, very happy.  Yep ready to snatch up the properties with the my overseas $$  Of course the cost of import good's go up, but everything else goes down for us with foreign $$. 

Sad to say it will not good for the Filipino's but good for us.

pej1111 wrote:

W9XR wrote:

pej1111 wrote:

Was only discussing this with my wife last night.

I do agree that something will need to be done to recover the lost balance sheet.  How they will do this, is the question.

The answer is simple, print more money, deflate the value of currency. Pay back old hard debt with new soft debt.

So all your savings of old, will have less purchasing power.

Yep back to my final point,   ***  "Over all, i believe the Philippines and other 3rd world countries will either: Slip back 15 years in time"

Mate if they print more money here and deflate the PHP, i will be sooooo, very happy.  Yep ready to snatch up the properties with the my overseas $$  Of course the cost of import good's go up, but everything else goes down for us with foreign $$. 

Sad to say it will not good for the Filipino's but good for us.

Sorry Mate. . . . The whole world will be printing money . . . . what makes anyone believe the other guys money will deflate but not your own? After the reshuffling (worldwide) you'll know better where to place your bets.

The 15 years slip back won't be much different than Jan 2020 was in the Philippines.

W9XR wrote:

pej1111 wrote:

W9XR wrote:

The answer is simple, print more money, deflate the value of currency. Pay back old hard debt with new soft debt.

So all your savings of old, will have less purchasing power.

Yep back to my final point,   ***  "Over all, i believe the Philippines and other 3rd world countries will either: Slip back 15 years in time"



Mate if they print more money here and deflate the PHP, i will be sooooo, very happy.  Yep ready to snatch up the properties with the my overseas $$  Of course the cost of import good's go up, but everything else goes down for us with foreign $$. 

Sad to say it will not good for the Filipino's but good for us.

Sorry Mate. . . . The whole world will be printing money . . . . what makes anyone believe the other guys money will deflate but not your own? After the reshuffling (worldwide) you'll know better where to place your bets.

The 15 years slip back won't be much different than Jan 2020 was in the Philippines.

The reason i believe the Philippines will change and may have to increase taxation (somewhere) is that the PSEi decreased 28%, since the start of 2020.  This is the 2nd largest drop out of all the Asian countries, only second worst to Lebanon.

During the same period (Start of the year till today)
My person investments down 7.2%
The ASX down 16%
DOW down 8.4%
S&P down 1.3%
NASDAQ 100  UP 14.6%

https://tradingeconomics.com/stocks


The Philippines have already increased there national debt with the sale of the Bonds, which a country only does if it needs to raise capital, of course this money must be paid back.


They are the main reason i am thinking that Philippines is looking cheap in the coming 4 to 12 months and will slip back further than (Australia, America, UK)

As for the increase in taxes: the above affects the value of the PHP and the employment rate in the Philippines.  Which takes me back to my opening comment on this thread, about if the Philippines will increase taxes or not.

As for printing money, if every country does it then all will be equal, this then goes back to the above to points on this stock market and debt, which will impact the Philippines standard of living, which flows on to funding infrastructure building = loss of jobs = lower house prices.

I do love this country and hope for all the best for it, but things are not looking good here economically.


In the end only time will tell.

All I know is that the US dollar against the PH is falling. Hope that trend doesn't continue much longer.

Tim_L wrote:

All I know is that the US dollar against the PH is falling. Hope that trend doesn't continue much longer.

From 2012 to 2013 The peso average was 40.5 per dollar, today 50.5

W9XR wrote:

Tim_L wrote:

All I know is that the US dollar against the PH is falling. Hope that trend doesn't continue much longer.

From 2012 to 2013 The peso average was 40.5 per dollar, today 50.5

1994 it was 25 pesos/US $

Exchange rates aside...
As of 2018, a total of USD 25.8 billion was sent home by OFWs. Of this huge amount, remittances from the US accounted for a whopping $9.6 billion..Now Philippines is planning for a "bounce back" stimulus package to lift the economy out of the damage caused by the pandemic...not sure how strong a bounce you are expecting with millions of OFW's being laid off overseas!

manwonder wrote:

Exchange rates aside...
As of 2018, a total of USD 25.8 billion was sent home by OFWs. Of this huge amount, remittances from the US accounted for a whopping $9.6 billion..Now Philippines is planning for a "bounce back" stimulus package to lift the economy out of the damage caused by the pandemic...not sure how strong a bounce you are expecting with millions of OFW's being laid off overseas!

Yep it will be tough, considering that many OFW have been brought back to the Philippines with repatriation flights, so zero income, that ones that remain in countries such as the US will also contribute less with the exchange low US to PHP exchange rate.

The new house is looking good if you have cash.

I am sad about the Filipino's though, of course the rich Filipino's will also be buying up bargains, from houses to small business.

pej1111 wrote:

manwonder wrote:

Exchange rates aside...
As of 2018, a total of USD 25.8 billion was sent home by OFWs. Of this huge amount, remittances from the US accounted for a whopping $9.6 billion..Now Philippines is planning for a "bounce back" stimulus package to lift the economy out of the damage caused by the pandemic...not sure how strong a bounce you are expecting with millions of OFW's being laid off overseas!

Yep it will be tough, considering that many OFW have been brought back to the Philippines with repatriation flights, so zero income, that ones that remain in countries such as the US will also contribute less with the exchange low US to PHP exchange rate.

The new house is looking good if you have cash.

I am sad about the Filipino's though, of course the rich Filipino's will also be buying up bargains, from houses to small business.

Maybe even an Island!

pej1111 wrote:

manwonder wrote:

Exchange rates aside...
As of 2018, a total of USD 25.8 billion was sent home by OFWs. Of this huge amount, remittances from the US accounted for a whopping $9.6 billion..Now Philippines is planning for a "bounce back" stimulus package to lift the economy out of the damage caused by the pandemic...not sure how strong a bounce you are expecting with millions of OFW's being laid off overseas!

Yep it will be tough, considering that many OFW have been brought back to the Philippines with repatriation flights, so zero income, that ones that remain in countries such as the US will also contribute less with the exchange low US to PHP exchange rate.

The new house is looking good if you have cash.

I am sad about the Filipino's though, of course the rich Filipino's will also be buying up bargains, from houses to small business.

Looks like I can save bandwidth with the two quotes above and Tim L.

(Tim L  and Manwonder)  say USD against PHP is falling. Myself I see no significant change in the exchange rate.

(PJ 1111 sees a increase in taxes) The taxation base in the Philippines has more holes than a pound of Swiss Cheese. Ever hear of a Sari Sari store paying or charging/paying a tax? The government stifles foreign investment to create a meaningful tax base.

(Manwonder  bounce back stimulus? ) I don't see how you can have a bounce back with the debt digging a bigger hole with no end. The light at the end of the tunnel has gone out. Pretty soon the paper to print money will be more expensive than the note you are printing.

Another order was delivered from S&R today, half the order was out of stock, the half I would really liked. I had the family make a list of what they would like......hahahaha, now we have a lifetime supply of White Cheddar Cheese Popcorn, Cheetos, Pringles, Potato Stix and M&M's.

Someones view :

https://sg.finance.yahoo.com/news/comme … 59174.html

Taxes by any other name:

Petrol (gas), diesel

https://www.facebook.com/13475247667844 … 550530785/


Increase in Phil Health:

https://www.onenews.ph/now-voluntary-fo … ll-members

Just read yesterday, that to bring some more money back into the economy, after COVID and to help raise a universal health system, the President is looking at raising taxes on Alcohol, Cigarettes, Soda's (Soft drinks for us Aussies), and car's (not sure how, perhaps through registration or a sales tax).

In 2019 the ‘Sin' tax collections almost double to P269.1-B

He has a direction of a healthy society and thus removing unhealthy products.

Not good for the smoker's (me) and the drinker's (mild me) but who can blame him if he does this.

As a goodie two shoes (Don't drink, don't smoke, what do you do?) who does not drink soda either I am not going to be feeling the increases too much.  We do have and use a van.

mugtech wrote:

As a goodie two shoes (Don't drink, don't smoke, what do you do?) who does not drink soda either I am not going to be feeling the increases too much.  We do have and use a van.

LOL currently i do smoke and drink, when i don't, i do triathlon's and fun run's.  1st place in iron man triathlon (team event) last year   and sub 60min for 10klm fun run's.  After COVID i will be off the smokes and back into training.  At 58 we have to keep living and been part of the community.  Otherwise, there is not much to do in retirement, OK i don't play golf, destroys a good walk.

pej1111 wrote:

Not good for the smoker's (me) and the drinker's (mild me) but who can blame him if he does this.

Exactly!!!....fret not...Expat Smokers/Drinkers (mild/heavy) and those with avail spare cash/coo interest free loans (if lucky!)...offset any sin tax increase here by simply going on a FIRE SALE shopping spree...wif the weaker peso for anything you ever wanted like used motorbike/car/
land/house/hotel rentals/cheap airflight promo galore/travel packages/maybe even a island!
More than enough to offset any price increase...so just bring it on!!!
Can't wait to go shopping!
Yipppeee!!!

I am teaching myself not to worry about taxes. I am trying to see how far my 401k will take me to enjoy the remaining enjoyable years of my life. I ain't saving for someone else.

pej1111 wrote:

LOL currently i do smoke and drink, when i don't, i do triathlon's and fun run's.  1st place in iron man triathlon (team event) last year

You are Tony Stark?

Guys I think NOW is a good time to go shopping!
Just went on a "Fire Sale" shopping mall trip (runs till end Aug) & got the following :
'Sharp' Inverter No Frost Fridge (7.0 cu.ft) 14000p (SRP: 19999p)
Acoustic Guitar 1600p (SRP : 2600p)
Semi-Leather Football 169p (SRP : 399p)
Giordano collar T-shirts 150p (SRP : 380p)
Plastic Storage Stack Up Boxes 40 litres 150p (SRP:299p)
Looks like most items being sold/cleared are NOT being replenished.

Sin Taxes:

Pack of Marlboro in Sydney AU     $24.00 USD
Pack of Marlboro in Philippines    $  2.22 USD

One liter Absolute Vodka Australia $46.53 USD
One liter Absolute Vodka Lazada     $22.58 USD

Now 40% of Filipinos don't have bank accounts, consider all the Sari Sari stores and other small businesses on a cash basis, Taxes?

Enzyte Bob wrote:

Sin Taxes:

Pack of Marlboro in Sydney AU     $24.00 USD
Pack of Marlboro in Philippines    $  2.22 USD

One liter Absolute Vodka Australia $46.53 USD
One liter Absolute Vodka Lazada     $22.58 USD

Now 40% of Filipinos don't have bank accounts, consider all the Sari Sari stores and other small businesses on a cash basis, Taxes?

I am not sure what your comment is about??

If you are saying a pack of Marlboro, etc. is cheap in the Philippines, then we need to take into account the  big picture, not just isolated statements.

Let me explain:
The average income in Australia is $82,000, AUD
The average income in the Philippines is $7,800 AUD

So on a ratio of Marlboro to income, the Marlboro are over priced here.  I could not agree more.

pej1111 wrote:

Enzyte Bob wrote:

Sin Taxes:

Pack of Marlboro in Sydney AU     $24.00 USD
Pack of Marlboro in Philippines    $  2.22 USD

One liter Absolute Vodka Australia $46.53 USD
One liter Absolute Vodka Lazada     $22.58 USD

Now 40% of Filipinos don't have bank accounts, consider all the Sari Sari stores and other small businesses on a cash basis, Taxes?

I am not sure what your comment is about??

If you are saying a pack of Marlboro, etc. is cheap in the Philippines, then we need to take into account the  big picture, not just isolated statements.

Let me explain:
The average income in Australia is $82,000, AUD
The average income in the Philippines is $7,800 AUD

So on a ratio of Marlboro to income, the Marlboro are over priced here.  I could not agree more.

I see your point and it makes sense, but on the other hand  price difference is "Tax" not the cost of producing the item.  Higher taxes discourages smoking and is a cover for more revenue.

The idea that the Philippine government doesn't tax cigarettes because it's a third world nation and the people are poor. . . . . .  Well what a benevolent Government.

The cost of one pack of Cigarettes in the Philippines could buy 3 Kilos of rice.

The cost of one pack of cigarettes in Australia cold buy more than a Kilo of finely carved schnitzel of topside beef.

If the Philippines did follow the lead of Australia, they would have a little more tax revenue and a healthier country.

Back to my original post, with a cash society tax revenue is not reported.

The Philippine government allowed casinos in the country to generate revenue (taxes) and jobs. But if they increase the price/tax on cigarettes and alcohol, people will not have something to help them relax, chaos ensues.
Is it a necessary evil?
Sweden for example has a high alcohol tax, so they have party boats that go just beyond the international border then sells the drink to passengers, no tax. Nice.

Where i live...the average income was hardly 500p/day before the onset of covid 19.
The locals here hardly smoke & even if they did it would be some cheap local brand & definitely not marlboro.
Everyone here does consume alcohol, but  then again it would not be Absolute Vodka rather it would be tanduay rhum on special occasions or the cheaper 'kulafu'/'bootleg'/other much cheaper local brands.
Philippines is also planning to close some of her major oil refineries & instead go just into oil storage.
(mainly due to the cost effectiveness of refining here, with crude oil prices having taken such a massive hit.)
So the only hope will be Tourism which had better re-start at all costs real soon!

manwonder wrote:

<snips>

Where i live...the average income was hardly 500p/day before the onset of covid 19.

The locals here hardly smoke & even if they did it would be some cheap local brand & definitely not marlboro.

Everyone here does consume alcohol,

A little off my own topic:

Before I came here I lived in Las Vegas, the two most popular casino's for Asian's were the Gold Coast Casino and The Hotel California Casino, both low rollers casinos, both off strip. The Asian's chain smoke and drink free booze like it's going out of style.

Now, Resorts World is building a Las Vegas Asian themed casino, the first phase will cost $4.3 Billion USD, the additional phases up to 7 Billion. Project has 8 million sq feet on 87 acres with a 16,000 sq meter casino, also 4 towers with 6,648 rooms.

Enzyte Bob wrote:

manwonder wrote:

<snips>

Where i live...the average income was hardly 500p/day before the onset of covid 19.

The locals here hardly smoke & even if they did it would be some cheap local brand & definitely not marlboro.

Everyone here does consume alcohol,

A little off my own topic:

Before I came here I lived in Las Vegas, the two most popular casino's for Asian's were the Gold Coast Casino and The Hotel California Casino, both low rollers casinos, both off strip. The Asian's chain smoke and drink free booze like it's going out of style.

Now, Resorts World is building a Las Vegas Asian themed casino, the first phase will cost $4.3 Billion USD, the additional phases up to 7 Billion. Project has 8 million sq feet on 87 acres with a 16,000 sq meter casino, also 4 towers with 6,648 rooms.

A good point...Philippines should re-start tourism asap & as a prioriry, the casino's should first be re-zoned duty free & for foreigners only!)...this time round they should offer 2packs of free cigarettes & 1ltr alcohol when a certain amount of pesos are exchanged to playing chips...rest assured the business will boom with our ever faithful asian gamblers (especially if more low roller Baccarat tables are included!)

If it's a Chinese free zone, count me in. Seems that all the big gambling places in PH are China owned. I'm definitely not looking to help them further their ambitions at this point.

Tim_L wrote:

If it's a Chinese free zone, count me in. Seems that all the big gambling places in PH are China owned. I'm definitely not looking to help them further their ambitions at this point.

I have gambled in two casinos in Niagara Falls, Ontario Canada. Both Casinos are owned by Ontario Lottery & Gaming Corp. So they benefit from all the taxes & profits. (No free booze or meals)

Many years ago I visited the Casino in Niagara Falls, New York. While talking to the Pit Boss he bragged the Casino was built on borrowed money from Malaysia. He said despite the 25% interest, the casino is making money hand over fist.

A side note: When visiting the Casino on the New York side I was Decked out in a Jacket & Cap from Caesars Palace (Las Vegas) hoping to make an impression . I sat down at the blackjack table, put down Five $100 bills and asked for chips. This got the Dealer & Pit Boss attention.

After playing low stakes for two hours, I hinted to the dealer about a comp for lunch. He called over the pit boss and he comped me to the Thunder Buffet (Prime Rib & Snow Crab legs) Shortly afterwards I left the casino.

I tried the same stunt about a year later. After the request the pit boss came over and whispered in my ear: With all the gambling on your last trip and gambling on this trip, you still have negative points. So I asked him how much gambling should I do. He said $25 a hand for Four Hours.

For you not familiar with Casino Comps (Complimentary) You join the players club and they keep track of your gambling. For example you insert your card into the slot machine and they measure the coin in.
Typically they reward you with 1/4 of 1% for slots, poker machines & table games even less.

If you are a big gambler they even assign a casino host to you. You may have several hosts in different casinos all vying for your business. You simply call your host and ask what they can do for you, comped rooms, meals and special requests.

Before moving to Vegas I had a casino representative in my home town. He arranged a discounted room at the Luxor. Several months later I called him to see what he could do for me in Atlantic City. He said I'll call you back in a few minutes. He called back and said the Luxor said you didn't gamble. I said: WHAT, I LOST $900 IN THREE DAYS. He replied that's not gambling.

Enzyte Bob wrote:

While talking to the Pit Boss he bragged the Casino was built on borrowed money from Malaysia. He said despite the 25% interest, the casino is making money hand over fist.

If only anyone (chinese included) could borrow funds from me at 25% interest guaranteed...life would have meaning once again!

manwonder wrote:

Enzyte Bob wrote:

While talking to the Pit Boss he bragged the Casino was built on borrowed money from Malaysia. He said despite the 25% interest, the casino is making money hand over fist.

If only anyone (chinese included) could borrow funds from me at 25% interest guaranteed...life would have meaning once again!

There are no guarantees, only collateral and a legal struggle to collect it.