Is Libya Getting the Worst End

Hmmm....

Not sure I understand the post, but, for my part I am here to do a job that noone else wants to do, and get out as quickly as possible. Simple as that really. I've been loyal to my company for 20 years. Have worked in Asia, US, Lebanon, etc. etc., and as the saying goes "you have to take the rough with the smooth".

...and so far (3 months in) - it's rough

I was half hoping that Libya would be something like Lebanon - somewhere that most non-savvy people pity you for going to but that turns out to be a wonderful 'secret' location that you always volunteer to go to (being a good company man and all that )...

But there are some positives, and we concentrate on those. Errm, Sun, Money, more sun, more money....

To answer your question: Alcohol is not the problem for us ex-pats. The problem is finding Family friendly places to go, and avoiding the Maniac young men that are so frustrated with life here that they drive like psychopaths to vent their testosterone.

How's that song go? "Things can only get better..."

Reading comments on this forum on a regular basis i really don't understand why you people choose to work in Libya.This forum is jam packed with negativity on different aspects about Libyan life,i'm sure things can be frustrating at times etc but seriously,if you think life there is so shit just leave ,comments on the forum give a very bad impression of Libya and i for one would be turned off ever setting foot in the country if i had to go by ex pat comments.

Mo, are you trawling again ?. You will certainly get a few bites with this post I would imagine, me included. I am not here for the money (I am on a pitiful wage), I am here because it is my first opportunity to work abroad, and to be honest I love it here. Yes it has it's issues, but I deal with them in my own way, and I find the positives outweigh the negatives (in my opinion). But I have only been here 6 months, maybe I am missing something, or maybe the people who post all the negative crap about Libya, should as a previous poster suggested, piss off somewhere else, and annoy people in say oh Scotland, where your chances of getting into a fight on any given Friday or Saturday night are quite high, and where if you leave your front door open you will likely get burgled, or where you will be rained on all the time, or where you will get taxed heavily for everything including the bloody water you drink, or where you pay way over the odds for everything, and get little quality in return. Do you want me to continue mate, or are you starting to see the picture ?.

singstar wrote:

if you think life there is so shit just leave

A typical comment from the great uninformed.

Sandman6 wrote:

singstar wrote:

if you think life there is so shit just leave

A typical comment from the great uninformed.

After what I have just gone through re multiple exit/entry visa request with my ER department (they refused, even though my manager had signed the form) I might want to completely reverse my previous statement

singstar wrote:

comments on the forum give a very bad impression of Libya and i for one would be turned off ever setting foot in the country if i had to go by ex pat comments.

An interesting 1st post. Welcome.
Some of us here are serial expats, having lived & worked in many places other than our 'home' countries. Such a privilege allows us to base our opinions upon a wide range of experiences and be able to make our comparisons accordingly, rather than just between here and our country of origin.
Part of the purpose of the Forum is to offer advice, information and opinion. If it helps someone make a decision either way about  coming here, then it's served its purpose. Sugar coating it, putting some whipped cream and chopped nuts on top and lighting a wee sparkler will help no one.

And yes, Mo was trawling. Again.

MoEl wrote:

typical signs of lower socioeconomic classes..
..so low on the intellectual and professional scales

Having a bad day?  That's quite a lot of slating for one post...

Sandman6 wrote:

A typical comment from the great uninformed.

And the award for the most patronising comment of the day goes to.....

blahblah wrote:

Sandman6 wrote:

A typical comment from the great uninformed.

And the award for the most patronising comment of the day goes to.....

Your username just about sums you up

Know what? I wish I hadn't given this post the dignity of a reply. But I naively believed this forum is here for ex-pats, and not locals that could be offended by our frankness at times. People need to know what they are letting themselves in for by coming to Libya. If we censor this channel, you'll just have more hacked off foreigners here than you have already.

You're totally right. If you don't like it, and you don't need your job anymore, you can just p1ss off... but some of us need our jobs

As mudman points out, we are serial ex-pats, and as I said, we have to take the rough with the smooth. I have to spend a year here and will try to enjoy it as much as I can - but they certainly don't make things easy in this respect.

There's a lot to be said for leaving the UK, I did for all the reasons that Clansman listed in his posts. Britain is broken if you ask my opinion (no retaliations please - it's just my opinion).

In a free country everyone has their right to voice their opinions (within reason). Perhaps its just that those that have their roots here (eg. MoEl) find this so difficult to understand - but I'm sure the real 'ex-pats' here understand.

I think the biggest culture shock for us has been the attitude to the female sex here. No more to say on this subject but when I suggested to the (Libyan) guys that I work with that we get the families together for a bbq, they thought I was crazy. Men mixing with women ???? How very dare you!

I've been to a few local BBQs so far and I've never experienced anything so sad. All men. No music, all sitting around a bottle of Miranda, plenty of chicken, hours and hours of just sitting on the grass talking (probably bollox), with the odd comment in English to make you feel part of the great evening. Local weddings are even more fun

We were genuinely very grateful for being invited, and they have very big hearts, but I think I'll give it a miss next time

What was I saying? Money, sun, more money....

think about those foreign migrant laborers!

Sandman6 wrote:

Your username just about sums you up

If only your humility was as volumous as your breasts

Jejejejeje, this is getting funny...

On a positive note, if you bring your families here you'll have more quality family time that you could have dreamed of.

I get through the working day sometimes just thinking about 3.30 when I can get home and jump in the pool with the kids.

See? It's not sooo bad Thank you Libya.

Anyone else add something positive?

This was the beginning of a divine manifestation.

This, I suspect, will be the first stage of me coping with the fact that the majority of our world isn't as methodical nor as predictable as I had hoped--a new phase of growing up if you will.

For someone who has worked in only one country, this is as significant an experience as....well, it's like finding out that Santa Claus is a lie; or like beginning to understand what "fiction" means and accepting that a distinction must be made between it and the other, more inevitable, yet not as exciting thing called "reality".

In Kansas, Nebraska, Iowa and Missouri you only get few weeks, if any at all, of weather like that of Tripoli yesterday. Gorgeous here! Right?

Walk down a half-decent residential street and you will smell jasmine all over, even though Spring is long gone. If I only can annex the city and its suburbs, exterminate all bad drivers and tobacco consumers, including ALL Iveco's, replace them with beautiful, athletic Japanese and Brazilians and mandate advanced HVAC in all buildings. Those without must be demolished and their designers and builders impaled inquisition-style.


Meanwhile:

Kasoo, your post #11 is a bit ambiguous. To whom was it directed?

Mud- and Clansmen, I was not trawling. Look at my avatar--wearing a suit this time! I really wanted to hear what others think.

And I don't mind getting bitten--my teeth and jaws are as strong as the next guy's, that's IF I wanted to bite back. Ask Sandman.

FlipFnger, no. My days are always wonderful. Short of a nuclear war, nothing gives me a "bad day".

An unashamed lover of 'a bit of a challenge...' and a serial ex-pat, I was surprisingly thrown by the offer of a job in Libya and have spent much of the past month vacillating about accepting the post. Reading the posts on this forum has been educational and entertaining but hadn't really pushed me to decide either way...
MoEl's post caught my eye - whilst quite obviously a bit of a fishing expedition, it really did raise some interesting responses and actually helped me decide! Aside from all else, i'm all for annoying my neighbour when needed so MoEl - i'm headed your way to be yet another ex-pat filled with ennui, low intelligence and minor professional talents. After all, having lived in many countries to which i have no real 'connections' i have valuable experience from which to draw!

serial ex-pat sounds really cool. Like "expat" is something to be "sinisterly plotted" and "committed". kinda like "jihad"

"hey buddy, I dont like you blowing cigarette smoke in my face, Im gonna go all expat on you"

lovedmydaisy wrote:

think about those foreign migrant laborers!

why?

MoEl wrote:

serial ex-pat sounds really cool. Like "expat" is something to be "sinisterly plotted" and "committed". kinda like "jihad"

"hey buddy, I dont like you blowing cigarette smoke in my face, Im gonna go all expat on you"

You are defo going to replace my friend Sandman on this board as the focal point of entertainment, 'don't go changing' as the old song goes my young friend.

( Reading comments on this forum on a regular basis i really don't understand why you people choose to work in Libya.This forum is jam packed with negativity on different aspects about Libyan life,i'm sure things can be frustrating at times etc but seriously,if you think life there is so shit just leave ,comments on the forum give a very bad impression of Libya and i for one would be turned off ever setting foot in the country if i had to go by ex pat comments. ) i like this comments very Much ..

Clansman wrote:

MoEl wrote:

serial ex-pat sounds really cool. Like "expat" is something to be "sinisterly plotted" and "committed". kinda like "jihad"

"hey buddy, I dont like you blowing cigarette smoke in my face, Im gonna go all expat on you"

You are defo going to replace my friend Sandman on this board as the focal point of entertainment, 'don't go changing' as the old song goes my young friend.

Off to NG1 for the rest of the world cup....then


but like a bad smell, I'll always be around

If you don't like Libya , why you still here ? Money of course
you have to be thankful ,
here in Libya you can work , and the most important saving money
things are cheap , no tax ,

thanks for Libya , and hope you leave soon ,
i would love to help you find new destination

Sandman6 wrote:

Clansman wrote:

MoEl wrote:

serial ex-pat sounds really cool. Like "expat" is something to be "sinisterly plotted" and "committed". kinda like "jihad"

"hey buddy, I dont like you blowing cigarette smoke in my face, Im gonna go all expat on you"

You are defo going to replace my friend Sandman on this board as the focal point of entertainment, 'don't go changing' as the old song goes my young friend.

Off to NG1 for the rest of the world cup....then


but like a bad smell, I'll always be around

Gone but never forgotten

...i'll try to move across this as i would cross a Cambodian booby-trap infested rice paddy...

<<>> 

i guess the issues at stake are the following:

1.Moe is tweaking badly and needs a fix asap

2.Quality of "life"/mere existence versus compensation.

3. the freedom of complaining about the above mentioned for everyone, expats and non-technically expats ( "local-expats" from here on ). 

n.b. the great majority of the "local" expats represented here don't fit in their own country and deal with many of the expat's problems of living here, if not more and on a deeper level concerning issues expats ain't aware of ( or even would care to know of there existance )
The point is, a "local-expat" ( a local that has had the fortune to live and grow up abroad, but then had the misfortune to come back, regardless of all the good things he/she has learned abroad don't apply, and all their views and insights don't apply to the environment, and being despised by the locals for having their opportunity growing up abroad while they were stuck in this crap hole )and the list goes forever...
oh not to mention being humiliated by being labeled and treated
( and compensated ) the same as a home-grown local.
add on top of that being derided by one's nationals for every speech mistake made
( not very encouraging to make the big jump, and it is intended as so ) cause that's the only thing that makes the home-grown locals feel better about themselves versus those who lived abroad substantially. 

Oh, and let alone finding a decent better half, if it is better than being alone for eternity. i'm saving this argument for another time.

It is only natural that a "local-expat" takes the piss in this virtual space for so much misfortune.   

basically you have a bunch of people,that might have had a local background for most of their life up until yesterday, and perhaps have had a superior education, as most if not all "local-expats", crying about this and that when they HAVE a choice to leave and ARE paid ridiculously for the same job
( few exceptions apply for few specialists/technicians ) that if the "local-expat" were to perform would get paid peanuts. 
So the local expat's choice is either to rot at home, or go for the peanuts. 

Just to give you a clear example, from my experience, and i'm going to use hard cold numbers, the same one's the convinced me and my dignity to leave.

For the job i was performing, i was offering to the fullest my language skills in 3 foreign languages ( including english )
20 years of study abroad in the most exclusive institutions and locations, international work experience with multinational companies.
i performed my duty and relative responsibilities to the pleasing of the company all the way to the mother office where i was sent often for various job related activities.
i was compensated 600 euros a month.

The same exact position, filled by a foreigner, that has never left his hometown, not a word of foreign language, graduated from a local public school, performing same duties and responsibilities, was given housing,transportation etc.
and hold on to your chairs ladies ( if any ) and gentlemen
was compensated 12,000 euros a month.

needless to say that it was a high management position we are talking about here. 
but the discrepancy based on nationality if far from absurd, not the amounts in per se'.

So going back to where it all started, there are "local-expats" that are being crushed far more than you can imagine in every possible field ( professionally & socially), yet they have no choice, are subject to the same issues that most expats here refer to, but have nowhere to complain or to be heard, let alone being briefly understood or being fairly compensated so as to afford an iPhone to keep in touch with virtual friends abroad or a nice vacation every once in awhile to compensate for the endless gaps surrounding them.

i was going to give the microphone to Sandman, but i think i'll pass and direct you straight to the refreshments area right behind you.

To memes : you are pretty shamless to set foot here and flaunt about it.
What more can you ask for ? Having the chance to make more money here than anywhere considering ur capabilities plus you get to nag about 24/7 and look like a hero who managed to surivive the regata accomodation or zanzour  Vila and the shoping at mango in gergaresh.
An outstanding example of living beyond one's means and being praised for it during the occasional break from nagging.
My suggestion is to keep your head in ur world, cause the minute it pops out, I'm sure someone will stick his/her foot in there.

redsaraya wrote:

To memes : you are pretty shamless to set foot here and flaunt about it.
What more can you ask for ? Having the chance to make more money here than anywhere considering ur capabilities plus you get to nag about 24/7 and look like a hero who managed to surivive the regata accomodation or zanzour  Vila and the shoping at mango in gergaresh.
An outstanding example of living beyond one's means and being praised for it during the occasional break from nagging.
My suggestion is to keep your head in ur world, cause the minute it pops out, I'm sure someone will stick his/her foot in there.

Actually mate - the renumeration is far less than anywhere else i've work and, if i choose to work somewhere - i don't whinge about the stresses, after all, i chose to be there. My job is far more exciting than just money - it's an opportunity to be involved in something that, if i do it correctly, will have a direct impact on people's lives. How can that compare to a salary?!
I think that you are forgetting that this is a social site meant to help people connect with those who are in similar situations share advice, experiences and support. Not, as it seems to have deteriorated to, an outlet for the vitriol and  personal peeves of your daily life.
As for accomodation - if it's worse than some places i've lived i will eat my virtual hat!
I apologise if you took offense Redsaraya - none was intended. In fact, the tone was aiming for mild (to moderate) sarcasm, teasing and self-depreciation. Verbal sparring... A truly enjoyable English past time!
On a more serious note, this is not my first time in a country where salaries and treatment afforded is dependent on nationality - we are not as blind or as self centered as you seem to believe. We don't make the system. You have a beautiful country filled with history, culture and identity, can you not accept that in part we are here to experience this as much as you appear to have experienced elements of our cultures? Everyday my work reinforces to me that whilst it is our differences that make life truly exceptional, it is our similarities (at a very base level) that allow us to live whether we like it or not.
also.... this head in ur world thing? i don't get it....?