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'False' Visas Warning! They Allow it + You Get Fined!

Hi,
    I was sent this yesterday + thought I'd better spread the word concerning this latest grubby + shameful example of what we're exposed to by the total free-for-all the unregulated + state sponsored
'Visa Circus' foreign nationals in Vietnam have no choice but to get involved with. The fact that a visa extension can't be obtained by the subject him/herself is already placing that individual in a position where there is little that can be done to protect themself from all manner of dishonest + underhand sharp practice, the system as it is could quite reasonably be described as, is an open invitation to exploit any foreigner unfortunate enough to walk through the door. What the update, below, describes highlights this perfectly + begins as these transactions always must do, surrendering the most important document any foreign national possesses, namely, their passport, to a ''visa agent''. Visa agent is the very broadest of terms as the truth is that anyone with hands with which to take your passport, + a pocket to put it into, can call themself a 'visa agent', 'a person' is no more, or less, an accurate description. This 'person' then hands your passport over to some other 'person', in the update this 'other person' is unmasked + revealed to us ensuring he'll have nowhere to hide, we're told that he turned out to be someone who was working with the knowledge, or possibly without the knowledge, of someone who used to work, but no longer does, at the immigration office. Like I said, he can run but he can't hide! What also comes to light is how he came to be viewed as superior to all the other no doubt equally well qualified professionals, though unlikely to have the kind of inside-man connection our guy could offer, or ex inside-man, come to think of it, but what really swung it for him is that he simply won't be beaten on price, one of those guys that set the bar, he was the cheapest! This paved the way for as many as 1000 passports to find their way into the stamping department, where the stamp is + where events somehow allowed passports to be stamped, but not registered online, as this having ever being done. From the information we have my guess, that might explain how this could have gone on without being noticed, was a mass brawl involving the immigration guys, who we're told had, indeed, been fighting each other. This could, of course, be a perfectly legitimate inter-office boxing round robin, or maybe a Fight Club type of affair, my gut says it's more of a rivalry based, sporadic outbreak type fighting that can, on occasion, say, mid-afternoon post wet lunch when 2 guys settling a score can end up like a bar fight in a Dodge City saloon, this is speculation on my behalf as I know no more than the update provides. All that remains for me to point out is that in all the scandalous betrayal of duty + office the information provided shows exists, from top to bottom at every level, the only mention of anything that even suggests wrongdoing, or any type of punitive measure, are when 'fines' are spoken of, large + hefty, we're told + that seems only fair to me. Until I see who it is that these fines are possibly going to be imposed on, to the uninitiated it would beggar belief, the uninvolved could be forgiven for laughing, I'm due to extend my visa soon + the idea that my current stamp wasn't registered + some bully in a uniform penalising me as if a single shred of responsibility could be placed on my head, which aside from pure fantasy, it most definitely could not be, the idea of that is one I'd think would cause a less even-tempered fellow, than myself, to perhaps engage in a frank exchange of views with a border official who was trying to impose a fine. The strong ''coward gene'' I got from who knows where would no doubt kick in + prevent me from that kind of exchange, I'm sure is inevitable for some other folk, though, if there really are over 1000 victims + you start punishing them, the only truly innocents in the whole sorry affair, someone's bound to get upset..............................

***Shame on you people, you know who you are, you're a disgrace to your families + to the country whose good name you insult. Shame on you.***   



Important Update: Be careful of travel agents who are willing to do visa extension for you in Saigon. I just received an email from one of my teachers at my company. My company and I are in the process of helping him with visa so to make sure He went to see an international lawyer to help out on changing his visa legally & to understand the visa process.
"Today I had a lawyer confirm that all of my visa extension stamps have been falsified and it’s likely that I’m not listed in the updated immigration system. It seems that many of the agents used the same source to process extensions, and some estimates are that over 1,000 foreigners have been affected by this. A note to pass on to any other teachers that have received an extension from an agent this year, is that it may be advisable to do a border run to Moc Bai than approach immigration here in the city or at the airport. The later may result in a hefty fine.
UPDATE
Many of the travel agents, popular cafes, hostels, and visa agents passed on the task of visa renewals to the person offering the lowest price. As far as it worked out, this turned out to be someone working with or without the knowledge of an ex employee of the immigration office, and in this case, it's mostly the 3 month extensions that were made unlawfully last year and this year.
It was with the change of the PM, chairman, head of congress that stricter security checks were implemented this year. lawyer said this issue is compounded by the fact that many of the immigration guys have been fighting each other, so while many in the stamping department may have performed legitimate renewals, about half have not been registered on the updated online database. While there appears to have been a cover up, immigration is still taking the opportunity to penalise everyone that has been caught up in it.
As immigration doesn't allow most foreigners to apply for extensions directly, there is a good chance that if someone is currently on an extended visa that they are implicated in this.
If other teachers are concerned about this, they can either go to immigration and expect the possibility of having their passport confiscated and a large fine demanded (at the airport also), or to exit at Moc Bai, and get an invitation letter for a new visa to reenter on. As I understand it Moc Bai operates differently and is not in sync with the new online system.

Not sure why but reading this makes me want to do some math problems + I'm having trouble understanding what you're trying to say.

SiCoTic.  Do you teach IELTS writing?  :/

There are several people in Nha Trang that have had 3 mth extensions on DL visas turn out to be "duds".  They were not recorded at VN immigration.

Some were caught at the airport , and had to pay hefty fines for overstaying and when others heard about this, they had their extensions checked , and they were found to be " not recorded".   

That means you get fined for every day overstayed.  I know a guy that paid $800.   He's not happy.

So....if you've had an extension recently, you could be in line for a fine even though you paid for the extension in good faith.

There's been a lot of accusations and blame shifting.  Police have been knocking on doors checking passports and extension validity. A guy I know had this happen last night.  I hope they're  looking to solve the problem instead of looking for opportunities to issue fines.

Foreign journalists have already got hold of this .   It could get interesting.   

Border security is a major issue in the world today...... It's one thing to tamper with taxi metres and sell knock off T shirts, but once you start farting around with a Visa , that is an internationally recognised legal document , they've well and truly overstepped the mark.

They say cheats never prosper.

Cheers for the heads up. Don't suppose anyone knows a trustworthy travel agent in banlung , scambodia to send my passport to Viet embassy?? I know  travel agents like Axx and others in kampot will just give you back your passport saying they got your visa but actually didn't. Hardly the most sophisticated con.

all it takes is a simple stamp (easily forged) and the unsuspecting tourist thinks everything is ok. there are no 3 month extensions at the moment, only 1 month at a high price after which you have to do a border run. really doesn't make sense but it is what it is :)

I'm sorry to hear that, the math thing is a weird one, do you often get this urge? I presume you're saying you don't understand, ''what I'm [sic: you're] trying to say..'' because of some failing, or flaw, in what I wrote? You're not the first person to raise that possibility + it's true that I don't write, like many people do, as if it were a text message on a mobile, each character costs a small fortune + I'm in the same kind of hurry as a vital transplant organ might be, I write in sentences + on occasion might use a word that is unfamiliar to some. A dictionary comes into its own on these occasions + I use one regularly as I come across new words whose meanings I'm unaware of. Believe it, or not, I've written things in the past that have been described as, 'alright', 'not bad', + even 'quite good', but That doesn't mean you're wrong + I'm right, I'm not going to confirm or deny, anything.
I'll say 'bye' + a quick parting question, have you had reading comprehension problems before, at any time?  If not, have a think about what you've read, up to now, I'd be intrigued..........

Nice one Yogi, I'm off to Moc Bai tomorrow armed with a letter that I've been led to believe will result in a 3 month single entry visa, but I'll be prepared for a stretch of hard labour in the salt mines (worse case scenario) but fingers crossed that something less likely to give me a bad back will result. I've always found the visa thing here a bit of a mystery, whatever you hear there'll be something to contradict it come along so who knows?  It's like a box of chocolates, you don't know what you're gona get. Anything, bar a Coffee Cream, + I'll be happy!
You're spot on about messin' with passports being a bit more ''serious'' than knocking out a fake Gucci handbag + I hate to say it but I reckon that cheats do prosper, crime does pay, if it doesn't you're doing it wrong, but usually it does which is why people do it. Any luck there'll be no criminal trousering at Moc Bai later on, I'll let you know. Cheers,

Thanks for sharing. TBH, I feel like a deer caught in the headlights.

What the VN embassy in my home country demands and what I have been told over here is at cross purposes. TO avoid more confusion, I won't relay the sorry tale.

OP, can you please break up the long passages and add paragraphs?

Hi SiCoTic, sent you a mail, how did you go in Moc Bai with new visa ?

cheers

Fair point, paragraphs, or the lack of them, have been mentioned to me before so I'll definitely try to remember. You're absolutely right, fair criticism, thanks for pointing it out.
If there's anything specific you don't get about the visa thing I'll gladly at least try to explain, with an adequate number of paragraphs I'd like to think, you could tell me if not.
I write sincerely, I mean every word + will help if I can. Cheers,

  S

Aye up! I said I'd get back to you + to prove it wasn't just a threat. I got it all done without any loss of/in rag, face, plot, credibility, direction, virginity, grip, way, my favourite game, my mind, that loving feeling, weight, innocents, the Ashes, Space, translation, or the will to live, so I guess it went alright, all things considered.
I went up on the bike, a couple of hours steady as she goes + I was there, the usual risks of sharing the roads with those not afraid to die, those that can't wait to die, + those that already have died, from above the neck, as always are a factor, every time you get on a bike here this is how it is. I've been on + off (mostly on!) bikes for years but the return leg was all about something I'd not considered.
It was about 6pm when I left Moc Bai, I got home 11:30ish, 2 hours there, 5.5 hours back. How come?
Simple, going up there in the daylight I could see, coming back in the dark, I couldn't!!
Unless you've got night vision equipment, some serious wattage lights on your bike, or you're a bat, my advice would be don't ride from Moc Bai to SGN after dark. That's don't, as in DO NOT!!!

I don't, but I have done, there are often problems with the higher level, more advanced types of course, the need for higher level, more advanced types of student to take them isn't always who ends up in the class. This being the teacher's fault, clearly................

SiCoTic :

I don't, but I have done, there are often problems with the higher level, more advanced types of course, the need for higher level, more advanced types of student to take them isn't always who ends up in the class. This being the teacher's fault, clearly................

I assume that this is in response to my post about you and IELTS.  I expect that you do understand that my post was in jest, based on your writing style.  I do feel thought that IELTS writing is way too structured and formulaic so I can see why you might not have enjoyed it.  Your style is obviously free form.

Have you ever tried and going to immigration yourself and reneweing your own visa?  I know that you said they don't allow most people to do so however, i've heard many people say this and its always something they heard from a friend. Also, when they get to immigration the the person doesn't know what to do and decides it is too difficult to do it on their own. I can tell you the first time i did it myself is seemed difficult. But since i now know what to do, its cake work.

I've done it probably about 12 plus times. For me the experience is the best when dealing with all the different government departments. I've never been turned around around unless I did not have the correct paper work. Last week when i went i forgot about my photos and the girl working at immigration still decided to push my application through.

"Your style is obviously free form."

I think it's free of a lot of things, at times, anyway, reason, direction, grip on reality, they've all been known to be conspicuously absent at one time or another but no one got hurt. The pen being mightier than the sword makes me sincerely grateful to be able to say that, phew!
Your writing, by the way, is superb, I have nothing but admiration for Vietnamese people who manage to reach the extremely high level of command in English that you certainly have, I know how difficult this is to achieve, particularly if you consider all these bloody useless foreign teachers out there!!!!!!
All the best, my friend, cheers,

    S

SiCoTic :

"Your style is obviously free form."

I think it's free of a lot of things, at times, anyway, reason, direction, grip on reality, they've all been known to be conspicuously absent at one time or another but no one got hurt. The pen being mightier than the sword makes me sincerely grateful to be able to say that, phew!
Your writing, by the way, is superb, I have nothing but admiration for Vietnamese people who manage to reach the extremely high level of command in English that you certainly have, I know how difficult this is to achieve, particularly if you consider all these bloody useless foreign teachers out there!!!!!!
All the best, my friend, cheers,

    S

Once again, I am pleasantly amused by your posting particularly your apparent identification of me as Vietnamese.   :dumbom: I can barely count from một to mười.  I do however speak a language derived from yours.  It is called Mer'can.

Well Yogi,they don't live in Vietnam do they? ;)

I am caught up in this fake visa stamp, now they are refusing any reentry letter. They tell me I have to get out. I live in Vietnam and have a fiancee we were planning on marriage. Do you have advise about how I can return to Vietnam?
Any help would greatly appreciated.  Ive exhausted all options I can think of. J

It's OK to be looking for advice here but your really should be looking for a good lawyer.  Have your fiance's family help find one versed in immigration law.

Retiredvn :

I am caught up in this fake visa stamp, now they are refusing any reentry letter. They tell me I have to get out. I live in Vietnam and have a fiancee we were planning on marriage. Do you have advise about how I can return to Vietnam?
Any help would greatly appreciated.  Ive exhausted all options I can think of. J

it will cost you overstay money but they cant stop you leaving. then just re enter. probably go to phnom penh and back. how long have you overstayed ?

Panda's idea is probably your best shot. 
Leave the country and your passport is ticked off as having left.  Because at the moment IMO that fake stamp doesn't indicate that you should be here legally therefore immigration won't budge until you leave....who knows, it's a circus here.

Go to Phnom Penh , then apply locally thru the many travel agency's there for a new Visa.   A 3 mth single entry are currently selling for around $60.  That hopefully will work.....but get going NOW.

However.....Yogi thinks you've been inadvertently given a strong hint. 😀

The odds of the successful marriage scenario here are slim.....lots of train wrecks here mate.  Get yourself over to Phnom Penh, and have some fun with the locals for a while.   It may change your perspective from being a " one dog/ one bone " man to being a player.

Just tell your fiancé your going to PP for a week with a few buddies to assess your future ,,and see the look on her face. 😜😜
She will soon get in the ear of "someone" in immigration to get her cash cow back.  They don't like their "investment" getting a taste of the opposition in Cambodia ,Thailand Phillipines etc.   

Don't worry, they'll let you back in if they think you are going to support someone's family and buy them a house.

avn128 :

Have you ever tried and going to immigration yourself and reneweing your own visa?  I know that you said they don't allow most people to do so however, i've heard many people say this and its always something they heard from a friend. Also, when they get to immigration the the person doesn't know what to do and decides it is too difficult to do it on their own. I can tell you the first time i did it myself is seemed difficult. But since i now know what to do, its cake work.

I've done it probably about 12 plus times. For me the experience is the best when dealing with all the different government departments. I've never been turned around around unless I did not have the correct paper work. Last week when i went i forgot about my photos and the girl working at immigration still decided to push my application through.

Our residential situation is about as complex as it can possibly get. Though, our legal residence is Lien Huong, we have been in Sai Gon for roughly a year in a half because of my wife's medical issues. So we have to renew our residential paper work in Phan Thiet. Plus my wife is unable to make a signature and I have to send a legal document stating listing her disabilities and stating that I am her guardian.

We ship our paperwork(mostly duplicates of what we have previously sent) up to my wife's brother in Lien Huong. Then, he runs down to Phan Thiet and does the paperwork for us. The big(not really) issue is that we need to provide documentation for her medical treatment. This was a pain the first time. Anyway, once my wife's brother submits the paper work, it goes quite smoothly.

As to my VN Drivers license, A friend took me to the Drivers license office and we spent about an hour getting it renewed. The people were actually quite helpful.

From my experience, getting paperwork done is mostly simpler, cheaper and quicker than in the old days.

I don't have experience with the old days but I don't doubt it was bad. Some people just tend to make things complicated when they havent even tried.

Let me know if you need some help at the Phan thiet immigration office.  I have a friend that works there. although he's worked there less then a year, it doesnt hurt to ask.

avn128 :

I don't have experience with the old days but I don't doubt it was bad. Some people just tend to make things complicated when they havent even tried.

Let me know if you need some help at the Phan thiet immigration office.  I have a friend that works there. although he's worked there less then a year, it doesnt hurt to ask.

Thank you. But, we are in good shape there.

@avn128

Some of our good service with residence paperwork could be that we are doing it in Phan Thiet. Phan Thiet and the rest of Binh Thuan are much more laid back and, at least for me, an infinitely better place to live than Sai Gon.

Note, I'm not picking on Sai Gon. I just dislike big cities in general.

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