Top Reasons Why More USA Citizens Re-Locate to Ecuador than Canadians

cccmedia wrote:

Ecuador is popular for Canadian Expats, but they are far fewer than USA citizens in terms of full-time relocating to EC....

Top Reasons Why More USA's Than Canadians Move to EC Full-Time
2.  The government in Washington, D.C., is more-hated than Ottawa's.

#2 reason?
It's the #1 reason Americans are fleeing the country like rats from a sinking ship. Except the US government has spent the last 10 years or so passing legislation to rein in their money so that when the fleeing citizens try to leave the sinking USSA - ahahahaaaha, it's too late muthafukah. You just missed the last boat. Enjoy your fleecing.

signed,
Uncle Sam

cccMedia,

Yet still we Canadians persist in coming on down... must be our winters, or our Connservative Govt., take your pick.  Actually this Ottawa summer has been incredibly hot, breaking records.  I am hoping to achieve a more level weather activity in Loja, very soon.

On the other hand, a lot more Canadians are exposed to French, which is similar to Spanish, being a Romance language.  The verb conjugations are very similar, etc.
Cheers,
HelenPivoine

#7  Whether an economic refugee or otherwise, financial factors have worked against Canadians seeking to retire to a USD economy such as Ecuador or Panama.  The value of CAD 1 has gone from a high of USD 1.05 less than five years ago to USD .76 -- more than a 25% decline in purchasing power.  I expect more CAD devaluation relative to the USD at least over the foreseeable future.  So, while Americans face no currency risk relocating to a USD economy, this factor must cause some of the more economic sensitive retirees pause.

On the other hand, Europeans moving to Panama around 2008 found everything in the country "on sale" with 1 EUR worth USD 1.40!

Sawman,

You are so right.  It gave me pause.  But in the end I decided against places such as Costa Rica and Nicaragua, even though my Nicaraguan friends think that I am out of my mind.

HelenPivoine

HelenPivoine wrote:

we Canadians persist in coming on down... must be our winters, or our Conservative Govt., take your pick.  Actually this Ottawa summer has been incredibly hot, breaking records.  I am hoping to achieve a more level weather activity in Loja, very soon.

Although Helen has found Canada's summer weather unusually warm so far this year, Canada seems like a 'best bet' for spending the summer in your home country and snowbirding to Ecuador in the autumn.  Historically, Canada has had much milder summers than the continental U.S.  I knew some really hot times from summers spent in Virginia Beach and Washington, D.C.

Although I think hardly anyone decides on moving overseas due to verb conjugations, I do recall that having studied French first in high school made learning h.s. Spanish later ... a breeze.

cccmedia in Quito

cccMedia,

Sorry, I fell off the Reply train somehow.

Being a snowbird in Ecuador is good if you can afford to maintain a residence and all that it implies in Canada, or USA, for the rest of the year.  It is not a viable option for me at the moment.  Besides, I have had the idea of Ecuador in mind for over 40 years.  IN my youth it was Otovalo, land of Eternal Spring.  Didn't know that it meant that having a fireplace was a necessity.

I do love New Mexico and really enjoyed living there, (and the fireplaces especially),but left for personal reasons.  Possibly an ideal climate, with the winter snow so dry that it was gorgeous.  It's the humidity that wears you down in winter.  Canada has a lot of humidity, except in certain areas such as the Kelowna area in southern British Columbia.  A delightful climate, but who could possibly afford to live there? (except my relative , who lives there).

HelenPivoine

I'll agree with everything you said, except for item number 2. Most Canadians down here hate our current government. Another reason that was touched upon is the exchange rate. When we first arrived the Canadian dollar was at 97 cents USD, currently it's sitting at 70 cents (ouch!)

I think the main reason is that Canada is 1/10 the population of the US. Great to see that some people have a good sense of their neighbours (yup, that's how we spell it!) to the north!

PEI Red wrote:

I'll agree with everything you said, except for item number 2. Most Canadians down here hate our current government.... When we first arrived the Canadian dollar was at 97 cents, currently it's sitting at 70 cents (ouch!)

I think the main reason is that Canada is 1/10 the population of the US.!

Tough to argue with the fact that the Canadian dollar has devalued.

Red is right about population stats too, as verified at Wikipedia.  The U.S. population at 322 million is about 10 times Canada's 33 million.  Ecuador has 15 million in a much smaller land-area.

In fact, the USA's most-populous state, California, has about five million more residents than all of Canada -- 38 million Californians.

cccmedia in Quito, population 2.7 million

I hear you, PEI Red.

HelenPivoine

SawMan wrote:

#7  Whether an economic refugee or otherwise, financial factors have worked against Canadians seeking to retire to a USD economy such as Ecuador or Panama.  The value of CAD 1 has gone from a high of USD 1.05 less than five years ago to USD .76 -- more than a 25% decline in purchasing power.  I expect more CAD devaluation relative to the USD at least over the foreseeable future.  So, while Americans face no currency risk relocating to a USD economy, this factor must cause some of the more economic sensitive retirees pause.

On the other hand, Europeans moving to Panama around 2008 found everything in the country "on sale" with 1 EUR worth USD 1.40!

SawMan is right and he's a bit wrong....... He's bang on with his assessment that the lower value of the Canadian dollar as compared to the US greenback, which EC is using means that Canadian expats take a big hit financially... No. 7 is way off the mark. i think he should have given that No. 1 rating.    

US citizens end up doing better in EC because of the lower cost of living so their US greenback automatically go farther without any pain in the wallet. Canadians with their lower valued dollar aren't quite that fortunate, and the difference in the exchange rate more than cancels out any benefit that they'd gain by the lower cost of living.

Cheers,
James    Expat-blog Experts Team

I think this is total BS.  In Cuenca 10% of the expats are Canadians, according to a survey. That is in relationship to the national populations of both countries.

efrater wrote:

I think this is total BS.  In Cuenca 10% of the expats are Canadians, according to a survey. That is in relationship to the national populations of both countries.

So what you are actually saying then is that in Cuenca 90% of the expat population are NOT Canadians. I see nothing in that figure that would indicate in any way that all of the foregoing information is not bang on the money then.

It stands to reason with the country using the US Currency then US citizens are going to be in a much better position financially than anyone coming from a country with a national currency valued less than the US greenback. They automatically lose whatever the difference between their national currency and the US dollar may be.

Conversely, those coming from the UK or EU would do even better than the US citizens in EC, since their national currencies are slightly stronger than the US dollar.

This would certainly cause a great deal of concern for Canadians, especially those considering retiring permanently to EC. If it doesn't then they've not yet removed their rose colored glasses. My Canadian pension is small enough, it goes a lot further here in Brazil because the Canadian dollar is currently R$2.88 so in terms of net after exchange income my pension here would translate to roughly R$1300 per month. It would be a net amount of $430.27 per month converted to USD. That's one hell of a big difference and certainly enough to take EC off the list of most Canadians thinking of retirement there unless they have lots of other assets that they can draw on.

Do the math my friend, everything that has been stated here is clearly true.

Cheers,
James  Expat-blog Experts Team

Here is a fairly long term chart of usd/cad. Looks like historically if your income is in Canadian Dollars, and are living somewhere that uses U.S. dollars you're probably on average going to be taking a hit financially.

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/canada/currency

FYI hit max to get long term chart. Linked it to that, but only the year chart is popping up from link.

Thank you all for your contributions concerning Canadians who are making the decision whether to move to EC. As a tourist, some years ago I visited both EC and Panama, and now find myself deciding between the two to settle. As has been noted, the exchange rate is unfortunately a huge concern for many of us seeking a warmer climate to reside in. Americans are very fortunate that they can relocate to warm parts of the U.S.A. if climate is the big factor in moving somewhere;  they seem to have more choices than Canadians! 

The tax differences between Canada and the U.S. may also still be a factor which results in more Americans than Canadians immigrating to EC (if this is correct).  Canadians are taxed on their world income even if they are residing in EC, unless they become official non-residents of Canada, which has some huge implications for some Canadians.  It used to be that U.S. citizens had a tax exemption on a portion of their U.S. income --no matter where they lived abroad --but I am not sure if this is still the case. Canadians have no such tax exemption on their income.

...and to follow up on cccmedia's point about those folks from Moosejaw, Saskatchewan and Medicine Hat, Alberta relocating to warmer climates, don't forget the wet coast (er, rather, west coast) of Canada too:  many of us may not have snow to escape, instead we have the horrid, cold, damp rainy foggy weather, from October to March (think Seattle weather).

There are ten times as many Americans as Canadians, so the numbers in Cuenca are representative of the population ratios between both countries. Seems logical to me...

Cold Canada wrote:

Thank you all for your contributions concerning Canadians who are making the decision whether to move to EC. As a tourist, some years ago I visited both EC and Panama, and now find myself deciding between the two to settle. As has been noted, the exchange rate is unfortunately a huge concern for many of us seeking a warmer climate to reside in. Americans are very fortunate that they can relocate to warm parts of the U.S.A. if climate is the big factor in moving somewhere;  they seem to have more choices than Canadians!

Have you been to, or considered the Dominican Republic? It's far from perfect, but have personally spent a good amount of time in that country. I really like it, and there appears to be a fair amount of Canadians who have chosen to live there full time, and or be snowbirds. Don't get me wrong. It does have problems, but overall personally think it's a pretty nice place, and the cost of living is ridiculously low.

Cold Canada wrote:

Thank you all for your contributions concerning Canadians who are making the decision whether to move to EC.

...and to follow up on cccmedia's point about those folks from Moosejaw, Saskatchewan and Medicine Hat, Alberta relocating to warmer climates, don't forget the wet coast (er, rather, west coast) of Canada too:  many of us may not have snow to escape, instead we have the horrid, cold, damp rainy foggy weather, from October to March.

You could be a candidate for snow-birding, Cold Canada.

Your city of Vancouver, B.C., is the mildest-weather city in Canada, and also the wettest.  Daytimes temps in December-through-February hovering around six degrees C., 43 F., with 17 days a month of rain, usually rain lingering all day.
( www.worldweatheronline.com )

------

Thanks for not rubbing it in, that I 're-located' Medicine Hat from Alberta to Manitoba.

The Cheese Desk regrets the error.

cccmedia in Quito

If I become a non resident of Canada, will I still be taxed 25% on pensions & investments received from Canada? Does the tax treaty with Ecuador impact taxation? Thanks in advance!

I don't know about younger, working expats in Ecuador.  But if you receive Canada Pension and Old Age Security from Canada, there is a 15% tax treaty with Ecuador.  However, if your income is deemed insufficient for that level of taxation, at the end of fiscal year you can ask it back from the tax person at Revenue Canada.

HelenPivoine

Thanks Helen, does anyone know if I would be taxed 25% or 15% on a work pension & investment income as a Canadian non resident. Thanks again!

While income is an issue, there are many reasons to live in Ecuador……..
As has been said, a wise person would spend some time here to experience life, the good and bad, before making a decision…..
I must say I have been impressed in following a few Ecuador ex-pat forums at the number who are leaving……sure, sometimes things happen where you may need to leave……..but my guess is the decision was not well thought out….

And after suffering through the cold, rain and clouds of Cuenca or Quito, It would seem best to spend much time in pleasant and inviting, sunny, humid, gringo friendly Guayaquil……..

There is also the option of spending half the year here, and half in Canada (or wherever)……this is hard however as you are between 2 worlds, not to mention the cost of maintaining 2 residences in most cases……

Clarka wrote:

If I become a non resident of Canada, will I still be taxed 25% on pensions & investments received from Canada? Does the tax treaty with Ecuador impact taxation? Thanks in advance!

If you live outside of Canada for more than 183 days during the tax year you may request Non-Resident (for tax purposes) Status, then you will automatically be subject to a 25% withholding tax on ALL Canadian sourced income unless any Tax Treaty between Canada and your home country lowers that rate. You no longer need to file an annual T1-General return, since the withholding tax quits all tax liabilities. You do not receive any refund even if the 25% withheld is greater than any tax you would have paid if you had filed a T1-General as a resident.

There are certain kinds of income that would require you to file a T1-General, so you really need to check out the information on the CRA  link below:

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/nnrsdnts/nd … s-eng.html

You really need to crunch the numbers and make absolutely certain that it is worth your while to file the NR-5, it may cost you more in the long run depending on the amount and type of income you have.

Cheers,
James      Expat-blog Experts Team

Thanks James for the helpful link. If I'm understanding the document correctly, I could pay the reduced tax rate of 15% on all investment interest & pension payments accrued in Canada because of the tax treaty. Does this sound correct?

AMDG wrote:

And after suffering through the cold, rain and clouds of Cuenca or Quito, It would seem best to spend much time in pleasant and inviting, sunny, humid, gringo friendly Guayaquil.

I am pretty sure that this crack about Cuenca/Quito weather by my virtual friend AMDG is an attempt to get under my skin.  And it's working.

Calling hot, humid, dangerous Guayaquil 'Gringo-friendly' is an indication that AM has been out in the GYE sun too long.  At least he had the sense to remove Guayaquil from his Expat.com avatar.

In any case, we wish him luck.  Get well soon.

BTW, the weather in Quito has been fabulous for many weeks.  As we know, it's 68 F., 20 C. daily-high every month year-round.  And there's been no rain here for quite a while, no snow in the last couple of centuries.

cccmedia in Quito

AMDG wrote:

a wise person would spend some time (in Ecuador) to experience life, the good and bad, before making a decision…..

There is also the option of spending half the year here, and half in Canada (or wherever)....

Possibly this last paragraph indicates that AM is not as likkered up as I thought.

I like this snowbird scenario for Canadian serial Expats who can afford this as a transitional phase.

The EC visa-extension law for non-immigrants makes it easy to get around the bureaucracy.

Canadian summers are so mild compared to Cincinnati, Sacramento and Atlanta heat .. that I think that snowbirding makes more sense for Canadians than many USA Expats.  Most people would choose to have mild Ecuador-highlands-type weather from November to April compared to what they endure in Nova Scotia and Moose Jaw.

cccmedia in Quito

I lived in Florida - Ocala National Forest, and Miami - for over ten years, and compared to Canadian summers in Ottawa, they are both miserable at times.  Here in Ottawa the humidex has been hovering in high 30's and at times 40 Celcius for weeks.  We are hoping for a reprieve.

Again, the difference is who can afford to live in two countries each year, and the attendant schocks of all kinds...

HelenPivoine

Now as it is, I spend time in both the USSA and Ecuador for the past 4 years; maintain a modest house in both places, as well as older cars; living off retirement……..certainly by all accounts I am not wealthy, not even close…..
I greatly appreciate the lower costs of living in Ecuador, the relief from the cold winters among many other benefits and pleasures of Ecuador…….
Each year I spend less and less time in the states, but still significant…….just returned form 14 weeks and am going back for Thanksgiving and Christmas this year (maybe 6 weeks)……
As for living in 2 worlds, so very different; I have not found it difficult and it has made me appreciate more what each has to offer.
The cost question has come to mind a few times, but family and friends…..still worth it for now……
With each choice comes good, and bad; the decision is a personal one……while economics is an essential part, there are many equally important considerations (IMHO)…..
If undecided, perhaps spending a 5-6 months over the winter would help with the decision process……

Being a loyal USA citizen, I intend to spend baseball season in the USA, and fall/winter elsewhere.  Ecuador is a great choice being so close, but many pick Mexico or Central America instead.  It is a longer trip for us to the Philippines, but there are many places in Asia I have never seen, so the Philippines is a good base of operations with no rent to pay..  One cruise from Santiago to Buenos Aires was sufficient South America for us.  Others need to know not only where they want to go, but also where else they want to go.  I can't imagine hanging out at one place.

Clarka wrote:

Thanks James for the helpful link. If I'm understanding the document correctly, I could pay the reduced tax rate of 15% on all investment interest & pension payments accrued in Canada because of the tax treaty. Does this sound correct?

Sorry, I really don't know anything about the Canada/Ecuador Tax Treaty, but if that's the figure quoted in the text then you're correct. My advice would be to check with the International Tax Services Office of the Canada Revenue Agency just to make sure. If you are calling from anywhere in Canada and the USA 1-855-284-5946, outside of Canada and the USA 613-940-8499 (collect calls are accepted).

Cheers,
James  Expat-blog Experts Team

Thanks again James.