Brexit consequences for expats

The first issue to crop up is Spain asking for joint governance of Gibraltar, probably with a view to taking over the rock as soon as possible.
Whilst this is unlikely to lead to armed conflict, I think we can safely assume the Spanish government will resume their old strategy of disruption to daily life there as opportunities arise for them to do so.
Expats (and residents) moving in and out of Spain will likely face the old border crossing delays we saw in the past.

EU expats in the UK (and UK expats in the EU) are likely to face problems as the EU exits the union. Many are there as a grace of European free movement laws, but those laws might well be scrapped, especially if some corners of the French government get their 'hard exit' policy enacted.
If one side gets tough, we can expect the other to respond in the same way, meaning potential difficulties for some on both sides of the channel.

Powerful and influential Scottish politicians are now talking about a new Scottish referendum, and before the UK exit comes into force.

That could lead to a whole can of worms, but that's for another day.
However, those would have to be considered if Scotland were to go on its own.

Congrats to our Brit friends.

An Irish republican movement well known for its military wing's terrorist actions of so few years ago has called for Irish unity as a result of the election.
The political violence in the North decreased rapidly after a peace agreement, but there is still some sporadic violence from some even more extreme groups.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britai … KKCN0ZA0OT

A few expats could lose their jobs as a direct result of the exit vote.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/us-britai … KKCN0ZA2HE

Britain's European commissioner for financial services, Jonathan Hill, should consider resigning after his country voted to leave the EU, the head of the European Parliament's economic committee said on Friday.

Salary? €19,909.89 per month

That's one expat out of a job, something that saddens me - NOT!

Fred wrote:

A few expats could lose their jobs as a direct result of the exit vote.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/us-britai … KKCN0ZA2HE

Britain's European commissioner for financial services, Jonathan Hill, should consider resigning after his country voted to leave the EU, the head of the European Parliament's economic committee said on Friday.

Salary? €19,909.89 per month

That's one expat out of a job, something that saddens me - NOT!

This is one of the reasons I'm glad that the UK is freeing itself from this bureaucratic cancer that is the EU. Obscene salaries paid for by the struggling European tax payers to those who are appointed, not elected, to regulate to death and tax even further the Europeans with blatant disregard for the European cultures. I think I remember a thing or two about taxes without representation in past history...

There's always going to be a good side and a bad side to brexit. Many people will agree their vote for brexit was not based upon immigration control from Europe but was so that the NHS could be saved and could thrive. Farage however declined this and said this statement in his propaganda was a ''mistake''. leaving thousands of people regretting their vote for leave.  in my opinion if the votes were to be taken again the results would be complete opposite and many would have decided to stay...

This is likely to add to political problems in the UK.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-36632956

As the Labour and Tory parties fall into a political mess over the vote, expats in the UK are likely to face problems as immigration is very likely to be an issue.
The Tory party could well be forced into a tougher stance, and Labour might very well have to produce their own version as such a move is likely to become popular amongst those with little time for anyone non white. I'm already seeing unhealthy comments in the "readers' comments" sections of some of the more right leaning papers.

Here's speculation from an Indian company with something positive to say.

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-36632934

Earlier this year, the Indian company launched the e2o electric car in the UK where it already has a presence with its IT business Tech Mahindra.
Mr Mahindra said Britain's decision to leave may prove advantageous.
"The last time I spoke to the people in the British government about reducing taxes and duty on electric vehicles, they said they were hampered from doing so because of the European Union protocols and tariffs.
"So I hate to say this but as far as our electric vehicles are concerned this is probably something where I could go back to them and say you know you're going to have your own discretion to lower the taxes from now on. So I'm certainly going to drive that point home."

The positive is starting to appear, and I like positive,

Fred wrote:

Here's speculation from an Indian company with something positive to say.

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-36632934

Earlier this year, the Indian company launched the e2o electric car in the UK where it already has a presence with its IT business Tech Mahindra.
Mr Mahindra said Britain's decision to leave may prove advantageous.
"The last time I spoke to the people in the British government about reducing taxes and duty on electric vehicles, they said they were hampered from doing so because of the European Union protocols and tariffs.
"So I hate to say this but as far as our electric vehicles are concerned this is probably something where I could go back to them and say you know you're going to have your own discretion to lower the taxes from now on. So I'm certainly going to drive that point home."

The positive is starting to appear, and I like positive,

I agree with Mr Mahindra. Less regulations is better for business. Taxes never have been a real issue when you do business, but hyper regulation may kill your competitiveness and even your industry with the consequences we know on unemployment.

Regulation is important in many ways, and I can say that because I've lived in and long term visited countries at all points in the spectrum.
The EU has gone mad with regulation to the point you can spend forever trying to comply, but Indonesia has little to the point where so many things are dangerous.
When you over-regulate, there are always going to be problems for business.
I've never had any contact with Mr Mahindra, but I think I'd like him if I ever met him.
A positive attitude gets things done.

That's the big problem with the EU exit; everyone is looking for doom and gloom, but there are going to be opportunities for people with vision.
The UK trade with Europe has been falling steadily for years, with new trade from many countries replacing it, and that's good news for potential expats from Britain's non EU trading partners as overseas companies send management over to the UK to set up businesses over there, just as Mr Mahindra wants to.
A 'green' car industry is very welcome in the UK, as it should be all over the world, and removing regulation and tariffs will only help.



I recall seeing these nut cases when I was a kid - They were wrong then, and the doom merchants are wrong now.

21 December 2012 came and went without a sign of Nibiru or much else bigger than a marble colliding with Earth, just as the "end of the world's economy is nigh" lot are one off now.

It won't take long for non EU businesses, probably in the tech field, to see new chances in a Britain unfettered by "banana style" regulations, and that's good news for a new breed of future expats.

A 1994 EU regulation specified that bananas must be ‘free from abnormal curvature'. There are no banana curvature regulations in most countries, the decision about how bendy a banana is being left to the individual minion.
Dumping silliness such as that will be good news for any potential expat minions looking for evil masters in the UK, but they'll be likely to want to move to Brussels as there's a large supply of evil masters over there
They'll probably lobby for exception from the banana law, causing uproar in right wing quarters, with shouts of, "Ruddy Minions coming over here and wanting laws changed to suit them".

UK Government should leave as soon as possible. We can live without England , England can live without EU.

Thanks and good luck.

Mikel Lopez wrote:

UK Government should leave as soon as possible. We can live without England , England can live without EU.

Thanks and good luck.

If you're in Nottingham and Spain pushes for Gib, you might well find yourself on the wrong end of a problem.
The EU will go on without the UK, but Brexit might well cause Germany or France to leave, and that will finish the EU.

Not interested in Gibraltar like 95 % of Spanish people ,all of it for you ,you dream if you think the rest of Europe its going to collapse for your decision , *** I've got family in this country and in other country's of Europe , just leave the EU and left us in peace ,I will say like you that 800000  English citizens can be in trouble in Spain but I don't wish them any harm and I will be happy to treat them in our NHS which by the way its a thousand times better than in Uk cause we didn't privatize our NHS. I like your country ,I am just showing respect for your decision , you want to leave EU, just do it please.

Good luck

One sad fact, every country has a racist section of its population, and every country has people who believe violence is an answer to a problem, including Spain's ETA group.

The Brexit will bring these people out in a lot of countries, notably (and sadly) in France where their right wing party seems to be gaining a lot of support.

I believe we are going to see a good few groups pushing for independence, and perhaps more.

Mass deportation of migrants who entered and settled in the UK under the free movement rule is illegal. Those who will be most affected will be the post Brexit migrants who will need to fulfil new criteria. As you have pointed out, there are a few millions of us settled with mortgages and families, children born in the UK etc. Do you seriously think the British government is going to ask us all to sell our properties and 'go back home'? What about mixed nationality families? Are they going to ask Mum or Dad to leave whilst the others are granted the right to stay? Are they going to fire model employees from their jobs? Even that's too far fetch for Donald Trump! Let's not panic people shall we?

Divorce is never easy, it is often quite messy and things can get very ugly. People, such as children, or citizens in this case are more often than not hurt.

My wife and I often light heartedly discuss that the amount of work required to stay together and make it work is far less than the amount of work required to separate. But it is still work, work that we have decided is well worth the effort.

I can't imagine why the UK has voted to leave. Have the majority decided it's too much work? The Union of countries, like marriage, requires work. I guess you have to decide whether or not it's worth it.

I do think it is a bit rich coming from a country that has colonised so many others, including the one I was born in (South Africa) when I hear the line "we have taken our country back".....I have to laugh at that.

As Belgian citizens, my wife and I are or rather were considering a move to the UK. Looks like we may have to rethink those plans. Ireland is an option to invest our time, skills and money in. Although if we go now, after the vote but before it is enacted, would we be able to stay even after they leave the EU? We may well feel unwelcome either way.

It seems like those that voted to leave didn't think it through, how it would affect the lives of so many. Whoever started this whole vote to leave campaign didn't think it through. When I first heard about it, I thought 'what'? Huh? Why would they, for what good reason? I'm still looking for that good reason.

Is the United Kingdom still united? Considering both Scotland and Northern Ireland want out of the UK and to stay in the EU.

I would think it's highly unlikely anyone who has settled in the UK with mortgage and all the trimmings would be booted out, more so if the free trade agreement (Something like the old EEC) is put in place as that would force free movement of people across borders.
The only chance of that extreme move is if other countries do it to British citizens first.
Even the UK's more extreme right wing aren't talking about splitting up families with European citizens.
Extremists of all types can get more than silly, but it's unlikely they'd manage that one.

An old tower block fell down a little distance from where I live, causing a big cloud of dust and a lot of noise. All the people close by went crackers, running all over the place.
The dust has settled and people are just going about their business as always, but one road is blocked in case of further collapse.

Sounds a lot like the UK's exit from the EU.

I do think it is a bit rich coming from a country that has colonised so many others

Few colonial age Brits are still alive, so that point of history is a little useless as evidence or opinion.

Scottish nationalist politicians want out of the UK, claiming greater than 50% support, but their last referendum showed majority support to remain in the UK. That could well have changed now, but no one is sure either way.  Watch this space on that one.

As for Ireland, the ex terrorist nationalist IRA/SF want out, but they are claiming a position that doesn't appear to be backed by the majority.

You can't believe extremists (Including convicted mass murderers) because they always claim support, even when it doesn't exist.
History does matter on that one because the ex terrorist groups are the ones who are demanding reunification, just they're doing it with a mouth rather than with a bomb as before.

I should note, that isn't political comment, just an opinion based on facts that are available to me from memory, but equally so on any internet search you like. Google the names of those calling for NI to leave the UK with keywords such as bomb, convicted, terrorist and so on. You'll find most have an 'interesting' history.

I have already predicted a Greek exit from the EU, and that's looking a little more likely.
It seems the EU is seen very badly in Greece, and there is a strong movement to break away, go bankrupt and start again.
That will damage the Greek economy, but its broken anyway.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36629145

The potential for a rise in racism is on the cards.
The racist element in the UK feels emboldened buy the exit vote, so seem to be having a go.
(Assuming the newspapers are to be believed) there has been a rise in racist incidents and general bullying.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-36634786

Since the EU referendum results revealed the UK voted to leave, people have been compiling reports of racism on social media.
A number of incidents where people have experienced hostility because of the colour of their skin and their ethnic background have been shared online.

Internet hard men are common and probably not a lot to worry about, and it should be noted the BBC (rather pathetically) is using a picture from a 2013 national front rally, something that seems a little sensationalist and smacks of poor quality reporting.

I'm a little disappointed in the BBC for that one, but social media bullying could be a problem for some expats in the UK.

Another Sean wrote:

Have the majority decided it's too much work?

No. They've decided there is too many coloured faces. And don't like the idea that it will be only get worse. I knew many felt this way, but thought I could be wrong as I never personally heard and rarely experienced it. I guess it's to do with the British stiff upper lip. They've let their Brexit vote do the talking.

XB23 wrote:

Another Sean wrote:

Have the majority decided it's too much work?

No. They've decided there is too many coloured faces.

I'm pretty sure there are some stupid enough to believe skin colour is a problem and that colour somehow decides how a person behaves, but that isn't the majority view amongst people I've been speaking to.
Islamaphobia has been a driving force for some, as has mass migration of undocumented immigrants, but only a small number of people are stupid enough to push a 'whites only' agenda.

I blame the less reasonable politicians and gutter press for the former and the latter, but blame weighted much more towards the politicians as they caused both issues.

Being in or out of the EU is little to do with either problem, but they will have caused a good few to vote 'out'.

And here I thought South Africa had/has political problems....racism, xenophobia etc. Looks like it is a world wide problem.

Why can't we all just get along?

Another Sean wrote:

Why can't we all just get along?

Most ordinary people can and do, but politicians insist on causing trouble, especially when they see hard cash in doing so.

At the end of the day, it seems it is mostly about the money. The 'argument' for leaving is just that, money. A poor excuse if you ask me.

A song comes to mind: The best things in life are free, but you can give them to the birds and bees, I want money, that's what I want. (or rather thats what these politicians want) And I am referring to most politicians the world over. In other words, how can we (the politicians) shaft the people without them realising it, only those that are realising it are speaking up.

Fred wrote:

only a small number of people are stupid enough to push a 'whites only' agenda.

It starts small, but as history shows us, it can then grow quite big, can't it?

Being in or out of the EU is little to do with either problem, but they will have caused a good few to vote 'out'.

Well as you know they (the Leave campaign) said Turkey will join the EU at some point. And they will obviously all come here. And once those migrants in Germany, Sweden, and elsewhere who entered Europe, obtain citizenship, they will also all make their way here. I don't know how much truth there is to those claims, but it's a cause for concern. UK is certainly an attractive destination to many so I suppose there is some truth to it. Maybe some voted out because it's better to be safe than sorry.

XB23 wrote:

Fred wrote:

only a small number of people are stupid enough to push a 'whites only' agenda.

It starts small, but as history shows us, it can then grow quite big, can't it?

Sad, but true.
We're seeing the anti Muslim rubbish at the moment, political hate driven by cash for bent politicians, and a new move against China and Russia, the world being told all about how horrible those countries are and how much we really have to hate them.
Then you look at what's really happening and the truth is very different from the politicians and newspapers who rant on about yet another "USS Maine", blaming whoever they like for something they have little clue about - or maybe know exactly what happened but don't want the truth out.

Being in or out of the EU is little to do with either problem, but they will have caused a good few to vote 'out'.

XB23 wrote:

Well as you know they (the Leave campaign) said Turkey will join the EU at some point. And they will obviously all come here. And once those migrants in Germany, Sweden, and elsewhere who entered Europe, obtain citizenship, they will also all make their way here. I don't know how much truth there is to those claims, but it's a cause for concern. UK is certainly an attractive destination to many so I suppose there is some truth to it. Maybe some voted out because it's better to be safe than sorry.

Turkey is effectively blocked at the moment, but might very well join in the future (If the Eu has a future). Really nice scare tactic using something that's unlikely to happen for a very long time, but what's the truth when it comes to politics?

That was clearly aimed at those with lots of fear but little education to combat that stupidity.

As for Turkish expats of the future, absolutely no change for them as they are non Eu and the UK will be soon.

Another victim of the out vote could be democracy.

The political left in the UK is trying to stop article 50 being signed.
In doing so they're defying the will of the majority, so damaging democracy.
Regardless of any opinion as to Britain's EU membership, these people can't be allowed to win or Britain's democracy is damaged, possibly beyond repair.
As mentioned above, a small number of people can start a supposed "popular" movement to overthrow the democratic will of the people, or even remove governments in favour of their version of democracy, commonly without the messing about of getting voted in.
I'm half expecting some of those extremist fools to start shooting.

Sadly, the left and right both have a very foolish element that believes they're right, regardless of what everyone else thinks, and they're willing to destroy a country to force their opinion on the majority.
We're a long way away from that in the UK at the moment, but a few MPs are openly calling for democracy to be suspended at least as far as this vote is concerned. This is very disturbing behaviour, more so because some elected lawmakers are part of it.

If you allow this once, they will feel empowered and try to go further, just as the right wing racist element like to have a go.

I know I posted this before, but it sums up extremists (and it's funny)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYd9qbRz2fc

Fred wrote:

Expats (and residents) moving in and out of Spain will likely face the old border crossing delays we saw in the past.

Just out of interest, how long is a ferry to Morocco vs waiting time at Spanish border? Because perhaps the Gibraltese could get jobs in Morocco?

Dr. Helmuth Nyborg sees other risks if there is excessive immigration into Europe.
Unfortunately, some of the truths reported in this video may be uncomfortable for some viewers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTdMY9RI-7E

El_Jost wrote:

some of the truths reported in this video may be uncomfortable for some viewers.

What truth?
I've seen less crap on a cow farm.

Is intelligence dependent upon genetics?
Yes
Are those genetics down to race or family lines?
Family.

You simply can't place someone's intelligence by race as this map proves.
A few bits of Europe and a lump of Asia reports the highest IQ scores, but those high IQ areas exported their expats/colonialist invaders to areas with lower IQ results.
Whilst there are clear points where genetics make a difference such as skin colour or nose size, I'm less inclined to believe genetics makes much difference to intelligence within a whole race, but happy to accept it does within family lines.
IQ scores do depend on education as the questions all require a basic education to have any chance of answering them. The worse area of the world is the African continent, an area where education is lacking.
The we move to the North and South of Ireland, places with differing IQ levels but the same genetic population. Oops, the line is a political one, meaning government provided education is most likely to account for the difference. 



And as for racial superiority, have my favourite video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYd9qbRz2fc

What was that about intelligence and racial lines?

Your comments suggest you do not visit cattle farms very often. 

Family / race:
I see it this way. In a homogeneous people it is the sum of all the family lines that build an ethnicity which in turn is a part of that particular race of humanity. We should try to avoid seeing the word “race” as a politically incorrect dirty word like the regressive left does.

When I look at that map I see something different to you. To me it clearly shows a general trend regarding IQ distribution. That is...
Virtually the whole of the northern countries are close to 100.
Far-east Asia tends to be slightly higher ... up to 108
The more tropical countries tend to be lower around 85 or so,
And sub-Sahara Africa drops below 80 or thereabouts.

In evaluating data it's not a question of “I'm less inclined to believe..” or “I'm happy to accept...” With the scientific method one needs to avoid following emotions or personal likes / dislikes and instead to try to base one's evaluation on data-based evidence.

I'm glad you eventually realised that the border between Eire and Northern Ireland is a political one.      
You make the excuse of government education as the reason for any difference there is.
To me a more likely reason would be something like this:
The island of Britain lies close to the European mainland and Britain also has a long coastline on the eastern seaboard. Partly for these reasons Britain has been invaded several times. The invaders that come to mind include the Romans, the Scandinavians (Vikings), the Anglo-Saxons, and the Normans.
Ireland being further removed into the wild Atlantic ocean has been invaded less often than Britain. These invasions may well be the reason why the graph of IQ shows Ireland having an IQ level slightly different from that of Britain. As you point out the graph therefore doesn't show a difference across the common Irish border but in my opinion between the islands of Britain and Ireland.
Such results may surprise the unthinking … but are understandably to others. From logic alone large and sustained invasions can change the genetics of a native population. It would therefore appear that the invasions of Britain have slightly increased the IQ of the native population of Britain.

When you realise that an IQ test is NOT a test of one's educational level (which I suspect you know already Fred) then your argument regarding Africa is rather fallacious, i.e. lack of education.
That said, I know for a fact that fairly good schools have been provided in many African countries, although very often the countries concerned do not have the means to provide education free of charge. In any case, to the best of my knowledge the IQ test only requires a very basic level of literacy.

Finally I would say if we don't understand the reality of intelligence we can't do anything about it … that is, where necessary, to take sensible social & political actions to alleviate for any negative effects.

I remain in disagreement with you, as I'm sure that sound white English nationalist chap would if he had the brains to have a clue what you're talking about.
However, Philip Emeagwali would probably be happy to debate it with you, but that African chap's IQ of 190 sort of speaks for itself and neither of us would stand a hope of keeping up with him anyway.

What was that about Africans not being very clever?

I would suggest you look up and read about the implications of the Normal Distribution curve (AKA the bell curve). That explains to anyone who is interested to learn why the there are individuals of very high and also of very low IQs in any population.

I must admit I have not heard of Philip Emeagwali till now but glad to hear of such an exceptional person who will be able to help his fellow men in Africa.

let's take away all the social, political and environmental problems (including poor diet) from Africa, give them 20 years to adjust whilst adding a UK style education system, then retest.
If people from Africa still come out low I'll vote for Hitler in the following election.

National data shows that most ethnic minorities do better than whites: Chinese, Indian, Irish, Bangladeshi, Asian, African – all are likely to do better than White British.

One recent study found that Black Africans underperform whites at primary school, but by the end of secondary school their attainment is about a third better. And yes, the Poles and East Africans may be wealthier than the average immigrant. But even Bangladeshis, one of the poorest ethnic groups in England, see their children's attainment rise to a par with the average White British – not the poor White British – by the age of 16.

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/02/wh … r-schools/