Foreigners can buy an Apartment but can not rent it ?

Thats how the government keeps us pesky foreigners under control. The only way around it is to have it in a VN name, which can be a dangerous way to do things.

colinoscapee wrote:

Thats how the government keeps us pesky foreigners under control. The only way around it is to have it in a VN name, which can be a dangerous way to do things.

Thanks for the reply.

colinoscapee wrote:

Thats how the government keeps us pesky foreigners under control. The only way around it is to have it in a VN name, which can be a dangerous way to do things.

So does that mean that the posters who have often told us of their purchases and the rental amounts that they expect to receive may be breaking the law?  I won't mention any names but I think you may know of whom I speak.

I consulted a real estate agent, she says it is rumor. I don't know what exactly the law is.

eileengu wrote:

I consulted a real estate agent, she says it is rumor. I don't know what exactly the law is.

The problem is, when you rent out a property it must be declared to the police and tax department. If the premises are in your name they will pick up on it. However, many expats do rent prperties out. Maybe contact Delafon, he said he recently bought and rented out property in Saigon.

THIGV wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

Thats how the government keeps us pesky foreigners under control. The only way around it is to have it in a VN name, which can be a dangerous way to do things.

So does that mean that the posters who have often told us of their purchases and the rental amounts that they expect to receive may be breaking the law?  I won't mention any names but I think you may know of whom I speak.

Ha ha ha....ah yes.
Well, there's a new kid in town in Yogis neck of the woods.    He arrived with a bang, let everyone know who he was on FB and wherever else he could talk himself up.   

He's told all and sundry about several apartments he's bought off the plan . He's splurged over $300k. He'll live in one and rent the others out for his living income .  That's his plan, early retirement in tropical  Vietnam as a property investor / real estate mogul.

However....there's a few things this clown wasn't aware of.   

1.  The building he's bought into is “stalled” , developer has cash flow issues.
2. The developer is facing legal action to stop further construction.
3. The developers Bank has him, his family , his cat ,his dog and everything else by the balls.
4. The developers wife also has mortgages Secured by the land the building is on.
5 . The developers wife has cleared out with his remaining funds.
6. Suppliers, labourers, contractors , banks, street lenders haven't been paid.
7. Bank has right of Vacant possession should the developer clear out.( likely scenario)
8. Developer has gambling debts
9. Developer has a new girlfriend.

To make matters worse the “budding “real estate mogul didn't know the apartments are only bare rough concrete shells. He was shown a fully furnished display unit & thought that's what he was getting.....nope. 😳

BUT....there is light at the end of the tunnel .

He doesn't have to pay the final 5% if the developer doesn't supply the pink book.
Another happy ending .   

Paw 🐾  Note.

For those with suicidal tendencies Yogi would exercise caution to any prospective buyers with regard to Off the Plan purchases....especially SE Asia.

Yogi007 wrote:

THIGV wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

Thats how the government keeps us pesky foreigners under control. The only way around it is to have it in a VN name, which can be a dangerous way to do things.

So does that mean that the posters who have often told us of their purchases and the rental amounts that they expect to receive may be breaking the law?  I won't mention any names but I think you may know of whom I speak.

Ha ha ha....ah yes.
Well, there's a new kid in town in Yogis neck of the woods.    He arrived with a bang, let everyone know who he was on FB and wherever else he could talk himself up.   

He's told all and sundry about several apartments he's bought off the plan . He's splurged over $300k. He'll live in one and rent the others out for his living income .  That's his plan, early retirement in tropical  Vietnam as a property investor / real estate mogul.

However....there's a few things this clown wasn't aware of.   

1.  The building he's bought into is “stalled” , developer has cash flow issues.
2. The developer is facing legal action to stop further construction.
3. The developers Bank has him, his family , his cat ,his dog and everything else by the balls.
4. The developers wife also has mortgages Secured by the land the building is on.
5 . The developers wife has cleared out with his remaining funds.
6. Suppliers, labourers, contractors , banks, street lenders haven't been paid.
7. Bank has right of Vacant possession should the developer clear out.( likely scenario)
8. Developer has gambling debts
9. Developer has a new girlfriend.

To make matters worse the “budding “real estate mogul didn't know the apartments are only bare rough concrete shells. He was shown a fully furnished display unit & thought that's what he was getting.....nope. 😳

BUT....there is light at the end of the tunnel .

He doesn't have to pay the final 5% if the developer doesn't supply the pink book.
Another happy ending .   

Paw 🐾  Note.

For those with suicidal tendencies Yogi would exercise caution to any prospective buyers with regard to Off the Plan purchases....especially SE Asia.

Seems a lot of risks.

BTW, Can you be more specific?

1. Can we buy apartments in a completed building? Do such apartments exist? Or can we buy a second-hand apartment? 

2. Why the developer does not supply a pink book if all things go to this stage?

3. I read some articles indicates that a qualified developer has a “bank guarantee”. So can this avoid the pionts 1-9 you listed above?

Anyway, I suppose you already live in Vietnam for a term. So have you bought any property?

Thanks in advance.

Grrrrrr..
Specific, what's that mean around here. ?

I've read the Govt decree with regard to foreign property “ownership”.
I've also read & spoke to several people in the “game” on what happens with regard to the above.

But the only thing you can take as “gospel” is a statement issued by the National Assembly regarding the new decree.   Simply stated that
“ all implementation, interpretation & dispute resolution with regard to the foreign ownership decree shall be decided upon by LOCAL authorities “. 

So there you have it.   

Anyone with a vested interest in selling you something will tell you what you want to hear. Be careful.

Your concern about the Pink Book.   Well, if the issues with the Banks  and the Tax Office are not resolved by the developer.....you ain't gunna see no pink book sweetie. 😆

That's probably a good time to develop a drinking habit.

As for Yogi,   I'm not looking at buying .   I've actually just sold a place in Australia .   Booms over , time to take the profits and kick back & relax.

When you can rent a place in SE Asia , on the beach for LESS than your electricity bill back home .....why buy.

Yogi says....why buy a cow , when milks so cheap.

Thanks for your opinions, Yogi.

eileengu wrote:

Thanks for your opinions, Yogi.

Opinions.......

Yeah ,,could be seen that way.  But sought from Facts.

If you want to know how much “starch” is behind those facts ,,Yogi can give you the names , email addresses, FB pages of several hapless souls that didn't “ read the instructions “ before coming here.😆😆

But Yogi being such a kind & considerate individual , does not want to subject the said “hapless souls” to any further sarcastic ribbing.   
As for one of them......couldn't of happened to a nicer peice of faecal matter.

eileengu wrote:

BTW, Can you be more specific?
.
.
Anyway, I suppose you already live in Vietnam for a term. So have you bought any property?

I have never seen a post from Yogi describing his own experiences. He always posts what he has heard and about the bad things that have happened to others.

If I had listened all the time to the horror stories in the various forums (poor old men who lost their young Asian wives and/or houses, bla bla bla), I would have missed some wonderful relationships and my present wife.
Then I would probably also post here about all the bad things I've know from hearsay.

If you don't be all too stupid and if you have a good knowledge of human nature (and if you don't believe everything that self-proclaimed experts say) you get through life quite well.

Andy Passenger wrote:

eileengu wrote:

BTW, Can you be more specific?
.
.
Anyway, I suppose you already live in Vietnam for a term. So have you bought any property?

I have never seen a post from Yogi describing his own experiences. He always posts what he has heard and about the bad things that have happened to others.

If I had listened all the time to the horror stories in the various forums (poor old men who lost their young Asian wives and/or houses, bla bla bla), I would have missed some wonderful relationships and my present wife.
Then I would probably also post here about all the bad things I've know from hearsay.

If you don't be all too stupid and if you have a good knowledge of human nature (and if you don't believe everything that self-proclaimed experts say) you get through life quite well.

Better to be warned then to find out the hard way. 😀

Yogi has always stated that he wouldn't invest in Viet Nam. Therefore, he gives examples of others,due to his non-involvement in buying property.

We seem to be discussing the general wisdom of investing in real estate in Vietnam rather than the title question on whether an expat can subsequently use the property as a rental.  The website listed by the OP looks competent and I see no reason why they would want to make up information out of whole cloth.  I have sent them an internal email asking about the statute that they based the statement on.  I will post here if they reply.  If anyone else can directly research VN laws or has a good law firm website, we will all be curious.

http://vietnamlawmagazine.vn/the-housing-law-4041.html

Foreigners may lease out their houses but must notify the lease to the district-level housing management agency before the lease and pay taxes on house lease.

Thank you Colin.  You have effectively shown that foreigners can legally rent out their real property as long as they inform the government.       People can now get beck to arguing over whether buying is a good idea in the first place.   

colinoscapee wrote:

http://vietnamlawmagazine.vn/the-housing-law-4041.html

Foreigners may lease out their houses but must notify the lease to the district-level housing management agency before the lease and pay taxes on house lease.

Yep...it's all about the Tax.  So long as they get that any other issues will soon disolve.😆

My own situation, another Aussie guy and a Viet Kieu all have another arrangement with the Landlords in order to evade Tax.   The Aussie guys mate took his VN wife back to Australia and left him to simply “mind” the house for free.  BUT,   He pays the rent online from one Oz bank to another . No transactions within VN.

The US Viet kieu guy has installed another Aussie as simply a family friend that's come to “stay”. He's been in the place for 3 years.  Again, all payments in cash .

As for Yogi....since I'm a bear 🐻 my owner has provided me with my own living quarters .  They don't want Yogi pooping on their lounge.

Have a good day all. 🤓

Yogi007 wrote:

My own situation, another Aussie guy and a Viet Kieu all have another arrangement with the Landlords in order to evade Tax.

This is absurd.
People complain about the bad infrastructure and in HCMC they hope for rising real estate prices after the metro is finished.
But they don't want to pay taxes.
And who should pay all this? The good Lord?

Hey Andy,

Yep......Absurd is what it is. 😆

No one likes paying tax apparently 🤓.  My landlady only put me on a lease because the nosey neighbours dobbed her in for getting good lease money from a foreigner after  the VN family bailed out.

But she's cunning. I've signed TWO leases. 

One is for Tax purposes, which is a ridiculous amount....only 35% of what I'm actually paying.  The other is a “gentleman's “ agreement so to speak.   However,,,The original lease expired 3 years ago.   

Theoretically, the apartment is empty....but I'm still here.

If anyone asks what Yogi pays,( as people do) I'm to refer all such enquiries to her.   I'm basically an extension of family living “apparently “  free of charge , just keeping an eye on things. 😳

Who am I to complain, I'm a visitor, you just go with the flow.    You along with the rest of us know that gaming the system is how a lot of things here get done.   

But eventually those games come at a cost to the country's development.     In your home country & mine , the cost of infrastructure seems to mostly come from Tax revenue.   

And Saigon certainly needs a boost to the infrastructure budget

Andy Passenger wrote:

This is absurd.
People complain about the bad infrastructure and in HCMC they hope for rising real estate prices after the metro is finished.
But they don't want to pay taxes.
And who should pay all this? The good Lord?

You have hit on one of the key problems in moving Vietnam from being a developing to a developed country.  People don't want to pay taxes but expect the benefits of government.  I suppose in theory in a Socialist country, the profits of State Owned Enterprises should foot all the bills for things like public safety, education, and socialized medicine for all.  Of course we know how that works, with a select few siphoning off the profits of SOE.  For Vietnam to advance economically, there needs to be a quantum cultural shift toward the concept that taxes result in services and that all should pay a fair share.  Police have to be bribed because they are underpaid and they are underpaid because nobody in the local market is paying VAT.  Doctors have to hold night clinics at home because they are underpaid at the hospitals.   Teachers hold cram classes for students because the schools don't pay a living wage.   

Middle and High schools began to charge tuition in 1986 as a consequence of Đổi Mới despite the previous mandate for free education.  If it does nothing else, a modern state should be able to raise sufficient taxes to fully support K-12 education.  People got the right to operate private stores and other private businesses but chose not to assume the subsequent responsibility to surrender a portion of their profits for the common good.  The people took the benefits of Đổi Mới without assuming the responsibilities.  The only way out of this cycle is a massive change in attitude towards the concept of paying taxes.

By the way Article 47 of the Vietnamese Constitution states:  Everyone has the obligation to pay taxes in accordance with the law.

Yogi007 wrote:

Yogi says....why buy a cow , when milks so cheap.

Because milking a cow is more fun than drinking off the cartons?!     Sorry Yogi.  Couldn't help myself.

Apology accepted Yoda.😆

Actually, (yogi will go off topic🤓 )  I grew up on a farm milking cows & then into beef cattle.    But I don't drink milk and prefer chicken.

What went wrong Yoda.?

colinoscapee wrote:

http://vietnamlawmagazine.vn/the-housing-law-4041.html

Foreigners may lease out their houses but must notify the lease to the district-level housing management agency before the lease and pay taxes on house lease.

My original lease ( the bogus one) was registered at a Govt Notary Office , but the landlady also had  to require a permit to allow the property to be leased, especially to a foreigner.   But around here, the “rules” seem to change from ward to ward on what's required regarding permits & lease registration.

The last “arrangement” was done at a Cafe with a guy in a green shirt.  I'm just wondering if  coffee money & Tax have the same meaning on VN google translate.😆

The general theme seems to be that any (permit) fees , registration costs etc,, are easier to pay under the table.  That money will never get to government coffers for spending on health, roads,education etc.     

It'll just be partied away in karaoke bars and BBQ joints.

Well, thanks for all the information. I will decide it on my own.

Hope I can do the right things.

colinoscapee wrote:

Andy Passenger wrote:

eileengu wrote:

BTW, Can you be more specific?
.
.
Anyway, I suppose you already live in Vietnam for a term. So have you bought any property?

I have never seen a post from Yogi describing his own experiences. He always posts what he has heard and about the bad things that have happened to others.

If I had listened all the time to the horror stories in the various forums (poor old men who lost their young Asian wives and/or houses, bla bla bla), I would have missed some wonderful relationships and my present wife.
Then I would probably also post here about all the bad things I've know from hearsay.

If you don't be all too stupid and if you have a good knowledge of human nature (and if you don't believe everything that self-proclaimed experts say) you get through life quite well.

Better to be warned then to find out the hard way. 😀

Yogi has always stated that he wouldn't invest in Viet Nam. Therefore, he gives examples of others,due to his non-involvement in buying property.

Hmm... Yogi seems a regular poster here?

colinoscapee wrote:

http://vietnamlawmagazine.vn/the-housing-law-4041.html

Foreigners may lease out their houses but must notify the lease to the district-level housing management agency before the lease and pay taxes on house lease.

Thanks for the answer and reference.

Andy Passenger wrote:

Yogi007 wrote:

My own situation, another Aussie guy and a Viet Kieu all have another arrangement with the Landlords in order to evade Tax.

This is absurd.
People complain about the bad infrastructure and in HCMC they hope for rising real estate prices after the metro is finished.
But they don't want to pay taxes.
And who should pay all this? The good Lord?

Truely. So as I assume the price of real estate will be up once the metro is completed.

Tax is reasonable for better infrastructure.

Hang on guys....
Did I see the word hearsay mentioned?

FYI....I' actually know these people, have met them , live in the same town & THEY have recalled their experiences to me ( which was no surprise)  given the way they go about doing things.

You don't have to jump off the cliff with them to know what they've done. 

As for mug that “bought” several apartments here in Khanh Hoa , in a highly risky project , I know him too.  I'll bet his deceased mother would turn in her grave if she knew what he did with the Estate money.   

Been here in VN 7 years, but have been visiting and working in SE Asia for many years before that in an industry that funds M&As ,JV projects, Commercial , Industrial & Residential property development & financing / leasing in general. 

After a while you develop a “ nose” for anything that appears smelly.
ie , 800% rise in land prices in 6 months in landfever hysteria here.  There's also a reason why 75% of court matters here involve property disputes.

Some of my initial posts on the forum have often highlighted the risks involved in doing business here.  What did I say......

The Multi Nationals (whom I worked for) do very well in these developing countries mainly due to the fact they use OTHER PEOPLES MONEY.

Shareholders Money
Tax payers money in JV infrastructure projects
Banks money
Private equity etc..

If it all turns to crap,  guess who doesn't lose their shirt.

Yogi does invest in VN....but indirectly as a stock holder in a few successful multi nationals  that do  well here.   If Yogi sniffs something in the wind , he can cash out with the tap of his pinky or the click of a mouse.

A lot of popular threads on forums in SE Asia involve personal relationship & property issues.   It's famous for mugs coming here , only to limp back where they came from physically, mentally & financially screwed.    I've seen it too many times.

But they keep coming and a lot simply can't see , or don't want to see the pitfalls that can deceive you.

It can be a waste of time giving your views or opinions on things., because the problem with stupid people is....they don't know they're stupid.

Take it easy guys & good luck.🐾🐾🐾🐾🐾

eileengu wrote:

Truely. So as I assume the price of real estate will be up once the metro is completed

As the route is firmly established, the appreciation that results for property along the line must already factored in a while back.

Good luck...a lot of people already moving to Vietnam from China and I understand the Vietnamese aren't real keen on that.

btw, I'm a huge Yogi fan..love reading his posts.

Texan71 wrote:

Good luck...a lot of people already moving to Vietnam from China and I understand the Vietnamese aren't real keen on that.

btw, I'm a huge Yogi fan..love reading his posts.

You mean Chinese moving here or expats.

colinoscapee wrote:

Texan71 wrote:

Good luck...a lot of people already moving to Vietnam from China and I understand the Vietnamese aren't real keen on that.

btw, I'm a huge Yogi fan..love reading his posts.

You mean Chinese moving here or expats.

Pretty clear I said Chinese.
I only visit but am sure expats are sometimes maybe frowned upon but a lot of Vietnamese I talk to do not like Chinese...not much at all

Texan71 wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

Texan71 wrote:

Good luck...a lot of people already moving to Vietnam from China and I understand the Vietnamese aren't real keen on that.

btw, I'm a huge Yogi fan..love reading his posts.

You mean Chinese moving here or expats.

Pretty clear I said Chinese.
I only visit but am sure expats are sometimes maybe frowned upon but a lot of Vietnamese I talk to do not like Chinese...not much at all

Pretty clear you never said Chinese, hence why I asked.

Either there are no anti-discrimination housing laws in Vietnam or they are not well enforced.  If people do not like Chinese, very little is stopping them from not renting to them, except of course the desire to collect rent.

Texan71 wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

Texan71 wrote:

Good luck...a lot of people already moving to Vietnam from China and I understand the Vietnamese aren't real keen on that.

btw, I'm a huge Yogi fan..love reading his posts.

You mean Chinese moving here or expats.

Pretty clear I said Chinese.
I only visit but am sure expats are sometimes maybe frowned upon but a lot of Vietnamese I talk to do not like Chinese...not much at all

"People moving here from China" is not the same as saying "Chinese" are moving here from China.

I know you understand you think we read what you thought you said, but do you realize that what we actually saw was not what you really meant?

Nothing to see here

THIGV wrote:

Either there are no anti-discrimination housing laws in Vietnam or they are not well enforced.  If people do not like Chinese, very little is stopping them from not renting to them, except of course the desire to collect rent.

Here is a small paragraph quote from a report about how Vietnam was going to create economic zones for “foreign investment” mainly from China

“(Reuters) - China has warned its citizens in Vietnam after protesters clashed with police over a government plan to create new economic zones for foreign investment that has fueled anti-Chinese sentiment in the country......Vietnam's National Assembly agreed on Monday to delay a vote on the draft bill, which would allow foreign investors to lease land for up to 99 years and provide greater incentives and fewer restrictions than at present in the country.

OceanBeach92107 wrote:

Texan71 wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

You mean Chinese moving here or expats.

Pretty clear I said Chinese.
I only visit but am sure expats are sometimes maybe frowned upon but a lot of Vietnamese I talk to do not like Chinese...not much at all

"People moving here from China" is not the same as saying "Chinese" are moving here from China.

I know you understand you think we read what you thought you said, but do you realize that what we actually saw was not what you really meant?

hmmm, whose on first?

Texan71 wrote:

OceanBeach92107 wrote:

Texan71 wrote:

Pretty clear I said Chinese.
I only visit but am sure expats are sometimes maybe frowned upon but a lot of Vietnamese I talk to do not like Chinese...not much at all

"People moving here from China" is not the same as saying "Chinese" are moving here from China.

I know you understand you think we read what you thought you said, but do you realize that what we actually saw was not what you really meant?

hmmm, whose on first?

Whose on first and who's on second!!!!