Cost of Living in Greece in 2020

I have limited experience on many aspects of life in Greece as I retired before arriving here, however based on my 6 years of living in Athens and experiences living in the US as a working adult, I can make the following comments:

1. Greek average income is quite low compared to the US and other EU countries, yet expenses are in many cases on a par. On average, groceries appear to be about the same as elsewhere if not marginally higher.
2. Labor/services are very lowly paid while manufactured goods such as refrigerators sinks or other household goods are on a par.
3. Compared to the US, cars are very inexpensive but that makes me wonder what might be different in their manufacture, as that seems counterintuitive. 
4. Restaurants are nearly as expensive as those overseas, which must therefore be very expensive for a greek wage earner....and yet there are so, so many of them that are almost always packed full of people as if money is no problem! Where does all this disposable income come from? I wonder how they do it!!
5. Average rent here is  very low and controlled by renters, as a result of the Greek financial disaster that drove income down the tubes, making it a much better deal to rent, than to own. Buying and owning property was once a driving force of the economy, but exorbitantly gouging property taxes have choked this market dead, leaving little incentive for new construction, which would drive desperately needed growth to a country desperately in need of growth.
6. The 24% Value Added regressive Tax (VArT) on purchased goods but also imposed on services, is criminal in that it significantly encourages a black market while it saps every person's spending capacity, giving the government money it is not ethically entitled to, other than by passing any regulation it feels it can get away with! Most importantly, it deprives the country of desperately needed capital to provide growth so that it might someday climb out of it's desperately impossible to manage debt. In the US the maximin sales tax as far as I know is 8-9% in CA where I lived and does not apply to food or services. Occasional efforts to raise that tax is met with enormous political resistance, which I find amazing not to see here. The EU VAT taxation mechanism is looked upon with horror and has prevented any such national purchasing taxation in the US as Americans watched it creep up over the years the EU. In the UK, VAT was first imposed in the 70's @ 10% and has gradually risen to 20% with exceptions but my god!! 20% in a country that is well off is just too much to swallow!! No wonder they felt like Exiting! So the cost of living in Greece is not only too high as a result of high VAT but also serves as a brake on investing in Greece not only by Greeks, but also by foreigners wishing to bring in industry or digital services, sending them to other less restrictive Third World counties.

I could go on about other stuff but on the surface, here are some factors to consider. I am not interested in arguing my points ad nauseam but here they are. I also wonder how many people actually are members of this forum, how effective is any conversation here.

Hi nixterman,I believe that rents are now getting sky high,they did go very low in the crisis period but as I read from the Greek news landlords are over doing it and charging what ever they see fit and that appears to be way over the top and greedy considering wages are in some cases very low indeed still.I too often wonder how people with fairly low wages manage to eat out so much but from experience I see that they order large plates,bowls of everything and share it all and the bill rather that individual ordering.Of course the problem with that is the greedy fast eaters get the lot haaa like a cloud of locusts,so I normally insist on ordering my own non fat healthy food if I ever eat out in a group,and keep my plates real close.I do find the street fruit/veg markets fantastic and if you go around two pm just before they finish you get lots of bargains.

Hello Concertina; I believe that the rents remain very low and will remain low until growth changes the economy of the country and salaries grow to pay the increased rent -which as far as I can see, is beyond the horizon, until some kind of change in economic policy is enacted that will bring massive investment to Greece. I think you are referring to specific, desired, already wealthy areas of Athens and other desired areas such as some islands. While this is good news, it mostly affects the wealthy few and is totally insufficient to change the state of this nation as one that cannot pay her debts without capital gifts (or loans which increase debt).

Your description of how you deal with meals at restaurants is amusing and fascinating but does not shed light on the expensive habit of eating out as often as it seems most people in Athens do. The desperation of having to wait for the street markets to close so that one can take advantage of clearing prices only reflects the tragic state of the general population.

The wealthy seem to hardly care that their compatriots suffer while they take tours of the islands in their yachts. I marvel at how calm everyone is, watching the demise of their country without taking decisive action. I expected to see concerted efforts to get Greece back up on her feet when I arrived here but nothing happened at all as if things are just dandy! It certainly must have consequences to the readiness of her military, which I am sure greedy neighbors are following to see when -not if- they might take advantage.

Any crisis like the US being consumed by something like the current virus epidemic could serve as catalyst. Such events are not gradual; they are sudden and very permanent. A quick look at what happened to Cyprus confirms this. Keeping Greece in a depressed economy can have very serious consequences and while nothing happens we seem to be happy. But when things change for the worse it will be too late. Greeks are tempting fate and its not a political issue as it seems it doesn't matter who's in charge, but a cultural one. I look forward to be proved wrong as soon as something changes this status quo.

Dear all,

The initiator of this post being busy elsewhere, I must make this remark to you.

Thank you for your comparison with US market price. But it's absolutely not what was requested... Give us the amount you pay locally for each point.

You must understand that an expat coming from Asia / Africa / Europe /... is not necessarily aware of the cost of American life.

What interests him to know is how much it will cost him compared to the cost of living in his own country.

phipiemar,

I find your reaction quite unreasonable as it is addressed only to me, as it seems that I am the only one to respond to this request! I can only relate prices to my experiences, which are confined to the EU and the USA. I am a bit surprised that you find my comments not to your liking but this is how I chose to respond to the request, so take it for what its worth. I was careful and took a good amount of time to write the two comments I submitted, even as I wondered if it was worth my while to do so in the first place. It has been a good while since I last provided commentary and will think even harder the next time, should there be one.

Who knows, perhaps others might find them more interesting than you did. I think you are a bit too extreme in your reaction. You might have expected something else and I'm really sorry I cannot oblige, but the subject matter is still related to what was asked and FYI there are Americans, Canadians, and other Anglo-Saxons that visit Greece and I would hazard to say there are more of those visitors than Africans, Middle or East Asians or even Moldavians. In any case, you'll have to get their reaction but from what it seems here, nobody actually visits this site except a very very few with whom I have had what seems almost like private conversations in the past. So perhaps you might consider working on expanding your membership somehow, instead of criticizing the few you already have.

You might find that allowing the comments to develop organically, provide better quality and more lively conversations than if you attempt to restrict and hobble them to fit your preconceived ideas. In any case, you could have held back your reaction until you got more than two people engaged in the conversation. Thanks!

First, I didn't target you.  This is why I started with the appropriate courtesy formula.

Second, your approach may make sense to you.  But nobody knows your budget.

Third, whatever the person's origin, if a kilo of potato costs one euro in Greece.  The information is clear and the person translates it into their currency.

Fourth, every year this question is asked.  So that everyone can get an idea of ​​their reality.

In conclusion, I can't help it if you take it that way.  But I remain on the fact that when you read your comment, a Belgian or a Brazilian is unable to know how much a kilo of dough costs in Greece since in addition I do not know how much it costs in the USA ...

Cordially yours

Since I was the only one to reply, it cannot be construed otherwise and you should realize and accept your actions. Who else were you addressing your comments to? The "courtesy formula" is but a tool of evasion.

I get it that you like to measure potatoes per pound or kilo, but that is the way you think, not all of us. And to be clear that mechanism is no clearer than mine, as potatoes or dough might be cheap and indigenous to one's country or imported and expensive. I relate stuff. This feels more expensive, that doesn't. Some people think like you, others like me. Belgians or Brazilians are not blank checks without their own experiences. They get what I say. My budget is my business and I don't choose to share it. As for figuring out what potatoes cost in the USA, if you have a computer or a smart device, look it up!

My point is that since the discussion is ON topic it cannot but provide insight. Let's not forget that if one is an Expat, he or she travels and perhaps they have been around too. Not everyone on this site is a person looking to emigrate from a destitute country. if so, then I'm in the wrong place.

As regards food it depends on your personal budget and we cant itemise every type of food here but as with everywhere on the planet in these times most average earners shop around if they have the time,not everybody does,they can only give one big hit in one store per week.We go between many especially the small business so as to keep them going,However that depends always on their prices.We pass through Megara on the way to our cottage and drop into a food/veg/fruit store owned by people from India and my word,amazing prices for big bags of lentils,mung beans,basmati rice,flour,nice crisp red apples for one euro a kilo,they bring mangos in about june,the best ever,Im a mango freak and then we pass on down to Alepohori to a very insignificant looking small food store but it has packets of sunflower seeds for 55 cents,biological brown wild rice 2.50 cents,black biological fakes,like small lentils,2.50,lovely packs of dates one euro each.In summer we buy on the country roads fruit and veg,people sell from their land.You have to realise that this is the land of beautiful fresh and dried flood and you will eat very well if you buy local produce or find like me stores out of the city.In country areas you will find people with herds of sheep and goats, they sell the milk,one and half litres for 2 euro,you boil it for two minutes or so.In my village the bread shop owner has sheep and sells the milk,what a paradise food situation.We buy meat in megara,the softest beef you have ever had but you have go about looking for the sellers.Its not only price its quality,better to have less of really healthy food than loads of rubbish.With regards to medical care,if you dont have the state system you can afford care up to the point of surgery,private doctors are available at reasonable price as are most tests,its doable as long as you have a reasonable financial situation,diagnostic centres are everywhere unlike the UK.Surgery you need money as everywhere else on the planet but everywhere else does not have the pre-surgery diagnostics and private specialists as Greece does.Over all I would say to anyone thinking of moving to Greece,do it if you are financially sound,theres great food,private schools for your children,not the very expansive posh ones,local,they pick up the kids and drop them home,you see the yellow vans about.Not crazy money,doable,...so do it...

Im sorry to say even the poorer suburbs like Egaileo where I am are are seeing rents going significantly up,take a look on line and you will see big prices per month,way above what people can seriously afford and people dont house share here with strangers but do receive quite a lot of help from family financially which seems to hold everything together.

Well if they are going up while people can't afford them, then the units will stay empty until the prices drop or incomes rise..... The market in this case checks itself and rents stay at affordable levels because the owner usually prefers to have some income rather than none....

Hi nixterman,I do wish that was so but people must have a roof over their heads and if all that is available is very expensive then the have to pay,landlords know that,why to put their property at low rent when they can get loads like every other landlord,greed is an incredible thing,they have no mercy for renters, the same as commercial rents,they are killing business and they all of them and private have no rent caps set by the government,they want thousands each month for a tiny hole in the wall cafe.people are living on the river Thames in london on houseboats in a tiny bed size room with the rain coming through the ceiling,no shower room,a bucket for a toilet,electricity for one hour per day,they join a gym so as to shower and for that wonderful deal they pay 3.50 per month,its the best they can do or pay over a thousand elsewhere plus council tax.Its a crazy situation and shouldnt be allowed,I know someone who rents in Maroosi near the train station,must be huge rent,all damp in some rooms from the flat terrace above,they complain,the owner promises action but doesnt deliver.So,we can understand working people living in tent city,they cant even make enough to cover the rent let alone squeeze it out of a salary.

phippiemar,you have to know that this is not Bulgaria here or Albania or Romania,or some Asian countries,its not cheap,rents are not dirt cheap, neither is food,clothes..there are plenty of second hand clothes shops with great things for two euro each,I bought this morning some,winter coats,lush.but you have to make the effort and shop around as one does in the UK.America etc.. I guess as well.The street markets are cheaper than the supermarkets for fruit,veg etc.. even if you go early.

Hi Concertina,

Nice to meet you, I know that.  Because I walk the forums in all directions.  And like everyone else, I look at my budget.  In Belgium we also have secondhand shop and street markets, The vast majority of my furniture was bought second-hand.  I instilled these values ​​in my children.

Now how do you establish the cost of living in a country without having quantified values?  It is a simple matter of logic.  Imagine that you want to settle in Belgium and that you ask me the question of cost.  If I answer you that renting my house costs me less in Belgium than in Brazil.  Do you think this will help you?

Well I don't disagree that abuse exists everywhere especially when people are more vulnerable. Renting a unit, settling in and then having the landlord raise the rent expecting you'd succumb to blackmail is nothing new. In general conditions have worsened globally as the wealth gap has grown everywhere as a result of powerful self-centered people taking over government and redistributing taxes to serve themselves.

But this is not the subject of discussion that the moderator began. It just deals with relative costs and in my opinion if the rent of a unit on some street of Egaleo is too high, one has to look for another one in another location. It's next to impossible to compare rental rates city to city because of the variability of locations, demand and luxury level. Someone living on the Copacabana coast of Rio might understand that his rent is higher than what something in the barrio might run, if any, but if he has not been to Athens, he cannot tell if a rental rate for a unit is for the equivalent Copacabana area or Athenian barrio. This is why one hires a Realestate agent and this is why it is so hard to relate the price of potatoes from one country to the next, to borrow from a different conversation, I'm having here....

Have you noticed that you and I have been constantly on this blog site over the years, while not many others take part? I'm feeling that apart form the moderators, we might be alone here..... Do you feel the same? 

Deat nixterman,yes we seem alone for sure but hey ho,these are strange times where people dont join in and give feed back.There is a small one bed flat down my road here owned by my husbands relatives,they have now a tenant for 200 per month but refused to make a formal contract.Your looking at 350 to 600 per month for 2 beds around here.Lots more in posh areas.If you put electric heating on and use your oven like every day then your bill will be around 250 to 300 for 2 months because you have the council charge,some tax and a charge for the public TV channel,which is fat lazy cats on big salaries putting on news and repeat films every day.Athens water bill is reasonable but the water is not,sooo much chlorine,we bring mountain water with us from our village area.Travel costs..you can have a monthly metro ticket which maybe gives you buses as well,Im not sure,or 1.40 per day for 90 mins or a longer duration ticket.Airport is expensive,its 10 euro one way on the metro.Now the health..private insurance is pretty high but as I said,if you can afford to pay yourself up to pre surgery point which is doable then just pay the private surgeon,clinic,anethatist,medication etc.. .believe me its not humungus like the UK,only a dream there to do that,you can here,I had bunions done and it was 4 and half thousand each one because I didnt do them together,one by one.My husband has private health care from his job.The state care is definately to be avoided.Finally property prices are up and they sell some real rubbish for 60 and 70,not fit for your dog,loads to spend on it.I think its best to live outside of the city of Athens,Greece has just been warned about the pollution in Athens by the EU,I cant take these blokes of flats much more,we shall move to Megalo Pefko along the coast above the old rail line and buy a cheap leomeno build house and have a garden with flowers in the front garden,gently swaying in the wind,not the house haa,the flowers.Its hill billy there,odd balls,gardens,trees,spare land,sheep and a herder we saw today there,its marvelous.Greece is not for the stinky city,its for out in the nature and calm,green,open skies.So nixterman and phipiemar I think we have given the gyst of things here,it was great to hear from you again nixterman and meet you phipiemar,ask away for any other imfo.

I do find even very general prices of things helps.  I am a few years away from retirement and am in the planning stages.  Every little piece of information is useful.