Getting permanent residency/citizenship and surviving financially

OK,  in short.

Forget about citizenship,  permanent resident is non-existing.

You come in on an Ordinary  (E) visa valid for 30 days.
In the country you apply in time for a general extension of stay (EG)  for 6 months. 
This is the extension for job seekers.

If no job after 7 months you have to leave the country but can come back and do the same 7 months process.  That way you got 14 months to find a job or start your own business.

Private teaching is a job and needs a work permit plus a business extension of stay (EB).

If caught working without the right paperwork you will be expelled and blacklisted.

In order to get yourself a teaching job follow a TEFL course  on line,  with the certificate you have more chance to get a good job.

As long as you have a job you can stay in Cambodia,  once you get 55 you can change to a retirement extension of stay (ER) but not allowed to work. 

Cheers

Joe
Cambodia expert
Expat.com team

joe, thanks for the detailed response.

i have some follow up questions:

"Forget about citizenship,  permanent resident is non-existing. "

just to be clear, you mean that i have no chance of getting citizenship, and permanent residency is not offered.  is that correct?

so it sounds like i am unable to enter cambodia on an E visa for 12 months while i look for a job.  is that correct?

so i have 14 months total to find a job or leave?

classroom teaching sounds like it would be too much for me, since i´m an introvert.
what are my chances of getting a job teaching english in private lessons legally? 

i do not have any special skills.  i only have a bachelor´s degree in psychology.  what are my chances of getting a non-english teaching job? 

and what kind of non-english teaching jobs could i realistically get?

thanks

Hello.

You ask questions that I cannot answer.

How could I estimate the chance for you to teach, whether English or not, or in private?

The visa extension system I have explained and in that system you have 14 months to find a job or start your own business.
There is no way to come in and get a one year job seeker extension.

Permanent resident does not exist and citizenship is a long way, including speaking writing the language and being 7 years in the country.

Hope this helps.

Cheers

Joe

thanks

Joe,

I wanted to ask a few more things:

1. Would you be able to roughly estimate what percentage of people who apply for citizenship after 7 years are able to acquire citizenship?

2. About jobs - are there rules that make it harder for americans to get jobs in cambodia such as that americans can only get a job if no cambodian is able to do the job or any other similar restrictions?

Thanks

No.

You are strange man. Because much more people dream to move in opposite direction.

1.  There are clear rules about get citizenship.  May be it will long and need some money. I sure, anybody can get it.  You need to leave 7 years and learn khmer language as well. There are to additional points.
    a) rules can change during that years.
    b) you can reduce this estimate of residence by marry to a local women. Then estimate will 3-4 years. Check that case!

2, yes Cambodia has it!  Work permit and visas require fee. About 500-600$ per one year.  Also you don't have rights to work on some professions.  Think it is regular worker positions, but is not teachers or translators. That's all!

About Cambodian visas - https://www.movetocambodia.com/planning … dia-visas/
Think  there are some non-profit funds who looking for teachers, may help you at first time, and answer for all questions - https://www.gooverseas.com/blog/salary- … n-cambodia

Also some times I see positions for chinese speakers there - http://pelprek.com/

misterinternational, very few expats in Cambodia become citizens, that tells you something. Some decide not to stay in the kingdom, some pass away, some get divorced much sooner than expected and many just don't see the point. It's not like getting a Singaporean passport, you know (best in the world for traveling, German is 2nd).

Why are you so keen on this, if I may ask? How much time have you spent in Cambodia so far (I recommend a lot before making any big decisions)?

The following was official info from several years ago (no idea if something has changed, except for the financial figures, those certainly will have):

"  CHAPTER III

    KHMER NATIONALITY/CITIZENSHIP BY MARRIAGE

    Article 5:

    A foreign man or woman that marries a Khmer wife or husband may demand Khmer nationality/citizenship only if such man and women have been living together for a period of three (3) years, after registration of a marriage certificate.

    A formality and procedure for the demand of Khmer nationality/citizenship, shall be determined by anukret.

    The grant of Khmer nationality/citizenship following the case of demand for it, shall be decided by kret.

    Article 6:

    Khmer citizens shall not lose their Khmer nationality/ citizenship because of they got married with foreigners.

    CHAPTER IV

    NATURALIZATION

    Article 7:

    Foreigners may apply for Khmer nationality/citizenship through naturalization.

    Naturalization is not a right of the applicant, but only a favor of the Kingdom of Cambodia. In any case, such application may also be rejected by a discretionary power.

    Article 8:

    A foreigner who may apply for naturalization shall fulfil the following conditions:

    shall have a paper certifying that he/she has good behavior and moral conduct issued by the chief of the commune (Khum) or quarter (Sangkat) of his/her own residence.
    shall have a letter of certification of the past criminal record that stated that he/she had never been convicted for any criminal offence before.
    shall have a paper certifying that such person has his/her residence in the Kingdom of Cambodia and who has been living continuously for seven (7) years from the date of reception of a residence card that was issued under framework of the Law on Immigration.
    shall have residence in the Kingdom of Cambodia at the time when he/she is applying for naturalization.
    shall be able to speak Khmer, know Khmer scripts and has some knowledge of Khmer history, and prove clear evidence that he/she can live in harmony in Khmer society as well as can get used to good Khmer custom and tradition.
    shall have his/her mentality and physical aptitude which will cause neither danger nor burden to the nation.
    Article 9:

    For any foreigner who is born in the Kingdom of Cambodia, the 7 years period of continuously living as stated in the sub-para 3 of the article 8 of this law, shall instead be decreased to 3 years.

    Article 10:

    For any foreigner who had received a letter of authorization for investment from the Cambodian Development Council (CDC.) and who had implemented concretely the actual project cost by spending an initial capital of from 1,250,000,000 riels and up, the period of living as stated in the sub-para. 3 of the article 8 of this law, shall be exempted.

    Article 11:

    For any foreigner who has no letter of authorization for investment from the Cambodian Development Council (CDC.), but who had received authorization for investment legitimately from the Royal Government and who had spent initial capital of from 1,250,000,000 riels and up, the period of living as stated in the sub-para 3 of the article 8 of this law, shall be exempted.

    Article 12:

    Any foreigner who has made a donation in cash, to the national budget of from 1,000,000,000 riels or more, for the interest of restoration and rebuilding of economy of the Kingdom of Cambodia, may have right to file an application for Khmer nationality, in case when upon he/she has fulfilled the conditions as stated in the sub-paragraphs 1, 2, 5 and 6 of the article 8 of this law.

    Article 13:

    A foreigner who has shown evidence that he/she had offered any special merit or achievement for the interest of the Kingdom of Cambodia, may file an application for Khmer nationality and with no need to fulfil the conditions as stated in the sub-para.3 of the article 8 of this law.

    Article 14:

    A foreigner who has a spouse or child/children of under 18 years of age, who also intend(s) to apply for Khmer nationality/ citizenship, may file an application for naturalization in term as a family as a whole.

    A family consists of a husband, wife and child/children under 18 years of age.

    Article 15:

    A foreigner may apply to change to a Khmer name. In such case, he/she shall specify such name in writing in his/her application for naturalization.

    Article 16:

    Naturalization, which is granted to any person, shall be decided by a kret.

    The formality and procedure for applying for naturalization, shall be determined by an anukret.

    Article 17:

    Those who got authorization to acquire Khmer nationality, shall take an oath before the Supreme Court.

    The substance of this above oath will be provided for in an anukret."

Owning property residing for more than 1 year becoming resident Asians in general are not big on sharing or welcoming

Just to explain, all expats staying more than 180 days per year in the country are considered residents.

Not to be confused with permanent residents, as such a thing does not exist.

Cheers.

Joe

Mr_Dome wrote:

...A foreign man or woman that marries a Khmer wife or husband may demand Khmer nationality/citizenship only if such man and women have been living together for a period of three (3) years, after registration of a marriage certificate. ...

If a Cambodian gets married to a Singaporean in Singapore (or elsewhere), are the period of 3 years started to count until their SG marriage cert gets attested/registered by the Cambodian embassy?

Can the couple apply and receive a Cambodian marriage certificate from the embassy by presenting a local one?

Embassy can do nothing.

Marriage has to be registered at the sangkat of the Cambodian citizen.

Joe

thanks for all the responses, everyone

are expats able to get english teaching jobs for private lessons, or are the english teaching jobs all for classroom teaching?

mr_dome,

"misterinternational, very few expats in Cambodia become citizens, that tells you something. Some decide not to stay in the kingdom, some pass away, some get divorced much sooner than expected and many just don't see the point. It's not like getting a Singaporean passport, you know (best in the world for traveling, German is 2nd).

Why are you so keen on this, if I may ask? How much time have you spent in Cambodia so far (I recommend a lot before making any big decisions)?"

i´m just thinking about moving to asia and am researching which countries i have a realistic chance to make it in.  and if i decide to go forward with the plan, i will check out some countries that i think i can realistically make it in and see which ones i like the most.  i actually have never been in cambodia.

you mentioned that very few expats become cambodian citizens.  can you speak more about the negatives of living in cambodia?

thanks

Thank you for explaining,, misterinternational.

You can definitely "make it" in Cambodia (or a different Asian country) , without needing or having citizenship.

Very few expats become Cambodian citizens because IMHO, a. Cambodia is traditionally not a country that people immigrate to (excluding the Chinese- & Vietnamese-Khmers here, for a moment). B. the process requires a lot of motivation and either a very stable living & marital situation or about half a million US$ for the donation. C. the benefits to the recipient if coming from the West are rather limited as explained (why lose your pension/benefits and in exchange for what exactly (my country doesn't allow a 2nd citizenship, I understand that many others have different rules, so this is an extreme case) ? It's easy to own a house or land right of the plane). And finally, d. people change their minds sometimes and end up changing countries before plans of staying for life can mature.

The negative aspects of living in Cambodia are a whole different issue and everyone coming to the kingdom will have their personal dislikes, hopefully outweighed by the love for this amazing country and her people. I do realize that it's not my culture or my aesthetic approach to things, The destruction of the environment is hard to take for me after experiencing the changes in the same area in the last 5 years. The political situation has worsened a lot since things looked so promising a few years ago (as a guest one better zips it on that topic). And yet, I haven't found a better place for myself.

It's the resilient type of personality that is open, flexible and doesn't have too many attachments that will be successfully at adapting to a new country but that applies everywhere.

Mr Dome: quote <It's easy to own a house or land right of the plane>

I would like to ask you to state true things and not things that are permanently not true.

Quote:
Foreigners cannot own land in Cambodia, under Article 44 of the Constitution.

Nevertheless foreigners can establish control over land in four ways:

    Land can be bought through a local company.
    Land can be leased.
    Acquiring Cambodian citizenship brings the right to buy land, a route actively encouraged by the government.
    Land is sometimes bought through a Cambodian nominee, but this has been ruled to be against Constitution, and is unsafe. /quote

So please stick to the reality, it's already difficult enough.

On top I would ask everyone to let this thread rest a while.
The OP has never been in Cambodia, doesn't know which country he will go to and is an example of someone who has no idea what to do in life. His profile shows this: <American looking for information about Brazil>
Let him first sort out his preferences, if that is Cambodia we all will be ready to help out.

Thanks

Joe
Cambodia expert
Expat.com team

That's because i currently am an expat living in brazil.  I am just not sure that i want to live here for the rest of my life

That's fine.

But wait with more questions about Cambodia until you have decided to what country you will expatriate next.

Thanks.

Joe

You have been asking the same questions on the Thailand, Vietnam, Philippines forums.

Sort out your things first, then go to one country first, find out about the country and decide whether to stay or to move on.

You cannot decide when in Brasil, you have to have a feel for a country and it's population and possibilities to make a decision.

Cheers.

Joe

JoeKhmer wrote:

That's fine.

But wait with more questions about Cambodia until you have decided to what country you will expatriate next.

Thanks.

Joe

Ok

My question is why , what would make you put out anymore effort especially money to become a citizen? Really dumb idea, as you can live in Southeast Asia, so easy especially cambodia, there is absolutely no reason to get citizenship, none at all , I've lived in Southeast Asia for 4 years now this is a dumb idea for sure

JoeKhmer wrote:

Mr Dome: quote <It's easy to own a house or land right of the plane>

I would like to ask you to state true things and not things that are permanently not true.

Quote:
Foreigners cannot own land in Cambodia, under Article 44 of the Constitution.

Nevertheless foreigners can establish control over land in four ways:

    Land can be bought through a local company.
    Land can be leased.
    Acquiring Cambodian citizenship brings the right to buy land, a route actively encouraged by the government.
    Land is sometimes bought through a Cambodian nominee, but this has been ruled to be against Constitution, and is unsafe. /quote

So please stick to the reality, it's already difficult enough.

On top I would ask everyone to let this thread rest a while.
The OP has never been in Cambodia, doesn't know which country he will go to and is an example of someone who has no idea what to do in life. His profile shows this: <American looking for information about Brazil>
Let him first sort out his preferences, if that is Cambodia we all will be ready to help out.

Thanks

Joe
Cambodia expert
Expat.com team

Joe, I knew you'd jump on me for this, after ignoring what I had actually said. I chose my wording carefully and never stated it was legal (in the sense that you could have your name registered at the local cadastral office). The fact that many foreigners do own land/a house - often in a Khmer relative's name - is the reality (also, in the light of the government "invitation" of PRC's in Sihanoukville, that last point about owning it via a Khmer nominee is a bit of a joke. Let's face it, we long noses actually do long term leases only, whatever we own now will eventually revert back to Khmer ownership).

The OP has received good solid info. What he does with it is, as always, his prerogative. I do believe it's OK for someone to want info first and then make their decision based on that. And I'm the first to say "come here first before making any long-term plans", as I have already told him.

Once again my question is why, why would you want to long term lease property? If you gave the land are house to your Khmer wife are girlfriend I understand,  I do know some expats who have done this as a kind jester to give them a sense of security. but for yourself it makes no sense.

Keep in mind when long term in Southeast Asia , the more you travel around the more you are likely to change your mind, other things to consider in all of Southeast Asia, not specific to Cambodia, never ending changing visa requirements, yes they can change the rules of the game in a heartbeat, and if you expect justice, it's about as likely to happen as ,,,,,,,, well you be the judge of that

twinsguy20 wrote:

Once again my question is why, why would you want to long term lease property? If you gave the land are house to your Khmer wife are girlfriend I understand,  I do know some expats who have done this as a kind jester to give them a sense of security. but for yourself it makes no sense.

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I meant to say "(in the end it works out as a) long term lease" - because all properties bought by foreigners end up under Khmer ownership again eventually. Everything I own/owned, several plots & a house (some since sold already), was bought not leased, so I agree with you, twinsguy. I have no Khmer g/f or wife btw.

Can I add my experience into this?  My nephew & I bought an apartment through a joint biz Khmer (our lawyer's nephew) some 12 years ago. Paid modest local taxes; sold 3 years ago at a reasonable increase (but below its real value) Paid a (then) small sellers tax. I also own jointly a small house with my Khmer "Wife" (too old to officially marry her) and her son. Have just bought them in their name only a nice 2-bed house with 30% of the (Sisowath Quay) apartment proceeds. I am extremely lucky and feel secure - and they are set up when I'm no longer here. Have a decent UK pension which covers modest living/travel costs. No need for citizenship - and NOT enough $$$ to buy it! :-)