Carpenter in Balatonalmadi

Charles_Online wrote:

I seem to inherit a house in Balatonalmadi. I would like to get in touch with a carpenter in balatonalmadi, are there any of you who know about someone and how I get in touch with them?

Could you be a bit more specific? 

What exactly do you need to do?  Build stairs? Install a kitchen? New roof? Make a cupboard? New doors?

Ok, well I might need to change the roof covering, because it is the old traditional straw roof which is nice but extremely costly. I will do this only if it serves my purpose which is to sell it and then buy a flat in Budapest. I live in Norway and love Budapest.

Charles_Online wrote:

Ok, well I might need to change the roof covering, because it is the old traditional straw roof which is nice but extremely costly. I will do this only if it serves my purpose which is to sell it and then buy a flat in Budapest. I live in Norway and love Budapest.

Ok, presumably you won't change the design, just replace the top part. In which case, you don't need really a carpenter, you need a roofer or a builder. 

They will take off the existing roof,  put on some kind of waterproofing sheets, then nail on wood to hold the tiles.  After that, you'll need someone for the guttering and the downpipes.

BTW, don't forget to get them to take away or arrange to take away (and dispose the waste materials correctly) the  old parts and not leave it there.

If the house isn't worth that much, maybe it's better to sell it and let the new owners sort it out.   Be prepared to wait some years to sell it.   Ideally make your own sign and put it up outside.  Many real estate agents here are useless.

I live by the Balaton. And I have an excellent general contractor. But even he took 18 months to find a competent roofer for us. Then our roof was "complex" since it was old, took longer than expected, and the roofer could not stay as he had another project scheduled, and we went through three more roofers to complete the job. Some okay, some.... well not okay. So, yes, you need someone who knows how to build a roof properly, because there are a lot of wrong ways to do it.

A reed roof actually is a special type of roof. If you change the roof type, you may need a complete roof rebuild, including new rafters. You should price this out well to see if it is cost effective. As fluffy2560 said, you may end up paying more for the new roof than you can get from selling with the new roof versus selling "as is". It depends on the property. Where it is located exactly, and the quality of the building in general. Normally, if a building in Hungary needs a new roof badly, it probably has a lot of other problems, and it won't bring much on the market. A new roof on a building that is in otherwise in poor condition  will look "odd" and will not be a very good sales point. If the old roof is just "old" but "okay", then you may be better to just sell "as is" or commit to more renovations to sell it at a better price as a ready to go, "turn key" house.

klsallee wrote:

....A reed roof actually is a special type of roof. If you change the roof type, you may need a complete roof rebuild, including new rafters. You should price this out well to see if it is cost effective. ....

Yes, that's true, I forgot about the replacement of the rafters - tiles are quite heavy. Probably a lot heavier than grass.  There are of course, plastic tiles as well. Or just plain asphalt tiles which are even lighter but aren't going to last as long.

If it's a case of the rafters needing replacement, it'll need structural designs and plans and therefore planning permission from the local government.

Unless it's a very special place, then it's probably not worth doing.

I think on my house (which is nothing special), it cost quite a lot and took quite a bit of time - about 2 weeks I think of 2 o 3 guys working full time.  We had new rafters, tiles, metalwork - the whole thing and we had multiple workers for different trades. I don't remember exactly how much it cost per m2. 

Oh, and the builders were told by the roofers the architect had miscalculated and we needed some concrete beams made to hold up one particular section with a larger span.   So there was that as well to factor in - mistakes.

fluffy2560 wrote:

klsallee wrote:

....A reed roof actually is a special type of roof. If you change the roof type, you may need a complete roof rebuild, including new rafters. You should price this out well to see if it is cost effective. ....

Yes, that's true, I forgot about the replacement of the rafters - tiles are quite heavy. Probably a lot heavier than grass.  There are of course, plastic tiles as well. Or just plain asphalt tiles which are even lighter but aren't going to last as long.

One more thing to consider: Local building codes. I wanted to put on a new metal roof. I was not allowed. Only clay tile or reed was allowed on any house in our area. We also had color limits for the tile: brick red, brown or black. Also, some house have "historical" certificates and the house must only be renovated to its current conditions. If such a house has a reed roof, the owner must replace it with a reed roof. Can not even update to tile.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Be prepared to wait some years to sell it.

In Balatonalmadi? I'd bet it'll sell quickly if he asks a fair price...

Whether to sell it in current state or have the roof fixed? If he has a lot of free time and very strong nerves (!!!), the should go ahead and look for contractors.

Thank you all so much. I doesn't encourage me to make the renovation. You told me that it is difficult to sell a house in Balaton, yes I've seen a lot of places in sale, does this say that people don't want to live there or? It is such a beautiful place.

Any suggestions for someone to have a look at it for to define the price range for the job?

Any suggestions for someone to have a look at it for to define the price range for the job?

atomheart wrote:

fluffy2560 wrote:

Be prepared to wait some years to sell it.

In Balatonalmadi? I'd bet it'll sell quickly if he asks a fair price...

Whether to sell it in current state or have the roof fixed? If he has a lot of free time and very strong nerves (!!!), the should go ahead and look for contractors.

Maybe it'll sell for a realistic price.  I google'd it and the cheapest place I found was 10M HUF approximately.  If it was on the lake with plenty of land then it'd be worth a bundle.

As for renovation, if it's got a grass roof, it's a labour of love for renovation rather than a money making enterprise. 

I don't have any figures but I reckon most Balaton houses are only occupied from late May until late August (just before schools re-open).  Rest of the time, it's pretty much dead.  North shore is rocky and deep so not quite as popular as the Southern side as fewer beaches. 

So even with renting it for a month or so a year, it would be hard to make money on it or even break even.  And then there's the opportunity cost.

fluffy2560 wrote:

atomheart wrote:

fluffy2560 wrote:

Be prepared to wait some years to sell it.

In Balatonalmadi? I'd bet it'll sell quickly if he asks a fair price...

Whether to sell it in current state or have the roof fixed? If he has a lot of free time and very strong nerves (!!!), the should go ahead and look for contractors.

Maybe it'll sell for a realistic price.  I google'd it and the cheapest place I found was 10M HUF approximately.  If it was on the lake with plenty of land then it'd be worth a bundle.

As for renovation, if it's got a grass roof, it's a labour of love for renovation rather than a money making enterprise. 

I don't have any figures but I reckon most Balaton houses are only occupied from late May until late August (just before schools re-open).  Rest of the time, it's pretty much dead.  North shore is rocky and deep so not quite as popular as the Southern side as fewer beaches. 

So even with renting it for a month or so a year, it would be hard to make money on it or even break even.  And then there's the opportunity cost.

Balaton and its sorroundings is a very hot area. Earlier today I've checked ingatlan.com for Balatonalmadi, the cheapest house I've seen was 12mils*, and then the prices quickly went over 20 mils.

*and somehow I get the feeling that if I called the seller, a real estate agent would have answered and told meg that ohnoo, the property was sold long ago, but hey he happens to have a few houses for sale, albeit for a much higher price, a very common tactic...

atomheart wrote:

......
Balaton and its sorroundings is a very hot area. Earlier today I've checked ingatlan.com for Balatonalmadi, the cheapest house I've seen was 12mils*, and then the prices quickly went over 20 mils.

*and somehow I get the feeling that if I called the seller, a real estate agent would have answered and told meg that ohnoo, the property was sold long ago, but hey he happens to have a few houses for sale, albeit for a much higher price, a very common tactic...

Strange, I looked as well on the same site and put in a limit of 12 M HUF and there were some for 9.9M HUF.   Highest I saw was 90 M HUF. Bet they've been on there for years.

For sure the agents would say this and that to score a higher price.  That's why a house for sale gets pushed down the agent's interest level - if it's not sold in 5 minutes, they stop mentioning it but try to upsell as you say.   In my previous experience, the term trustworthy real estate agents is an oxymoron.  Bit like taxi drivers. If the fare is 4K HUF and you offer a 5K note, they will say they have no change .

Easier to make an own sign with a house specific e-mail address (like [email protected]), use a local mobile number. Stick up the sign and see if the locals pick up on it.  We see plenty of houses here with own "Elado" signs.  Who else is more interested than a person already living in the area!

The house has 3 bedrooms and a separat small room with own entrance, and Its 3000 squaremeters land, winecellar and lots of fruit trees and some grapes, if I solid that house could it give me a appartment in Budapest VIII distrikt ? Its about 500 meters from the beach by the way.

BTW, I should say we're not really answering Charles's question. 

I don't know anyone there who does building work. 

However I have come across these people (click here) in the past. 

No idea if they are any good so not a recommendation.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Strange, I looked as well on the same site and put in a limit of 12 M HUF and there were some for 9.9M HUF.

Ok you're right, I misremembered.

Charles_Online wrote:

The house has 3 bedrooms and a separat small room with own entrance, and Its 3000 squaremeters land, winecellar and lots of fruit trees and some grapes, if I solid that house could it give me a appartment in Budapest VIII distrikt ? Its about 500 meters from the beach by the way.

Do you know the (ground) area of all the buildings? Reason I ask is that this might be zoned as agricultural land.  If it's 100m2 (3%), then probably agricultural with no expanded building potential but renovation within the existing sizes.  Are there utilities?  City water, power, gas, phone, main drainage etc? 

If it's close to the centre, on a main road, then you might be able to sell it for development if you can get it re-zoned.

Price of apartments in Budapest depends on what you want.  You could spend millions (of EUR).

If you had say, 50M HUF, you'd get an upmarket place with 3 bedrooms in a good area for sure. Maybe not central but close.

You can always try using this web site: Ingatlan and try navigating.  Words to know: Lakas - Apartment, Elado - Sale.  The rest is fairly obvious.

Charles_Online wrote:

The house has 3 bedrooms and a separat small room with own entrance, and Its 3000 squaremeters land, winecellar and lots of fruit trees and some grapes

Sounds like a typical, old Hungarian village house. Agree with fluffy2560, the size of the house is important more than the number of rooms (as they may be tiny), or the land area (which is actually a sales drag -- nobody wants large land plots, especially with grapes to take care of. All too much work unless they want to make wine (which reduces the potential buyer population)).

Charles_Online wrote:

Its about 500 meters from the beach by the way.

That is a potentially very good sales point for someone looking for a weekend house.

For those who don't know they will probably have a lot of mosquitoes that is. (Don't mean to be mercenary, but you can let the buyer find out about that themselves).

Charles_Online wrote:

Any suggestions for someone to have a look at it for to define the price range for the job?

Unfortunately, my general contractor only speaks Hungarian.

I can give you a contact to a project manager who helps expats with coordination and language issues on such projects (if she has time -- very busy). PM me if interested. This site does not want members to freely promote businesses outside of the business directory.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Maybe it'll sell for a realistic price.

A realistically priced house in the Balaton area today? 

Let me know if you find such. I will buy it.

Seriously: all prices here are speculative. Ergo: overpriced. Have not seen a "realistic" price ever. Even the properties I did purchase were over priced regarding their real, current market values at the time. But I bought years ago, so my speculative investment has paid off. Not sure current purchasers will see similar rates of return.

klsallee wrote:

Even the properties I did purchase were over priced regarding their real, current market values at the time.

The moment you purchased them, you made the purchase price their market value...

atomheart wrote:

klsallee wrote:

Even the properties I did purchase were over priced regarding their real, current market values at the time.

The moment you purchased them, you made the purchase price their market value...

Wrong. You are confusing market value with market price:

Market value is a concept distinct from market price, which is “the price at which one can transact”, while market value is “the true underlying value”

I paid the market price, because "I could". But that was still above "market value". Please learn basic economics before commenting.

When I bought my place about 4 years ago. I probably overpaid by quite a bit but it was a rising market.   However, we've completely renovated and therefore (and hopefully) added value. And as I needed somewhere for us to live, doesn't make a lot of difference.

However we've thought about buying other property and we keep an eye on things.

I believe in Budapest now, apartments that would sell in 30 days are now selling in 90 days (source: Mrs Fluffy). I think that prices are going to drop but from the real estate web sites, I am not seeing large falls at the moment.

Re: Economics, there's always a buyer's remorse or the winner's curse.  We've been around this loop before in these forums.  The HU government restricts access to historical property prices and this leads to a massive risk for buyers as they operate without information.  I do not know why they did that as it's not consumer friendly. In other countries - my own especially - purchase prices are in the public domain and very easy to find.

Thanks guys for bringing informative pieces to yhis puzzle. My main problem is to get a picture of the costs for things it doesent have to be so extreme but....

The house has gas (big tank outside) it has water infrastructrure and also a well and electricity, phone, and UPC television and the garden is actually possible to split in to peaces so I can sell half of it.
Its about 500 meter from lake Balaton and has a lot of fruits and a small vegetable garden and som wine ranks.

The house was buildt 25 years ago with the traditional straw roof.
Just as you know I will come down at easter time and check out things.

Charles_Online wrote:

Thanks guys for bringing informative pieces to yhis puzzle. My main problem is to get a picture of the costs for things it doesent have to be so extreme but....

The house has gas (big tank outside) it has water infrastructure and also a well and electricity, phone, and UPC television and the garden is actually possible to split in to peaces so I can sell half of it. Its about 500 meter from Balaton and has a lot of fruits and a small vegetable garden and some wine racks. 

The house was built 25 years ago with the traditional straw roof. Just as you know I will come down at easter time and check out things.

Sounds not bad with those utilities.  But grass and 25 years seems a bit odd. You should check if it's a mud (clay) house or made of brick.  People do not like clay houses for a variety of reasons.

There's an official register of costs for building work and official costs.  Any work has to be registered in there.  It's a control mechanism to stop people working for cash.  I don't actually know where it is on the Internet but I have an estimate on my own house from about 2015:

1. 1st level carpentry breakdown 2.500.-HUF / m2
2.  Construction of new roof structure 6.000.-HUF / m2
3.  New roof covering (tiles) 1.500.-2.000.-HUF / m2
4. Preparation of other construction (supporting walls etc) 6.000.-HUF / m2

I think it cost more than that but we wanted specific tiles and attic windows. 

BTW, if you want to sell your house you need the EU energy certificate.  This is a stupid certificate which does not take into account anything to do with the house's current condition.  It could be a ruin and you still need it.  Costs about 300 EUR and it's the seller's responsibility.

Thanks for enlightening me, I realise it's a lot of topics which will affect my desicion.....think..think😎👍