Sarawak MM2H visa

You need a local sponsor:

"An application must be sponsored by a Malaysian who originates from Sarawak / Sarawak Permanent Resident*, who is required to sign a Personal Bond as the guarantor for the applicant.

The sponsor must not be from any individual / organizations of Land Authority / Tourism Authority, Government Hospital (for Health Tourism). Usage of agents, middleman or consultant firms are prohibited."

*People on MM2H are not PR.

Thanks Gravitas! Appreciate your response!

Gravitas is correct. But after speaking with the Sarawak Ministry of Tourism it appears they are allowing a limited number of agents (these are listed on the main MM2H government site) to act as sponsors.

[This is no longer true...Sarawak Immigration does not allow this as "official policy"]

Hopefully they work out this glitch or allow the applicant to make a Bond deposit in lieu of the sponsor having to submit a promissary note to cover the bond. This is the way the handle individual applications on the Peninsula.

If you have friends on the Sarawak MM2H visa then perhaps they can introduce you to a local willing to act as a sponsor and have a lawyer set up an agreement that you would be responsible for the bond if deported. For US citizens it's RM2000.

Another possibility is to have your landlord or property agent sponsor you and pay the bond amount as a deposit. You might have to revise your sponsor if you move but by then you'd likely know someone else (local Sarawakian) to act as a sponsor.

By "resident" it means that the person should actually be Malaysian from the State of Sarawak. They can live outside the State, but obviously must return to be interviewed and sign certain documents (such as the Personal Bond guarantee).

I wrote the above about agents prior to actually getting my Visa and spoke with the Deputy Director. Agents are technically not allowed to act as such in Sarawak. They hold no special monopoly status. Any Sarawakian can act as a sponsor, and, according to Sarawak Immigration there is no regulation against there being an "arrangement" to cover the costs or risks that a sponsor might face.

cinnamonape wrote:

By "resident" it means that the person should actually be Malaysian from the State of Sarawak. They can live outside the State, but obviously must return to be interviewed and sign certain documents (such as the Personal Bond guarantee).

I wrote the above about agents prior to actually getting my Visa and spoke with the Deputy Director. Agents are technically not allowed to act as such in Sarawak. They hold no special monopoly status. Any Sarawakian can act as a sponsor, and, according to Sarawak Immigration there is no regulation against there being an "arrangement" to cover the costs or risks that a sponsor might face.

I'm working right now on setting up a system where applicants might be able to contact local sponsors.

Hello Cinnamonape,   do you have another account named Redape in britishexpats.com ?  Currently the britishexpats.com cannot be accessed so that I switched to this forum to ask more questions about application of SMM2H.   1) How is the progress of your plan to setup sarawak local sponsor system?  If I apply SMM2H now, can you help me to find local sponsor ? 
2) I know that I must present during the application. At what stage of the application should I fly to Sarawak  (does the sponsor can submit the application with full documents to the immigration department on behalf of me ?)    After I arriving Sarawak, do I need to stay until approval notice and get the visa ?   Usually how long do I need to stay ?   Thanks a lot

schlee1231 wrote:

I switched to this forum to ask more questions about application of SMM2H.   1) How is the progress of your plan to setup sarawak local sponsor system?

Nowhere. Locals are risk-averse. Although they are willing to assist someone they have known for a few years they don't want to get involved with someone that they really don't know. One mentioned the presence of a pedophile missionary about a decade ago, and that "I wouldn't want to be responsible for such a person".  It has been suggested that paying the bond fee would be sufficient (plus a bonus) but even there it seems that there is little interest, especially as that crosses the line into "acting as an agent" or paid "middle-man". Agents are not allowed for the Sarawak M2H.

schlee1231 wrote:

2) If I apply SMM2H now, can you help me to find local sponsor ?

No. I might be able to direct you to people or organizations with common interests but the establishment of personal relationships is up to you.

schlee1231 wrote:

3) I know that I must present during the application. At what stage of the application should I fly to Sarawak  (does the sponsor can submit the application with full documents to the immigration department on behalf of me ?)

To be quite honest my package was submitted IN PERSON, and COMPLETE. I had everything chopped in my presence, attended all but one meeting at immigration with my sponsor (sometimes they were not needed, sometimes I was not needed).

Your sponsor could submit the documentation to the Immigration Department without you being present. THEY would have to get all the items required to be attested to as actual copies of the original documents chopped by a Commissioner of Oaths IN SARAWAK - which I am not sure is allowed without you being present. That could be the basic problem.

I would expect that the immigration office would hold a meeting to determine your fitness as a Sarawak M2H at some point within 1-2 weeks of the complete application submitted and send you a Letter of Conditional Approval. You need this to get your Fixed Account (if you go that route) established.

[Correction: IF one decides to apply using a Fixed Deposit one must first get a letter giving permission to set up the FD at the local branch of the bank you select. This is obtained from the SarawakMM2H desk at the Ministry of Tourism, Mesja Building, in Petrajaya, North Kuching. Take the letter to the bank and begin the transfer.Once completed you will get a certificate showing you have established the account and this can be included in you application.]

But at some stage you would also need to also submit the Health check (which MUST be done in person with a local doctor...and involves a urine, and blood test + Chest XRay).  My understanding is that this could be done at the same time as you (IN-PERSON) set up your fixed account. But because I submitted the Health Check as part of the total package  what happens if the application lacks the Health Certification I cannot guarantee.

schlee1231 wrote:

3) After I arriving Sarawak, do I need to stay until approval notice and get the visa ?   Usually how long do I need to stay ?   Thanks a lot

As noted here. http://www.mtacys.sarawak.gov.my/upload … CEDURE.pdf

10 WORKING Days from submission of completed application...interviews.

Immigration can then take up to 14 WORKING Days for approval. They took almost the entire period in my case but this may vary depending on their cycle of meetings.

My sponsor got this announcement by phone. They told her/me to pick up the Conditional Letter in Person. This really was "my interview".

If you have completed the Health check (if not already done) and Fixed Deposit application and established the account if needed)  you can present  documentation and receive the visa in 3 Days. If you are going the pensions route and submitted all of that information you can get your visa immediately after approval.

At that point you can collect the visa...but have six months (from approval)  to do so.
Correction: They will tell you that you have 3 months to pick up the visa.

They indicate about 27 Working days from submission to Final approval. That was almost exactly true in my case. There were several holidays (Christmas, New Years, Chinese New Years). I also spent many wasted days dealing with the Ministry of Tourism which (as you can see from the flow chart) is irrelevant. Go directly to Immigration.

Can you leave Sarawak during the process. Yes. But you take the risk of having to reschedule an interview or having to return to complete some document. For example. I did a "quickie" cheap Health Examination at a local clinic (based on information posted about the MM2H program on the Peninsula). I had to redo it after they rejected it...that required another 3 or 4 days in the process. If this had been coordinated with the time used for getting the Comm of Oaths chops, the Personal Bond form, etc. that time MIGHT have meant somewhat quicker approval. That depends on whether I missed their "approval meeting".

Hello cinnamonape,  thank you very much for your detailed answer.

It seems that I need to stay at Sarawak at least  18 days (start from collecting conditional approval letter and interview, then 14 days for immigration department to approve and then 4 days for bank setup and visa chopped)

3 weeks staying aboard to wait for the approval is quite time consuming and costly.

Then perhaps this program is not for you.

Hi there. My father is a 68-year-old UK citizen who has lived on and off in Penang via tourist visas for several years now, and he'd like to get the MM2H. He has liquid, but not a ton, and no monthly income. I appreciate your many posts on this topic - it's literally the only place on the internet I seem to be able to get any up to date information on this topic, which is affecting my dad's whole future right now. The requirements seem to be constantly changing, and I'm sure with Mahathir in now, everything is in even more flux than usual.

- Does the peninsular MM2H still require monthly income for over 50s? How about the Sarawak MM2H?
- My father is close with a Sabah resident who'd sponsor him. Will that suffice? Or must the sponsor be specifically Sarawakian?
- Does Sabah have its own version of the MM2H?
- Would my father be able to live in Penang with a Sarawak MM2H visa?
- Roughly how much does this whole process cost?
- Can you recommend an agent?

Thank you again.

Does the peninsular MM2H still require monthly income for over 50s? 
Yes, at the application stage.

How about the Sarawak MM2H?   
Two pathways in Sarawak, either A) Pension (RM7000 single; RM10,000 for couples) OR
B) a fixed deposit (RM100,000 single/150,000 couple but can use some of it for property/healthcare purchases).

The Ministry of Immigration will want to see (for A) 3 months prior warrants showing the appropriate pension levels are matched OR (for B) "sufficient funds" after making the Fixed Deposit to live upon.

- My father is close with a Sabah resident who'd sponsor him. Will that suffice? Or must the sponsor be specifically Sarawakian?
- For Sarawak it MUST be a Sarawak citizen.  Also cannot be employee of the Ministry of Immigration, Health or Tourism.

- Does Sabah have its own version of the MM2H? Yes...it is quite mysterious though. It's not clear if it is based upon the old MM2H requirements or the new ones. Maybe the Sarawak friend could inquire (please provide the details back here!)

- Would my father be able to live in Penang with a Sarawak MM2H visa?
Yes. The Sarawak MM2H visa is for all extents and purposes the same as the MM2H except the fact that it is issued in Sarawak allows free access in/out of East Malaysia.
But certain benefits (such as the lower property floor) can only be used in Sarawak. Also one must establish the fixed account in a Sarawak bank branch.

- Roughly how much does this whole process cost? Five Year Visa @ RM90/yr. =RM450
Health Check @ RM175  Various other fees (chops from Comm. of Oaths, Tax Stamp) @ RM50. UK Citizen should not have to pay the Journey Performed Fee but if so it is RM500.
So between...RM675 and RM1175. Not counting hotel/Grab taxis/ gratuities to sponsor.

- Can you recommend an agent?
Definitely NOT. No agents or middlemen are allowed in the Sarawak M2H program. One must personally arrange a local sponsor. The sponsor can be any Sarawakian willing to act as a guarantor of the Personal Bond (for UK RM1500) except employees of the Ministry of Tourism, Immigration or Health.

Hi Cinnamonape. Thank you so much for your very detailed posts on the Sarawak MM2H Visa.

I'm in the early stages of helping my parents prepare their retirement to Malaysia. Based on what I've read from your posts and from the SMM2H website, I think the most difficult challenge will be finding a Sarawakian sponsor. Luckily I've been living and working in KL the past few years, so I know some people who might be able to help... the annoying thing will just be coordinating timing for everything (for example if Kuching immigration department needs to see them for interviews)

Anyway, assuming I eventually find a solution to the Sarawakian sponsor issue, or if miraculously SMM2H allows applicants to pay the RM2000 security bond up front, I had a few other questions...

If I remember correctly from one of your other posts, you mentioned having a Bank of America account, so I assume you're American. Do you have a local bank account in Malaysia too? I'm curious if it would make sense for my parents to move their USD from their current Bank of America account to an HSBC account, so then hopefully it would be easier to setup Malaysian HSBC wire transfers, fixed deposit account, and checking/savings account. Or do you use a combination of Charles Schwab ATM card or Transferwise?

I noticed the wording of the RM10000 per month requirement for married couple was "monthly off shore income /pension funds". If my parents setup their 401k/IRA disbursement to 3000 USD per month, would that satisfy the requirement? Technically its not "income" since its their own tax-deferred retirement account, and its also not a pension fund. My parents are juuuust short of the RM10000 if they claim Social Security early, so I'm hoping the 401k/IRA money would be considered. Curious what you think.

Lastly, do you have any recommended companies to use for health insurance? Or do you have any nightmare stories to share so I know which companies my parents should avoid?

Thanks

Hi Yam,

Yes, I'm an American. I may miss a few of your questions but will try and answer the more technical ones.

1) "Do you have a local bank account in Malaysia too?"
Yes, I have established a Public Bank account, principally for local transactions.

2) "I'm curious if it would make sense for my parents to move their USD from their current Bank of America account to an HSBC account, so then hopefully it would be easier to setup Malaysian HSBC wire transfers, fixed deposit account, and checking/savings account."
It might. Some banks have Premier privileges, but the amounts they require are very high. It's actually cheaper to establish the account at HSBC here...lower required minimums and that is just a little above the FD.

Here's where the craziness sets in...if you parents go by the Fixed Deposit method one will have to transfer a substantial amount to Sarawak/Malaysia and you'll need to get through most of the process for the visa application before you can get the "Letter of Provisional Approval". You take that letter to the bank of choice and they'll start the process of getting the FD. It can take awhile due to US Banking Regulations (FATCA). I did not establish a FD account (retirement pension method) and they may do that quicker.

I did a bank-to-bank (set up the procedure with my local bank before I left) and it took about two weeks. Heavy Western Union Fee and crappy exchange rate about 4% lower than the rates offered by moneychangers or Transferwise.

"Or do you use a combination of Charles Schwab ATM card or Transferwise?"

Transferwise is useless for large transactions from the US. For some reason they keep getting blocked at the Malaysian side. At least for Public Bank. Why, no one seems to know.
Some people say they have no issues with HSBC or CIMB. Why? Again no one seems to know.
But neither HSBC or CIMB  would allow me to set up a regular checking account...only a FD.

Welcome to the chaos. Some people just use their American based ATM debit or credit cards.

Oh, and to add another twist to the picture...although my PBe will not accept Transferwise, I've discovered that I can pay my rent using Transferwise because my landlord uses a Standard Chartered account.

" If my parents setup their 401k/IRA disbursement to 3000 USD per month, would that satisfy the requirement? Technically its not "income" since its their own tax-deferred retirement account, and its also not a pension fund. My parents are juuuust short of the RM10000 if they claim Social Security early, so I'm hoping the 401k/IRA money would be considered. Curious what you think."

Just show the Ministry of Tourism and Immigration your parents full financial particulars.They'll likely allow the disbursement method...but they must have some document showing that they have withdrawn this for at least three months. Also demonstrate the total available. Then provide information about the SS benefits with the preferred start up date (usually SS provides an age 62, 66, 70 estimate). Once you are accepted one can decide not to follow through on the procedure.

BTW Social Security allows one to claim early and then "pay back" the drawn amount to get back on the "deferred cycle". Thus if one starts claiming at 62 and realizes after a half year that you made a mistake, one can pay back all the benefits and have no penalty. One can then drawn at 66, 68, or 70 with higher benefit levels.

Immigration does not have to know about this.

"Lastly, do you have any recommended companies to use for health insurance? Or do you have any nightmare stories to share so I know which companies my parents should avoid?"

Not really. I'm not sure if it is necessary. I wasn't asked to show evidence of insurance. But I'm 65.

Of course, Medicare does not cover OVERSEAS procedures for US retirees abroad. If they have health insurance at home they should look to see what the travel coverage is. If they are under a Blue Cross/Blue Shield plan there may be Global Core coverage. When they are 65 unless your parents pay Medicare Plan B premiums (@ $132/month)  they will lose any Plan B coverage back in the USA.  If one returns to the US later one must then pay both the monthly premium PLUS a penalty of 10%/year abroad to regain the coverage (So if one lives abroad a decade one pays a $132/mo premium and a $132mo penalty).  It's a big gripe for Americans abroad that they have to pay for MEDICARE insurance for which they get no coverage.

AXA supposed is cheapest local insurance, but they give only basic coverage. It really depends on what one wants, what specialty hospitals accept the coverage, whether the coverage is just local or has travel coverage.

Thanks. I was able to setup a local Maybank account for myself after I got my work permit sorted out, and luckily the FATCA forms processing time wasn't too bad ( only added about 1 week to the overall bank account opening process). I think I'll focus on getting my parents setup with US-based bank accounts and credit cards with no foreign fees or annual fees and good online customer support... then if they decide to open up a local Malaysian checking account later on, they can just take their time dealing with that process and any impact from FATCA.

My mom worked in the healthcare industry as a nurse, so she's seen plenty of nightmare hospital bills and rejected insurance claims, so one of the main reasons my parents are looking to retire in Malaysia is to avoid all the US healthcare BS. They don't have any intention of going back to the US to try and make use of their Medicare. At the end of the day the "wasted" Medicare coverage will likely be offset by the savings from overall lower price of healthcare in Asia, not to mention the better quality of life from being able to have fun with your money in Malaysia instead of eating oatmeal every day to save costs in the US.

I also weighed the +/- of losing Medicare B...and came down on the side of not paying the premiums, too. I could apply that to local Health Care costs or into a savings plan. There may indeed be Insurance plans that could be bought into even at their ages that (with lower overseas health costs) that provide as much coverage as Medicare B.

Also they should check into whether their previous employer has retirement coverage. I worked for the State of California and they have a host of plans that are offered under their CALPERS or CALSTRS programs. If you move out of State (or abroad) one must get a Blue-Cross Preferred Provider Plan. Now that sounds bad, but actually if one is more than 50 miles from any PPO exists (as occurs when abroad) one gets the same cost coverage as at a PPO.

AND if one is traveling or LIVING abroad the retirement program health insurance also offer coverage under a  BlueCross/BlueShield "Global Core" provision. It's possible that one, or other of your parents may have some coverage under this. Some private companies (mainly those that have a strong international reach) also offer this for their retired employees.

Can anyone tell me please if I get the Sarawak mm2h - can I work less than 20 hrs in Penang or KL? ( I believe I could not work in Sarawak)

My impression is that even the permission to work part-time in the Peninsula has largely been eliminated. In any case you would have to apply for permission via the MM2H office in Putrajaya and the requisites are that you are over 50 years of age and that the company you are applying for must have advertised the position openly. It's far more complicated than one may think.

http://www.mm2h.gov.my/index.php/en/ben … artime-job

Technically there would be nothing blocking you from applying, but in a pragmatic sense it's unlikely. On Sarawak it is currently disallowed.

The work option is only in education sphere if job can't be done by a Malaysian. Highly unlikely permission will be granted and once your Mm2h visa is found not to be for the peninsular permission would not be granted anyway. The terms of the mm2h visa is actually based on your place of main residence. It has been known that renewals have been refused trying to live elsewhere than the issuing immigration office

Gravitas wrote:

The terms of the mm2h visa is actually based on your place of main residence.

The Letter of Conditional Approval for Sarawak MM2H states that "You are not allowed to work or be employed as long as you are under this programme, except permission has been granted by the Director-General of Immigration Malaysia." This would seem to suggest that Sarawak has no issue IF the Peninsula allows it.

Gravitas wrote:

It has been known that renewals have been refused trying to live elsewhere than the issuing immigration office

The Sarawak programme specifically states that one can "live anywhere within Malaysia" and there is no mentioned restriction on the Conditional Letter. Of course, there are people who hold MM2H and Sarawak M2H that live outside the country, and do not even have a residence in Malaysia.

I've heard that Sabah immigration is now requiring that people demonstrate that they have residence in Sabah for visas issued in Sabah, but this seems to be a recent anomaly...perhaps tied to large numbers of applicants/agents who are trying to use Sabah as a backdoor to residency in the Peninsula (e.g. Forest City). As well, the suspension of the processing of applications in the Peninsula seems to have crept over to Sabah.

The Sabah Mm2h also says residence anywhere is possible but reality is quite different

Do you have a document or official website that actually gives their rules?

A reality check came in a discussion on this forum recently when a member wrote of their personal experience. I'll try and find it.

Yes I saw that, but getting a clear answer on what happened and why wasn't forthcoming. I wouldn't generalize it. Particularly to say that Sarawak would not allow individuals to live outside Sarawak.

And it appeared to be an issue with RENEWAL...not with actually living in the peninsula. Presumably the Sabah MM2H individual (living on the Peninsula) was not hassled about it ON the peninsula. 

It may be an ad hoc renewal policy to deal with a particular set of events. I can't conceive that Sabah is actually requiring people to buy property in order to obtain a visa. The solution might be to come back and rent for a few months before one reapplies. Then how the fact that you are paying for rent locally.

What's interesting is approvals seem to be becoming centralised under immigration in Putrajaya moving away from Tourism Ministry and Borneo systems. Who knows what the future holds therefore. If a renewal is denied because of current residence (under old approval systems) this is completely against the spirit of Mm2h. Retirees have flexibility of movement but those with children under education might find it more difficult. The main thing is definitely never to contravene immigration because the outcome is usually merciless.

Hi Cinnamonape, the link you posted -

http://www.mtacys.sarawak.gov.my/upload … CEDURE.pdf

Doesn't seem to work. Any update?

czy wrote:

Hi Cinnamonape, the link you posted -

http://www.mtacys.sarawak.gov.my/upload … CEDURE.pdf

Doesn't seem to work. Any update?

"Sorry, this page is under maintenance."

This is the Sarawak  Ministry of Tourism site and there is no alternative pathway into it. It's the whole Ministry site that is down so one cannot even access the index. It's been down for @ 2 weeks. But I've been following events closely and there are no current updates and no one should be anxious or excited about potential updates being posted (especially since it is the whole site and not merely the MM2H section).

I would point out that the MM2H vs. Sarawak MM2H comparison page is still available and unchanged.;
https://www.sarawak.gov.my/web/home/art … w/221/279/
Last updated on 20 SEPTEMBER 2019

as is the Terms and Conditions page http://www.mtac.sarawak.gov.my/upload/f … 20MM2H.pdf 
(Last updated on March, 15th 2012)

At this point if one is applying to the Sarawak program and are satisfied with the current requirements I'd suggest doing so. If you don't qualify for the program because of the sponsorship requirement then you may wish to defer awhile. That requirement may change. At the same time they may also introduce some sort of residency requirement (renting for awhile, etc.).

I've been assured that I'll be given a "heads up" if there is to be an announcement, though the details will only be released by the Ministry of Tourism at the appropriate time at a press conference. I'll be there and likely post the announcements faster than the News websites. I may also be able to get details that other reporters/commentators won't since I understand the current regulations and some of the proposals that have been made.

So
http://www.mtacys.sarawak.gov.my/upload … CEDURE.pdf
is inaccessible.

Does anyone have a copy?

Are you trying to get access to the application forms?

Try this...

https://mtacys.sarawak.gov.my/upload/fi … HZHjbhTzq0

And here is the link to the Procedure Flow Chart.

https://mtacys.sarawak.gov.my/upload/fi … trPlR9Waoo

These are from the Sarawak My Second Home Facebook Site (look under posts and scroll all the wy to the bottom...or look under Photo Files).

https://www.facebook.com/pg/Sarawak-My- … 9931333165

Thanks. Wanted the procudure flowchart. Got it now

Looking at the flowchart, it says there is an interview of applicant and sponsor. I thought the applicant is not interviewed after initial submission of application

czy wrote:

Looking at the flowchart, it says there is an interview of applicant and sponsor. I thought the applicant is not interviewed after initial submission of application

That flowchart is not gospel. The applicant is not usually interviewed, only the sponsor.