Protests in Hungary

@fluffy2560 I appreciate the energy price increase, at the time we lived in Hungary we paid for Gas/Electricity and Water well below EUR 2000 per year (admittedly our house was very well inulated). HUF 300 K per month sounds too excessive. Having said that I believe all of the subsidies will subside over the coming year (or years). HUF 300 K per month sounds too excessive to me though.

We had a two storey housethe upper floor was never heated (get heating from downstairs). Floor heating was very effective and the support of solar panels was also useful.

Heating in a way also come from cooking and the sun (in winter). We had a big property (I miss it from time to time) of 280m2 (net), but not all rooms have to be heated (living room, kitchen, bedroom and to a certain extent my computer room (all downstairs))

I am pretty sure we could manage for all in Hungary for EUR 3000 per year is we were to be even more careful (ie heating in winter up to 19 or 20 C maximum (we used to heat to 23C in the past, but believe it in Turkey in winter, 19C should be maximum (above would be excessive expensive))

For those reading I wish good luck with the energy bills. In Turkey I count EUR 100 pm (and from what I see that is more than sufficient (just to be careful in winter))

@fluffy2560 I appreciate the energy price increase, at the time we lived in Hungary we paid for Gas/Electricity and Water well below EUR 2000 per year (admittedly our house was very well insulated). HUF 300 K per month sounds too excessive. Having said that I believe all of the subsidies will subside over the coming year (or years). HUF 300 K per month sounds too excessive to me though.
We had a two storey house the upper floor was never heated (get heating from downstairs). Floor heating was very effective and the support of solar panels was also useful.
Heating in a way also come from cooking and the sun (in winter). We had a big property (I miss it from time to time) of 280m2 (net), but not all rooms have to be heated (living room, kitchen, bedroom and to a certain extent my computer room (all downstairs))
I am pretty sure we could manage for all in Hungary for EUR 3000 per year is we were to be even more careful (ie heating in winter up to 19 or 20 C maximum (we used to heat to 23C in the past, but believe it in Turkey in winter, 19C should be maximum (above would be excessive expensive))

For those reading I wish good luck with the energy bills. In Turkey I count EUR 100 pm (and from what I see that is more than sufficient (just to be careful in winter))

-@cdw057

Your prices are as it was before the war.   It's not working like that now.  We see shortages in fuel for the car.  95/E10 is sometimes in short supply.  Reports are that nothing was coming out of the pipeline.

The flow of gas from Russia is very low at the moment and obviously if a commodity is scarce, the price goes up.    There is an link between electricity generation and the gas price.  As I said previously, the base materials of renewables have not gone up but gas is through the roof and this dominates it all.   Huge amounts of electricity production infrastructure is based on gas. 

There's talk of rationing in some countries.  But in any case we're already seeing absurd rises in international energy prices at the consumer end.  In the UK, it has been 10x price rises.   Some countries are insulating consumers by regulating prices - France and of course, Hungary.  But it cannot go on forever.    Other countries are not intervening so much but they will have to bring down bills otherwise there will social instability.   

I don't know about Turkey but it won't be immune either.  It's not really an oil producer (unless you country potential sources near Cyprus). 

At the end of the war, there will be a glut of capacity and it'll swing the other way.

Hungary: US Embassy in Budapest issues Demonstration Alert for 18 September protests

The US Embassy in the capital Budapest has issued a Demonstration Alert for protests expected on 18 September 2022. A march is planned in central Budapest from 13:00 – 15:30 local time (11:00 – 13:30 GMT) to call for improved urban transportation systems. Additionally, a gathering is scheduled in Liberty Square from 16:00 – 21:00 local time (14:00 – 19:00 GMT).

Not a great statisfication when it is realised protest are useless in the present situation.

The government in Hungary still offers far more subsidy then would be able.

They simply decided to risk a state default over a civil war/ large disorder.

Fuel is about half of the market price, electricity also, while gas is more close to the market price, but still slightly bellow that. Also there are some fixed price of other basic goods, like UHT 2,8 milk, sugar, flour, etc what the supermarkets offer as "their" discounts.

But it is looks like the EU (+USA/ 14 eye) won`t rest untill either make a state default or government change (orange revolution) here because they are unable to make a civil war.

The Huf is off course in bad shape, that is what happens when the promised Euros does not arrive for years, but kept back. By one side the market reacts to the news (new money transfers kept back (again)) which makes Huf weaker compared to other currencies, and by purely financial reasons the cuntry have obligations in other currencies so must buy those currencies for Huf (which again weakens the Huf).

Normal exchange price would be around 320- 340 Huf/ Eur, but because the EU (+other) machinations it is now around 400, sometimes up to 415.

Also because Eastern countries are the wastedups of the old members most of the large retail chains (aldi, lidl, spar, etc...) buy the materials here (for Huf), export it elsewhere, and import back the finished product in Eur price.

Also large corporations are uses excuses and lies about the nearby war (while in the war zone product are far cheaper).

Slight problem is: actually Hungary would be capable easily to provide agricultural products for 30 million, with effort up to 45-50 million people.

But then there would be no agricultural crisis here, and wont be large inflation and the executives of the new world order cannot let it. There always must be a crisis, world pandemic, generated wars/ orange revolutions, terrorism, and other means of control and pauperization.

Not a great statisfication when it is realised protest are useless in the present situation.
The government in Hungary still offers far more subsidy then would be able.
They simply decided to risk a state default over a civil war/ large disorder.
Fuel is about half of the market price, electricity also, while gas is more close to the market price, but still slightly bellow that. Also there are some fixed price of other basic goods, like UHT 2,8 milk, sugar, flour, etc what the supermarkets offer as "their" discounts.

But it is looks like the EU (+USA/ 14 eye) won`t rest untill either make a state default or government change (orange revolution) here because they are unable to make a civil war.

The Huf is off course in bad shape, that is what happens when the promised Euros does not arrive for years, but kept back. By one side the market reacts to the news (new money transfers kept back (again)) which makes Huf weaker compared to other currencies, and by purely financial reasons the cuntry have obligations in other currencies so must buy those currencies for Huf (which again weakens the Huf).
Normal exchange price would be around 320- 340 Huf/ Eur, but because the EU (+other) machinations it is now around 400, sometimes up to 415.

Also because Eastern countries are the wastedups of the old members most of the large retail chains (aldi, lidl, spar, etc...) buy the materials here (for Huf), export it elsewhere, and import back the finished product in Eur price.

Also large corporations are uses excuses and lies about the nearby war (while in the war zone product are far cheaper).
Slight problem is: actually Hungary would be capable easily to provide agricultural products for 30 million, with effort up to 45-50 million people.
But then there would be no agricultural crisis here, and wont be large inflation and the executives of the new world order cannot let it. There always must be a crisis, world pandemic, generated wars/ orange revolutions, terrorism, and other means of control and pauperization.
-@sjbabilon5

Its going to get a hell of a lot worse, and there will be more protests. Hungary is about to lose a lot of EU funding due to corruption.

Not a great statisfication when it is realised protest are useless in the present situation.
The government in Hungary still offers far more subsidy then would be able.
They simply decided to risk a state default over a civil war/ large disorder.
....
The Huf is off course in bad shape, that is what happens when the promised Euros does not arrive for years, but kept back. By one side the market reacts to the news (new money transfers kept back (again)) which makes Huf weaker compared to other currencies, and by purely financial reasons the cuntry have obligations in other currencies so must buy those currencies for Huf (which again weakens the Huf).
Normal exchange price would be around 320- 340 Huf/ Eur, but because the EU (+other) machinations it is now around 400, sometimes up to 415.

Also because Eastern countries are the wastedups of the old members most of the large retail chains (aldi, lidl, spar, etc...) buy the materials here (for Huf), export it elsewhere, and import back the finished product in Eur price.

-@sjbabilon5

No-one wants war here.  Hungary is backing the wrong horse - again. It's not a proper democracy. 

But the initial EUR 7.5B that is being discussed for withholding is not going to make that much difference.   OV will just say it's the EU trying to make HU a vassal state and HU needs to just deal with a "state of siege".  Meh, so what.  Eventually there will be an adjustment.

The thing about the currency is that is what it's worth.  The market has put a value on it based on current circumstances.  It's self-inflicted damage.  No-one is going to exchange at anything except close to the market rate and predictions.  If all of Fidesz was removed and a new government came in, the Forint would be stronger.  But perhaps OV thinks he can export his way out of this but I doubt it.

But can you substantiate that Aldi/Lidl etc claim?

Its going to get a hell of a lot worse, and there will be more protests. Hungary is about to lose a lot of EU funding due to corruption.
-@SimCityAT

I think there is time for HU to wriggle out of it somewhat. But the EU has now got HU's number and knows it's MO so they aren't going to be fooled but might compromise. 

The only way it can be reformed is a new reformist government and specifically not involving OV and his cronies. He's become unaccountable. As he's set up a kleptocracy, it's hard for the beneficiaries to give it up. It's like Trump, the only way to stay out of jail is to be in power.

BTW, I still hear stories from people here who are supporting Putin based upon what they hear on the TV. After decades here, I'm beginning to wonder if HU is a basket case. I don't know how they can be so easily fooled.

But the initial EUR 7.5B that is being discussed for withholding is not going to make that much difference.  OV will just say it's the EU trying to make HU a vassal state and HU needs to just deal with a "state of siege". Meh, so what. Eventually there will be an adjustment.

-@fluffy2560

According to the latest polls his strategy works, around 86% blame EU policies for current situation in HU. But then again I looked at the numbers, and they asked about 1000 respondents. I hope they picked the worst respondents by mistake, and they're not really honest sample of the country

According to the latest polls his strategy works, around 86% blame EU policies for current situation in HU. But then again I looked at the numbers, and they asked about 1000 respondents. I hope they picked the worst respondents by mistake, and they're not really honest sample of the country
-@Bian_ca6661

It's hard to trust anything here, especially polls conducted by OV's friends.  It'll be as trustworthy as a referendum in Eastern Ukraine.   

Of course, the 86% are being spoon fed a diet of nonsense.   Or have been asked a loaded question as per the previous failed referendum here.

I'm rapidly losing patience with the Hungarian people.  I think some of them need their heads dunking in cold water to try and wake them up.

BTW, I've just heard Donald Trump is being hit by a lawsuit.   Cool!

As of 28 September 2022 the US Embassy in the capital Budapest has issued a Demonstration Alert for planned protests in the city.

A protest regarding abortion issues is scheduled for 19:00 – 20:00 local time (17:00 – 18:00 GMT) outside the Parliament building and Szechenyi Square.

An LGBTQ march is expected to take place on 1 October from 17:30 – 20:30 local time (15:30 – 18:30 GMT) along main roads and squares in the Inner City area.

Counterprotests are possible for both gatherings.

"Hungary is backing the wrong horse - again."

Depends how someone define wrong.

Financial, mineral, political dependencies/ neccesities. 

"It's not a proper democracy."

Probably not.

But there were moments of history when even in proper democratic way people actualy voted to dissolve that corrupt goood for nothing system.

-@SimCityAT

"If all of Fidesz was removed and a new government came in, the Forint would be stronger."

fluffy2560

"The only way it can be reformed is a new reformist government and specifically not involving OV and his cronies."

And also would arrive all the funds which were held back/ dismissed for years (just in the past 7), which is equivalent a few years state budget.

In short the dictate is:

EU/ deep state:

"We make you bankrupt, and do whatever to enforce a system change."

"After that happens: there will money for the creation of the new world order in Hungary."

So their plan is clear - not hidden.

But also micalculated.

Many of us not so happy with the government, but it is more or less accepted as it picks up issues and make a legal + order type approach. Painfully moderate off course.

Example 1.:

1.1. Anno when started the artificially organised migrant tide many would be volunteer as machine gunner/ certain organisations were ready to defend the country.

1.2. Governement decided to pick up the issue, made a fence + sent military/ police instead.

So in many many issue what they do is: do it in a very moderate and also political way before other forces do it in radical way. The strange magic is: it is working. Like a tacit contract: they pick up the issue in a moderate way and radicals do not act as wish = order kept.

How long will it work? No idea.

But one thing is sure: while the new world order was capable to mobilize radicals, like Azov/ similars in Ukraine for their agenda at here they cannot. But local forces will act against them instead when this moderation contract cease to exist.

"But can you substantiate that Aldi/Lidl etc claim?"

Easy. As by law packed products must contain where they were produced, often there are info which corporations acted as distributors as well.

Anyway that is the situation long since: the local agricultural producer gets like 5-10% for the apple which sold on 100% price in the big chains (or exported as material for some German/ Austrian/ etc... food factory to make finished products).

"I still hear stories from people here who are supporting Putin"

Not neccesarily supporting an exact person.

More like the bipolar alliance (unipolar world ended).

Allies: Russia, China, Iran, Syria, Brasil, Cuba, Palestine, Catalonia. (Columbia?)

Many unaffiliated/ in-between.

Opponents: NATO (USA/ deep state), EU, 14 eye, UK/ former dominum Commonwealth members (+few thousands NGO)

"According to the latest polls his strategy works, around 86% blame EU policies for current situation in HU."

I doubt that 86% would think about the root of problems.

There's a protest going on in the town and lots of routes are blocked. Teachers this time. Kids were off school today because of it. Mrs F is driving in the town now and says it's snarled up.

As of 5 October 2022 a large protest has prompted disruptions in the capital Budapest. Thousands of participants have gathered in front of the Parliament building after earlier blocking streets around Margaret Bridge. The protest – in support of an ongoing teachers' strike – has prompted extensive disruptions to vehicle traffic and public transportation in central Budapest, although no significant violent incidents have been reported.

Trash workers had a protest/ strike recently.

They get what they wanted (one month bonus minimal wage becauseon  inflation/ energy crisis).

Also most of the workers (who work for Budapest City Council) get the same one time bonus.

So respect for the trash workers: this is happened because they enforced it.

Hungary: Teachers' protests, strikes planned

On 23 October 2022 a teachers' protest will take place in at 16:00 local time (14:00 GMT) in the capital Budapest. Demonstrators will march from Kalvin ter square to the Muyegetem embankment.

On 27 October a nationwide strike has been planned by teachers unions; associated protests are likely. Although the size of the upcoming actions is unclear, they may draw large participation.

In recent weeks teachers' strikes and protests have taken place due to grievances over staff shortages, salaries and general school conditions. In response, some school authorities have reportedly threatened to fire – and in some cases have fired – teachers for having participated.

In response to the reports of threats, on 14 October protests took place in multiple cities nationwide including the capital Budapest, Debrecen, Gyor and Szombathely. In addition to teachers, students and parents have also joined the protests.

Note: One of our Fluffyettes was in Budapest last night (14 Oct) and saw the protest. It was heavily supported by many people.

Hungary: US Embassy releases Demonstration Alert regarding Budapest protests from 27-30 October

The US Embassy released a Demonstration Alert regarding multiple protests planned in the capital Budapest from 27-30 October 2022.

Teachers: The embassy notes that thousands of demonstrators are expected to gather across the city in support of teachers during the morning of 27 October, with a corresponding demonstration planned from 17:00 – 19:00 local time (15:00 – 17:00 GMT) at Heroes Square near the Terezvaros area of the city.

Iran: Additionally, the embassy warns of a demonstration in solidarity with ongoing protests in Iran from 13:00 – 15:00 local time (11:00 – 13:00 GMT) at Kossuth Lajos Square in the Lipotvaros area of the city on 29 October.

Szekely: A protest is also planned from 17:00 – 19:00 local time (15:00 – 17:00 GMT) on 29 October at Kossuth Lajos Square in support of Szekely Autonomy Day.