1 year Visa

colinoscapee wrote:

Not sure what you mean by that, you have a visa, you get it extended twice then do a visa run. Get a new visa in Cambodia then come back in. Of course it's tracked by immigration why wouldn't they, they will check your passport as you enter the country to see that you have a valid visa.

Sorry, I wasn't clear, my concern is that I am reading about people staying there for years and doing the Visa renewal over and over again.  That is what makes me nervous, that after doing that numerous times that I would end up on a list because the Vietnam Embassy sites states that you can renew it once.

dont believe everything you read on forums. Doing visa runs is very common.

My god, im counting 3 different threads within the same thread, everyone is talking at cross purposes.

RayG and sjpersonal have the concern right but not the right answers (im trying to stay on one precise thread here).

NO, you cannot make visa runs forever from any Asian country now. YES, before you could but not now. Its being checked and counted and you WILL reach a non-disclosed limit one of these days, maybe even the next time you go out. It happened to me in Malaysia (which caused me to start looking for a new home like VN), and it happened to scores of expats in Thailand, all starting from about last April. YES, if you have a long term visa (marriage or company) they would not ordinarily deny you entry but we are talking about people who dont have those, people who only have simple 90-day visas, or 30-day visas for that matter.

RayG, you are correct and your last post has been repeated numerous times in other forums, Paltalk, etc. Logic says the countries should welcome the influx of foreign spending but they dont care anymore. In a Paltalk room I often listen to locals explain the sharp decline of foreigners, shops closing, etc. Nobody in government cares. Nobody wants an expat's $1000 a month spending, they want factories and big spending, otherwise its BYEBYE.

Thailand, Philippines, Malaysia have retirement visas but there are rules and capital required. People not able to do that face marriage or company formation or special approved purpose as the only options left.

While in Sai Gon the past month I had meetings with my lawyer and he confirmed what I said. People who want to come to Asia to basically hang out are not going to be allowed in the future. Come with capital or some grand purpose or reason, or forget it.

Also while in Sai Gon, I got a new 90-day visa starting January (not an extension of my current 90day visa) so that i could stay 90+90 on the next trip. But the agent warned me that while he would process the visa and an extension starting April, the government is under no obligation to honor it, they can deny entry if they choose. In 15 years in Asia nobody ever said that but now they do. YES things are changing and it would be folly to land off the airplane with a 90day and believe you can just set up housekeeping and get on with your life. Not so.

I cant say, and dont know, what would happen in any individual circumstance. Maybe by some grace of god, miracle, feast, famine, some person could continually slip through the cracks for the next 500 years. Given no exact printed rules, who can say? But the TREND is clear. So make plans based on the trends, not on the insane belief its YOU who is going to win the big lottery.

The loose-on-its-hinges door thats closing is the one some of you, living by the seat of your pants have been passing through for decades. That method isnt going to work so well from now on.

cvco wrote:

But the agent warned me that while he would process the visa and an extension starting April, the government is under no obligation to honor it, they can deny entry if they choose. In 15 years in Asia nobody ever said that but now they do. YES things are changing and it would be folly to land off the airplane with a 90day and believe you can just set up housekeeping and get on with your life. Not so.

Thanks for the new information. It's no longer a vital personal concern as I have 5 year visa exemption. As far as I know a visa has never been an obligation of the issuing country to admit you. You can still be inadmissible at the time you want to enter a country.  The US is very clear about that but other countries less so. I'd take the travel agent's warning as one piece of information.  As of yet I haven't heard of anyone being denied a Vietnamese visa simply because he has had one recently or had multiple visas in their lifetime or being denied entry to Vietnam at the border for the same reasons, nor have I seen any media reports of an official change in policy.  When you're not a citizen of a country you always run the risk of being asked to leave or being unable to re-enter after leaving.  Even residency is only as good as the law that grants it and the law can be changed in every country I know of.  Granted it's better to have a stamp in your passport that is good for 10 years and than one for 90 days but in all cases you're subject to changes in policy, regulations and laws.

I personally wouldn't buy property in any country where I had to renew my permission to stay in the country every 90 days but wouldn't avoid or pull up and leave a country where I was happy just because of the possibility that sometime in the future I might not be able to live there.

Even citizenship is not an iron-clad guarantee of being able to enter a country. Norway and Canada are now revoking citizenship for their citizens who were fighting as jihadists and other countries have done the same for other reasons in the past.

IMHO I think that now ASEAN is coming into being here in South East Asia the member countries are perhaps trying to standardize visa processes as citizens of each member country has the right to travel and work in each country.

stumpy wrote:

IMHO I think that now ASEAN is coming into being here in South East Asia the member countries are perhaps trying to standardize visa processes as citizens of each member country has the right to travel and work in each country.

Yes and ive repeated that until im blue in the face, no need for "IMHO" because its plain truth. I dont know how ASEAN cooperation is actually done but since at least the past 10 years when one member starts the others usually fall into line. I dont believe members are required to follow each other but it IS an organization meant to standardize elements the same way Eurozone does so one shouldnt be surprised at commonalty between them. When both Malaysia and Thailand adopted similar immigration rules in 2014, i cringed for Vietnam news. But ASEAN, meant originally as a trading block force has since expanded into all sorts of cooperation, like Vietnam automatically working on the missing MH370 airliner. Immigration would likely become standardised too, logically.

But Vietnam has a major difference going on. Malaysia and Thailand dont give a rats ass for USA and are not parties to the US Free Trade agreement. But Vietnam is, and that desire to rapidly pick up trade and foreign direct investment surely must be influencing its immigration decisions, hence easier in Vietnam for now. Then again, its Communist line commits less of a guarantee of anything. Vietnam is a wildcard. My lawyer said Vietnam is crazy to pick up American money now and hence no friction or open talk against Americans' role in the War (which is very active and multiple lawsuits in the background). I have to admit i was curious why Viets smile at me instead of spit on me. Thats why.

RayG says it right and i hope newcomers read that post. I also agree that fear of change shouldnt stop plan-making (when there is at least a foothold better than a tourist visa). The best way to proceed is goahead with plans but also have an escape plan, the lack of which decimated the expat community in Thailand this summer.

Do any of you know what a Black Swan is? Since its Thanksgiving time i'll use that example. The turkey lives merrily along 364 days a year without the slightest idea that his status might change. On the 365th day, off with his head, and then, only in hindsight he learns that his potential change in status on the last day of the year was highly predictable. The immigration rules of ASEAN IS a black swan and sometime its going to land. Its not fearmongering, I dont wish to leave but this is the leaning now and its nobodys fault.

I said in an early post that Ive been in Malaysia under a work permit in my own company. The permit expired, i didnt seek re-newal and have been doing visa runs for a while. Last May, routine run, I got denied entry with no explanation, just no. They gave me a special 3-day visa only good for a visit to the immigration office where again they said no. Though a company owner, still no, and it would be the same for married people who are married but without a spouse visa for themselves. I left to go back to US for 3 months and then came back and got 90 days. Then I went to Sai Gon for a month and returned now and got 90 days again. I need to shift out or get a visa to stay here because ive got big fat black swans right over my head.

Oh you might ask why i just dont get a new work permit. Its because I no longer qualify to work in my own company, they say Managing Director positions should have been handed off to locals by now. See how it goes? Company or marriage visas help but no guarantees. Thats why the need for an escape plan for any expat, either to another country or back home. I do NOT want to go back home.

cvco wrote:

My god, im counting 3 different threads within the same thread, everyone is talking at cross purposes.

RayG and sjpersonal have the concern right but not the right answers (im trying to stay on one precise thread here).

NO, you cannot make visa runs forever from any Asian country now. YES, before you could but not now. Its being checked and counted and you WILL reach a non-disclosed limit one of these days, maybe even the next time you go out. It happened to me in Malaysia (which caused me to start looking for a new home like VN), and it happened to scores of expats in Thailand, all starting from about last April. YES, if you have a long term visa (marriage or company) they would not ordinarily deny you entry but we are talking about people who dont have those, people who only have simple 90-day visas, or 30-day visas for that matter.

RayG, you are correct and your last post has been repeated numerous times in other forums, Paltalk, etc. Logic says the countries should welcome the influx of foreign spending but they dont care anymore. In a Paltalk room I often listen to locals explain the sharp decline of foreigners, shops closing, etc. Nobody in government cares. Nobody wants an expat's $1000 a month spending, they want factories and big spending, otherwise its BYEBYE.

Thailand, Philippines, Malaysia have retirement visas but there are rules and capital required. People not able to do that face marriage or company formation or special approved purpose as the only options left.

While in Sai Gon the past month I had meetings with my lawyer and he confirmed what I said. People who want to come to Asia to basically hang out are not going to be allowed in the future. Come with capital or some grand purpose or reason, or forget it.

Also while in Sai Gon, I got a new 90-day visa starting January (not an extension of my current 90day visa) so that i could stay 90+90 on the next trip. But the agent warned me that while he would process the visa and an extension starting April, the government is under no obligation to honor it, they can deny entry if they choose. In 15 years in Asia nobody ever said that but now they do. YES things are changing and it would be folly to land off the airplane with a 90day and believe you can just set up housekeeping and get on with your life. Not so.

I cant say, and dont know, what would happen in any individual circumstance. Maybe by some grace of god, miracle, feast, famine, some person could continually slip through the cracks for the next 500 years. Given no exact printed rules, who can say? But the TREND is clear. So make plans based on the trends, not on the insane belief its YOU who is going to win the big lottery.

The loose-on-its-hinges door thats closing is the one some of you, living by the seat of your pants have been passing through for decades. That method isnt going to work so well from now on.

Thank you!.  Your post makes perfect sense to me.  You are the first person on this forum, that I have read, who has posted this.  It just was not Logical to me, that any country would state that foreigners could not retire there without some special circumstances and a large investment into their country, then say/do nothing when those same foreigners set up house there for years by renewing their visas and doing border runs over and over again.  It just did not make sense to me.  So I will keep watch for any favorable changes for expats, doubtful and if nothing changes at least I can take long vacations there. 

I am interested in getting more information on the Temporary Residency Certificate as setting up an LLC in the US is quite easy, but I am sure that there are financial requirements attached to that.

Thank you again.

cvco wrote:

.My lawyer said Vietnam is crazy to pick up American money now and hence no friction or open talk against Americans' role in the War (which is very active and multiple lawsuits in the background). I have to admit i was curious why Viets smile at me instead of spit on me. Thats why

That may be the motivation behind attitudes of the government but not the Vietnamese people.  On my first visits after the war in the 80's I was wary of the reception I might receive as an American. Across the board I was treated differently, I was treated better than other nationalities by both government officials and regular people.  That special treatment has largely disappeared now that Vietnam is open and has foreign residents and lots of tourists but in 32 years I've only encountered one person who displayed any resentment to me over the American War.  She was a nurse who had been on duty in the Bach Mai Hospital outside Hanoi the night that the US bombed it.  She didn't want to meet or speak with me and I found her feelings quite understandable.  Whatever the governments may do I don't see the the Vietnamese people developing any hostility toward individual Americans for a war that ended almost 40 years ago. It still affects some American military veterans and some Viet kieu but not the people in Vietnam.

Right.

It was very easy before. I know some expats who survived on visa runs for many years and nobody asked any questions. They bought apartments, put kids through school, lived normally. Then suddenly BANG.

But like RayG said, without actual hard changes like, everyone denied entry, get on with plans but keep in mind the lack of hard permanence. Just keep it in mind and hopefully along the way a really good solution can be found. I recommend getting to know a lawyer and a few travel agents because between those two you'll have most or all of what youd need.

My lawyer says right now is a great time for company formation (translation: foreigners are welcome) and it takes about 2-4 months to complete--through a lawyer anyway, although locals just do it themselves. This is a different topic but the point is to go to VN and start the steps to residency and the particular solutions you need. Something will give.

Like ive read in here 1000X, there is always a way, some way or the other. I believe that.

If I can gather the money i'll keep a place in Malaysia AND Vietnam. Its not a new idea but it can be an excellent way and promote a high feeling of security. One intrepid individual I read about is involved with 3-4 places, all shared. Members just keep rotating to the shared places and to each individual country it always appears the members have been gone a long time and when they go back there is no visa problem. Weird but creative, especially if a working internet nomad (WIN).

Still, im pretty deaf and blind and dumb, you know. Why didnt I focus on marrying a minister's daughter and end the craziness once and for all? Ugghhhhhh.....

Your lawyer doesn't seem to be too on the ball from what you have been writing here.

Ray, seeing as nearly 50.% of Vietnamese are under 30 years old and have no connection to the war , I think this has a lot to do with the attitude towards foreigners.The only time I have ever had problems was in the North, which is where most people have problems.

colinoscapee wrote:

Your lawyer doesn't seem to be too on the ball from what you have been writing here.

Ray, seeing as nearly 50.% of Vietnamese are under 30 years old and have no connection to the war , I think this has a lot to do with the attitude towards foreigners.The only time I have ever had problems was in the North, which is where most people have problems.

Not on the ball about what?

And the war, true, kids dont have connections but what about their parents, grandparents, cousins, etc? They never talked about the war around the dinner table?

I got into a taxi one day and the driver asked where im from. I said US and he said Ha Noi. He just look at me and didnt say anymore. Neither did I.

Not on the ball as in the point about denying visas, rare as rocking horse shit. The point about the people talking about the war, the young generation is not interested, maybe once you actually live here you will understand, but living in Malaysia and doing short trips here doesn't give you a lot of insight.

cvco wrote:

I got into a taxi one day and the driver asked where im from. I said US and he said Ha Noi. He just look at me and didnt say anymore. Neither did I.

Maybe he couldn't speak English well, just some basic sentences.
My father was in the army about more than 10 years, but we haven't talk about war. Or rarely talk about it, just some memory about his difficult life at that time.
We don't care if you are from US or not. Just think how to communicate in English with you !