I'm an EU citizen who has lived in Hungary for almost 7 years, I'm married to a Hungarian and I have had full time employment here sicne I arrived. Although EU citizens benefits from a lot less hassle when it comes to living a Hungary compared to non-EU ones there is one problem that keeps reoccurring for me and I wonder how the rest of you EU expats out there deals with this.
My problem is regarding the registration card/Hungarian I.D card/lack of staying permit. I have the EU registration card which is supposed to be enough, I have my lakcimkartya, TAJ kartya and all the rest you need yo live here. However, the system some how missed the fact that Hungary is an EU country with EU citizens who are allowed to reside in Hungary as long as they wish without the typical staying permit non EU-citizens get.
This causes me troubles e.g. when applying for a credit card at the bank (not the normal debit card that you also can use in the stores, I mean one you can get actual credit on). The reason I can't get one despite I fulfill all criteria is I do not have the number that is listed on the ID card (the type foreigners can get if they have a staying permit). My bank tried with the EU registration card number but it was denied, they were pretty surprised themselves.
Likewise I can't buy things on credit, e.g. a TV - only because I lack that specific document. Buying a flat and taking a big loan to pay for it works however just fine without ID card.
The thing is that people, or the system they represent, don't recognize that it is possible to live in Hungary without staying permit unless you are Hungarian citizen. EU citizens are somewhere in between.
This week I was told I can't apply for a drivers license unless I have a residence permit (the EU one didn't count). Obviously, there must be a way and I will of course speak to another school but it is very frustrating that this keeps happening so many years after Hungary joined EU.
I've been to the migration office and begged them to give me a residence card of the type all other immigrants have but of course they said I can't get it because I don't need it.
Considering applying for Hungarian citizenship just to get that darn ID card but why would I when I'm perfectly happy with citizenship I already have?
The European Union Citizen Registration Card Dilemma
anyhow wrote:.... have the number that is listed on the ID card (the type foreigners can get if they have a staying permit). My bank tried with the EU registration card number but it was denied, they were pretty surprised themselves.
This week I was told I can't apply for a drivers license unless I have a residence permit (the EU one didn't count). .....
1) Why not use your passport number instead of the EU registration card?
2) Trade your old EU license in for a HU one.
3) Don't buy things on credit.
Sounds like the typical Hungarian bureaucracy at work. Ask one question, get 12 different answers.
I know someone who may be able to help, but they are not a free service (but they only charge if they get some results). Last week this person solved a bureaucratic issue for one person that had been ongoing and unresolved since 1983 -- 30 years. PM me if you are interested.
klsallee wrote:Sounds like the typical Hungarian bureaucracy at work. Ask one question, get 12 different answers.
I know someone who may be able to help, but they are not a free service (but they only charge if they get some results). Last week this person solved a bureaucratic issue for one person that had been ongoing and unresolved since 1983 -- 30 years. PM me if you are interested.
Might be just as easy to take it here (and it's free):
SOLVIT
fluffy2560 wrote:Might be just as easy to take it here (and it's free):
SOLVIT
Not free, since it is a branch of the EU Commission you have already paid for it from EU taxes. More correct to say it will not cost you any additional fee beyond the taxes you already paid.
Also, and it may be because I am an American, but handing an issue about one bureaucracy into the hands of another bureaucracy (which requires you to enter your data into an online database) and possible wait 10 weeks to get a result, maybe (since they may not take your issue), is to me not a huge comfort. Especially as it seems SOLVIT sends the issue to a SOLVIT bureaucratic office back in Hungary. Seems very circular since there is actually an Ombudsman in Hungary one can write more directly. But if it works for you, that is fine also.
I for one hire a dentist to work on my teeth, I don't do it myself. I hire a roofer to repair my roof, an attorney to deal with legal issues, an accountant to deal with tax issues (especially in Hungary -- I don't need one for US tax issues) and a often a plumber to fix my pipes. Some things I can do myself, but some times it makes sense to get a non-bureaucratic professional's help to help with bureaucratic issues.
I quickly learned my time is worth more than to waste it dealing with bureaucracies as I am not an expert navigating them, and especially when I know some competent professionals whose fees are modest and they solved my issues. But that is just me of course, I am willing to pay for a service. And in some cases my issue I assigned a professional to deal with was completed with a few well placed phone calls over a few hours or days. Not in 10 weeks.
But people should be presented all the available options they have open to them so they can select and make an individual decision in their best temporal and financial interests.
klsallee wrote:Not free, since it is a branch of the EU Commission you have already paid for it from EU taxes. More correct to say it will not cost you any additional fee beyond the taxes you already paid.
OK, not free in that sense.
klsallee wrote:... possible wait 10 weeks to get a result, maybe (since they may not take your issue), is to me not a huge comfort. Especially as it seems SOLVIT sends the issue to a SOLVIT bureaucratic office back in Hungary. Seems very circular since there is actually an Ombudsman in Hungary one can write more directly.
Yes, well, this might be a problem. 10 weeks is a bit long. What are these people doing? In theory SOLVIT itself might end up being the subject of a SOLVIT case, especially here. I'd attack it on multiple fronts anyway. Always good to have a Plan B.
klsallee wrote:I for one hire a dentist to work on my teeth, I don't do it myself. I hire a roofer to repair my roof, an attorney to deal with legal issues, an accountant to deal with tax issues (especially in Hungary -- I don't need one for US tax issues) and a often a plumber to fix my pipes. Some things I can do myself, but some times it makes sense to get a non-bureaucratic professional's help to help with bureaucratic issues.
In theory, getting help should be easier. Politicians are to blame for much. However, SOLVIT might work and since it's already paid for, one could just try anyway.
klsallee wrote:.... my issue I assigned a professional to deal with was completed with a few well placed phone calls over a few hours or days. Not in 10 weeks.
On the other hand, if it shouldn't be a case of who you know with equal distribution of service to the individual.
From what I read, there are a bunch of issues in the case and different mechanisms are at work which needs different action:
1) Driving License - could use SOLVIT. Sounds ideal to me for SOLVIT.
2) Credit - might be a problem of the bank or credit provider. not taking on the EU passport holder's details. Credit reference bureaux can be part of the state - no idea here - and this might be run by the national bank or it could be privately run. Action then might be via SOLVIT, direct complaint etc.
I would say, submit multiple complaints via different routes. Cover the all the complaining bases.
Thank you fluffy2560 and klsallee for your replies and suggestions, will look into SOLVIT and see if it could be an option.
Regarding using my passport number instead of the EU registration card; the passport is accepted for identification purposes but not to prove my residency. In many cases, the problem is that the passport or EU registration card number does not match the length and type of characters used by the I.D. card so if you fill out a form, or enter it into a system, the data won't match and unfortunately banks and other institutions don't seem to have a manual work around for it.
Regarding trading my old EU license in for a HU one - if I had a license already, I would of course not need to apply for one, neither would I need any driving lessons.
anyhow wrote:...Regarding using my passport number instead of the EU registration card; the passport is accepted for identification purposes but not to prove my residency. In many cases, the problem is that the passport or EU registration card number does not match the length and type of characters used by the I.D. card so if you fill out a form, or enter it into a system, the data won't match and unfortunately banks and other institutions don't seem to have a manual work around for it.
I looked into this a bit - I worked once on credit bureaux so I have bit of an idea. You need to ask this organisation to help you: BISZ - Credit Bureau in Hungary. This is owned by all the financial institutions and is a not as far as I can see a government body. There should however be a regulator for it.
According to what I have read they store ID numbers and passport numbers which should mean there are a sufficient variety of indexes to find or register you in the system. I believe the fault lies specifically with the IT systems of the credit provider, which has not allowed for alternate registration paths based upon different forms of ID.
They are, it would seem to me, to be discriminating against EU/EEA citizens if they cannot register EU/EEA persons at the BISZ or at the banks/financial institutions.
I'd take it directly to the complaints section of BISZ, thence to SOLVIT if no joy.
anyhow wrote:Regarding trading my old EU license in for a HU one - if I had a license already, I would of course not need to apply for one, neither would I need any driving lessons.
Ok, didn't know you didn't have one - couldn't tell from the original post. I'd try for this one via SOLVIT if you are not getting a result you require.
Please let us know how you get on. It could be a useful bit of knowledge to share here and of technical interest.
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