Advice on cafe/business licence

I don't think there is any other way :
Limited company with 2'000'000 baht capital and 4 thai workers to be able to get 1 work permit for foreigner
2 work permits = 4'000'000 baht capital and 8 thai workers
... and so on
half of the capital required if you have a thai wife

Hi, to get a work permit you will have to form a Thai company, it is the company that will apply for the work permit. Also this company must employ 4 Thai nationals to support 1 work visa. The majority ownership of the company must be Thai. It's a minefield but doable. Be careful
Barry

There is something wrong with the maths. There is no 50/50. More like 51% Thai ownership and 49% the mug with all the money.

Yes I know 49/51 split cheers.

Thanks for your comments. Gonna get legal advice to start.

There is no way to do this on the cheap, even with legal advice.

I'm not looking to do it on the cheap. Just the easiest way. 🙄

Okay, up to you, as they say.  No doubt there is an easy way I have never heard of.

the easiest way is not to own any business in Thailand and work for s.o. instead

All sorted. Got a lawyer. Set up my business with two other share holders, work permit in process. Smooth as anything and all for 75,000baht . Happy with that.

That was expensive , will take you a long time to earn that back with other costs taken into consideration .  Please keep us all informed of the progress.

Well I was happy to pay more to get the job done in a  way I could understand it. English speaking person explaining it to me perfectly with his Thai wife doing the legal stuff as she is the solicitor. I did go to other law firms but the English was not good and I like to know exactly the process and know that everything is as it should be.

Thanks for the help all.

JOM 1
Couldn't name that solicitor?
I'm investigating options too

Hi
The company I used is  Samui Law Firm

JoM1 thank you

I have been living on and off in Thailand for 6 years.  As far as I know if you are a Farang living in Thailand it is or is almost impossible to buy a business or set one up and work in it yourself, just not allowed and very heavily enforced unless you have a very special visa (not likely).   
   Thailand is full of stories about these offences...It is an offence to do volunteer work also of any kind.  Just do the rounds around any town Hue Hin, Bangkok, Chang Mia, Patteya and see all the Farang with coffee shops or bars or businesses who will not venture behind the bar for fear of being dobbed in to immigration for actually working and be deported, yes deported immediately, a very common mistake, you can own a business, give orders but you cannot work in it.  If you think you can start or buy a business and work in it in Thailand think again...very very unlikely...sorry
    Thailand is nothing like what you might expect to be allowed to do in most Western Countries.  You can be a tourist or a long term resident,  but you can't work.  That is why you have enough income when you apply for a retirement visa to prove you can support yourself without working in any business including your own.

My work permit which is specific for the business says I am the business owner, manager, and chef so I can work in my business thankfully.

I have been living in SE Asia on and off for the last 5 years so have not gone into business lightly.

DavoWaldo wrote:

I have been living on and off in Thailand for 6 years.  As far as I know if you are a Farang living in Thailand it is or is almost impossible to buy a business or set one up and work in it yourself, just not allowed and very heavily enforced unless you have a very special visa (not likely).   
   Thailand is full of stories about these offences...It is an offence to do volunteer work also of any kind.  Just do the rounds around any town Hue Hin, Bangkok, Chang Mia, Patteya and see all the Farang with coffee shops or bars or businesses who will not venture behind the bar for fear of being dobbed in to immigration for actually working and be deported, yes deported immediately, a very common mistake, you can own a business, give orders but you cannot work in it.  If you think you can start or buy a business and work in it in Thailand think again...very very unlikely...sorry
    Thailand is nothing like what you might expect to be allowed to do in most Western Countries.  You can be a tourist or a long term resident,  but you can't work.  That is why you have enough income when you apply for a retirement visa to prove you can support yourself without working in any business including your own.

Totally full of non sens !
You are wrong, it is possible for a foreigner to work in Thailand. It is also possible to create a company, own 49% of a business and get a work permit.
There are some jobs that are not allowed for foreigners but MANY foreigners work in the country legally.
By definition a retirement visa is for retired people ... so they should not work ... 
By definition a tourist visa is for tourists ... so they should not work ... 
... if you want to work you need a non immigrant B visa that allows you to get a work permit 

Also you are permitted to work if you are married to a thai, provided you have a work permit etc.

If you come/go to Australia and have one million + dollars to built a house (not buy one ) funds to live on for an extended time and an additional million dollars cash to start a business, you might be granted a business visa after extensive investigation.  If you go to most Western Countries to start a new business, immigration requirements vary but it likely that you encounter conditions not unlike Australia.  Thailand is no exception.  Many other countries in S/E Asia yes, also with conditions.

" I have been living on and off in Thailand for 6 years.  As far as I know if you are a Farang living in Thailand it is or is almost impossible to buy a business or set one up and work in it yourself, just not allowed and very heavily enforced unless you have a very special visa (not likely)."

You will note that I said to start a business that you can work in "you need a very special visa".  You can start and own a business and appoint a manager but it is very difficult to be actively engaged as a worker in that business.  With a large investment where you just supervise and not actually do any work this may be OK.  Just do the rounds of bars and see how many owners are sitting out the front keeping a eye on things not game to venture behind the bar or kitchen for fear of being reported to immigration.  And this happens often, disgruntled competitors will dob you in as quick as they can.  If they do you will have to front up.

Try running a business and work behind the bar or counter and see just how long it takes before you have front up to immigration to answer "why you should not be deported" yes even doing volunteering for free work you will have to defend yourself.  Some people do work that can be done by a Thai and get away with it, many do not and suffer the consequences.

My point is be very very careful.

DavoWaldo wrote:

You will note that I said to start a business that you can work in "you need a very special visa".  You can start and own a business and appoint a manager but it is very difficult to be actively engaged as a worker in that business.

WRONG

DavoWaldo wrote:

With a large investment where you just supervise and not actually do any work this may be OK.

WRONG

DavoWaldo wrote:

Try running a business and work behind the bar or counter and see just how long it takes before you have front up to immigration to answer "why you should not be deported"

I did run a business I owned and I never got deported, so WRONG again

DavoWaldo wrote:

yes even doing volunteering for free work you will have to defend yourself.

volunteering jobs are just not allowed in Thailand ! That's the law ! Follow the law and you won't have any issue with immigration.

DavoWaldo wrote:

Some people do work that can be done by a Thai and get away with it, many do not and suffer the consequences..

Like in any country, if you work illegally you have troubles. If you have a WP and the correct visa, no problems

DavoWaldo wrote:

My point is be very very careful.

At least one correct sentence in all you say !!!

Krisaupaysdespiments wrote:

DavoWaldo wrote:

You will note that I said to start a business that you can work in "you need a very special visa".  You can start and own a business and appoint a manager but it is very difficult to be actively engaged as a worker in that business.

WRONG

DavoWaldo wrote:

With a large investment where you just supervise and not actually do any work this may be OK.

WRONG

DavoWaldo wrote:

Try running a business and work behind the bar or counter and see just how long it takes before you have front up to immigration to answer "why you should not be deported"

I did run a business I owned and I never got deported, so WRONG again

DavoWaldo wrote:

yes even doing volunteering for free work you will have to defend yourself.

volunteering jobs are just not allowed in Thailand ! That's the law ! Follow the law and you won't have any issue with immigration.

DavoWaldo wrote:

Some people do work that can be done by a Thai and get away with it, many do not and suffer the consequences..

Like in any country, if you work illegally you have troubles. If you have a WP and the correct visa, no problems

DavoWaldo wrote:

My point is be very very careful.

At least one correct sentence in all you say !!!

There very few job categories where you can obtain a work permit if that work can be done by a Thai.  You need a work permit to work in your own business, restaurant , bars, coffee shops etc. it is almost  impossible to get a work permit in these industries.  There are millions of Thais that can do these types of work. greasing palms may help???

DavoWaldo, I know nothing about retirement visas and I don't talk about them. You are not working in Thailand, you are retired.
I am working in Thailand and I can talk about non B visas and work permits. I have been preparing them for me and for my staffs for 8 years now without any money given to any one, unlike you say.
Please do not give wrong informations about a subject you don't know.
JoM1 just said that he has a business, he is the owner and the manager and he has a work permit allowing him to work in his business.
Many bars/restaurant owners in Thailand are not allowed to work in their own business beacause they are on a retirement visa and therefore working is prohibited. Some others are married to a Thai citizen and do not apply for a work permit because they don't want to create a company so working is prohibited.

Krisaupaysdespiments wrote:

DavoWaldo, I know nothing about retirement visas and I don't talk about them. You are not working in Thailand, you are retired.
I am working in Thailand and I can talk about non B visas and work permits. I have been preparing them for me and for my staffs for 8 years now without any money given to any one, unlike you say.
Please do not give wrong informations about a subject you don't know.
JoM1 just said that he has a business, he is the owner and the manager and he has a work permit allowing him to work in his business.
Many bars/restaurant owners in Thailand are not allowed to work in their own business beacause they are on a retirement visa and therefore working is prohibited. Some others are married to a Thai citizen and do not apply for a work permit because they don't want to create a company so working is prohibited.

.

It is clear that you have obtained all the correct requirement perhaps for a larger businesss (can be daunting).  My advice is about the many people I know who legally cannot work in the small business they own or would like to own.  Mostly these issues are settled by Thais advising their Farang competitors in the same street that they are in breach of the law, they go away the problem goes away.

  Have a look at a post on this site with this heading....
                                    "List of Prohibited Jobs for Westerners in Thailand."

Ok my cafe a is niched vegan cafe.... most Thai cooks don't understand the concept of vegan. So that's why my work permit allows me to be the chef, cook etc although I'm not allowed to make juices though as this is seen as beneath me apparently, which is laughable. My juices are in fact super healthy concoctions put together like a barista would make coffee, so I doubt many Thai people would understand why different fruits and veg go together and the health benefits.

I am being careful and that's why I paid slightly over the top for a decent law firm to handle my stuff for me.

It is clear that you have obtained all the correct requirement perhaps for a larger businesss (can be daunting).  My advice is about the many people I know who legally cannot work in the small business they own or would like to own.  Mostly these issues are settled by Thais advising their Farang competitors in the same street that they are in breach of the law, they go away the problem goes away.



For sure there are idiots who don't do their research and think they can get away with having a small business and flying under the radar. Buddha knows how many Thai people do this thinking they don't have to pay tax and in fact that's why the business is now registered as my company with two other shareholders as opposed to the partnership 49/51 that my Thai friend and I were going to do. She didn't want to pay taxes or have business overheads. But I wanted to be legal and do it right.

I hear that over on Phangan recently some farangs got deported for running a hostel without the necessary legal infrastructure in place. thats just plain stupid if you ask me and I am far from that

ps for those that are referring to me as he/him I am in fact she/her lol Maybe I should stick a profile pic up for clarification.

JoM1 wrote:

It is clear that you have obtained all the correct requirement perhaps for a larger businesss (can be daunting).  My advice is about the many people I know who legally cannot work in the small business they own or would like to own.  Mostly these issues are settled by Thais advising their Farang competitors in the same street that they are in breach of the law, they go away the problem goes away.



For sure there are idiots who don't do their research and think they can get away with having a small business and flying under the radar. Buddha knows how many Thai people do this thinking they don't have to pay tax and in fact that's why the business is now registered as my company with two other shareholders as opposed to the partnership 49/51 that my Thai friend and I were going to do. She didn't want to pay taxes or have business overheads. But I wanted to be legal and do it right.

I hear that over on Phangan recently some farangs got deported for running a hostel without the necessary legal infrastructure in place. thats just plain stupid if you ask me and I am far from that

ps for those that are referring to me as he/him I am in fact she/her lol Maybe I should stick a profile pic up for clarification.

My name is almost my real name I would prefer to use my real name I like it.   I did that on Thai visa with lots of posts and lots of insults but yes lots of replies.  Most people like to communicate with real people.   Perhaps you could think up a name which does disclose your gender....Jo Something or other?

Not many men called Davo?

JoM1 wrote:

Ok my cafe a is niched vegan cafe.... most Thai cooks don't understand the concept of vegan. So that's why my work permit allows me to be the chef, cook etc although I'm not allowed to make juices though as this is seen as beneath me apparently, which is laughable. My juices are in fact super healthy concoctions put together like a barista would make coffee, so I doubt many Thai people would understand why different fruits and veg go together and the health benefits.

I am being careful and that's why I paid slightly over the top for a decent law firm to handle my stuff for me.

I repeat it is very difficult to get a work permit for an job that can be done by a Thai.  You need special skills.  It is clear that you have succeeded in your efforts to get the require permits to work in your own specialized business.

The original post seeks information about coming to Thailand and opening a shop or business which most likely will be a competitor for a local existing Thai Business...NOT LIKELY TO HAPPEN.

Have a look at this...please
http://www.thaiembassy.com/thailand/wor … ailand.php

JoM1 wrote:

Hi fellow ex pats.... I'm on Samui and a Thai friend and I want to open a very small cafe. I've visited the DBD website but can't make head nor tails of it!

What is the best way to register so that I can get a work permit so I can actually legally work in our business? I don't think we need to go down the route of a limited company with memorandum and articles as really we will be  very small. I'm thinking an ordinary partnership seems the most straightforward way as we will be setting it up 50/50.

Is there an idiots guide anywhere?

Thanks ever so.

http://www.thaiembassy.com/thailand/wor … ailand.php

I rest my case...regards (Davo)  Waldo.

Krisaupaysdespiments wrote:

DavoWaldo wrote:

You will note that I said to start a business that you can work in "you need a very special visa".  You can start and own a business and appoint a manager but it is very difficult to be actively engaged as a worker in that business.

WRONG

DavoWaldo wrote:

With a large investment where you just supervise and not actually do any work this may be OK.

WRONG

DavoWaldo wrote:

Try running a business and work behind the bar or counter and see just how long it takes before you have front up to immigration to answer "why you should not be deported"

I did run a business I owned and I never got deported, so WRONG again

DavoWaldo wrote:

yes even doing volunteering for free work you will have to defend yourself.

volunteering jobs are just not allowed in Thailand ! That's the law ! Follow the law and you won't have any issue with immigration.

DavoWaldo wrote:

Some people do work that can be done by a Thai and get away with it, many do not and suffer the consequences..

Like in any country, if you work illegally you have troubles. If you have a WP and the correct visa, no problems

DavoWaldo wrote:

My point is be very very careful.

At least one correct sentence in all you say !!!

Did you do your homework...I did suggest it is almost impossible to come to Thailand set a small business and work in it yourself???  Are you convinced yet?

Not only I did my homework but I also set up my own small business a few years back and I work in it myself !
What's wrong with you ?

I'd be interested how you succeeded when a million others failed?  Perhaps you are selling a very special product or service?  Come on give us a clue.

There about 200 post on the site under the heading "List of prohibited jobs for Westerners to do in Thailand" clearly your work permit in your business is not one of these.  Come on again give us a clue.

JoM1 explained you how she did it but you don't seem to understand (or maybe don't want to understand ...?)
I did it the same way !
(I am not a hair dresser, not a doll maker, not a goldsmith and not a wood carver, so I was able to easily get a work permit!!!!!!!!  )