Tips and advice to thrive in Indonesia

Just some important advices.

When you run into problems.
Do not be physical or angry at police.
Do not be angry at government functions or officers.
Speaking loudly wont help speed up matters. There is no megaphone culture.
Rather... you need to speak in a friendly, polite voice. Deferentially asking for what help they can offer or things that can be done.

Your indignation and condemnations of what should be wont help a tiny bit in resolving the situation.
If you want to play the game, you better protect yourself first. And know the game better than them.

Arriving in Indonesia looks like you've rolled into any well developed country as Jakarta's airport is big and modern, then you drive down a well kept modern toll road into a city full of high rise blocks and massive shopping malls ......... then you get out of the taxi.

That's the time when you realise you've entered hell/heaven, get all your old social rule book and toss it into a rubbish bin, well, you would if there were any rubbish bins.

Hell or heaven is really nothing to do with Indonesia, but everything to do with the expat who decides on Indonesia's status.

I'll expand shortly, but people who move here must pack an open mind, a sense of humour and a large collection of smiles to give to everyone they meet.

Incidentally. Jakarta has a big brand New Aiport.
98% complete. Newspaper said.

Having lived more than half my life in the Far East, adapting to living in Indonesia was really nothing much. Same rules apply to so many other asian countries, be nice with the local people and stay calm and just enjoy yourself. Don't be loud, be respectful, be friendly and generous. Every country in Asia is different and Indonesia is just another country with it's own culture so there really isn't any challenge, it is more of a change of scene.

Also, I have been in and out of Indonesia for a very very long time, either living, working or visiting so it's really very easy to adapt to.

I think it's important to have lots of Indonesian friends and they say, your friends should include an accountant, a lawyer, a doctor and a politician, and I am lucky enough to have good friends who do these jobs, and a few others too who I can call on anytime for advice or assistance. So like anywhere, It's good to have useful contacts.

Opening a foreign bank account in addition to local bank accounts is important. Banks such as HSBC is pretty widespread in Indonesia and you can link your accounts to HSBC branches in other countries so that with internet banking you can instantly transfer foreign currency funds and open foreign currency accounts and make free international transfers. These days with international currencies being so volatile, especially Sterling, it is worth playing on the currency market. That and the high interest rates here (currently about 7.75% for 3 months FD).

As far as feeling at home, I felt at home the moment I got here.

As I'm from the UK, I'm going to base this post around the many shocks for a Brit to contend with.

Shaking hands with a man is done pretty much as you'd expect to shake hands with a woman.

Shaking hands with a woman is up to her, so wait for her to move and follow whatever she does.

A child will commonly kiss your hand or take it to their forehead as a sign of respect, as will your wife/very serious girlfriend.

A bit of weed isn't a minor nothing of a crime, it's five years locked up (regardless of your opinion on the subject).

The cop you're arguing with isn't a little nazi trying to give you a ticket, he's beating you over the head with a stick and dragging you off to be locked up.
Be polite, even if you know for sure you're right, because you aren't if it comes to an argument.

Indonesian driving is atrocious, so don't until you really know what you're doing, then grow eyes in your arse - you'll need them.

You'll very commonly get the 'foreigner' price, so go directly to the local fixed price shop and get an idea of what you should pay.

Allow small rip offs - you probably have a lot more money than them.

NEVER give money to child beggars, the vast majority have a slave handler taking the cash, and it's illegal anyway.
That woman begging with a baby or small child probably rented the kid, not gave birth to it.

The agent who knows exactly the right house for you to rent just doubled the price.

The agent who knows exactly the second hand car for you to buy just doubled the price.

The agent who knows exactly the <whatever> for you just doubled the price.

One very important advice that is often missed.

Learn the (goddamn for emphasis) language where you are in.
Do whatever it takes. Find strategies that work for you. Whether it is the maid, the driver or the visits from someone regular you know.

Or else you will feel like an outsider and wont adapt well at all.

Fortunately for you. Indonesian language is easy to learn. Easy structures and easy pronounciation.
My formal education in Indonesian language didnt go beyond primary school here. I enjoyed a diet of comic books as a kid that is all. But I could comprehend more than local university graduates in terms of reading and writing.
So it is really an easy language.

Oh I forgot to mention another useful thing.

Age of consent for heterosex is 16 and homosex is 19 here. So don't break those! There are big cases which landed the person into heavy jail terms, notwithstanding the activities are consensual. It can lead to blackmail too.
Homosexuality is not illegal, in comparison to Malaysia. Which is surprising really. Indonesia can be more moderate than Malaysia.

Though sex outside marriage may land you in trouble, it is generally not enforced.

So if you "make trouble" with a village girl, you are expected to marry her.
Failure to do so will lead to a quick trip to the local village elder and police station and some very choicy decisions.

Fred wrote:

Arriving in Indonesia looks like you've rolled into any well developed country as Jakarta's airport is big and modern, then you drive down a well kept modern toll road into a city full of high rise blocks and massive shopping malls ......... then you get out of the taxi.

That's the time when you realise you've entered hell/heaven, get all your old social rule book and toss it into a rubbish bin, well, you would if there were any rubbish bins.

Hell or heaven is really nothing to do with Indonesia, but everything to do with the expat who decides on Indonesia's status.

I'll expand shortly, but people who move here must pack an open mind, a sense of humour and a large collection of smiles to give to everyone they meet.

Large collections of smiles,,, hehehe,,, this is the most part i like here, Indo ppl are smiling all the time,, which is really Excellent. It gives me loads of positive energy, keep it up indonesianz...

enduringword wrote:

Oh I forgot to mention another useful thing.

Age of consent for heterosex is 16 and homosex is 19 here. So don't break those! There are big cases which landed the person into heavy jail terms, notwithstanding the activities are consensual. It can lead to blackmail too.
Homosexuality is not illegal, in comparison to Malaysia. Which is surprising really. Indonesia can be more moderate than Malaysia.

Though sex outside marriage may land you in trouble, it is generally not enforced.

So if you "make trouble" with a village girl, you are expected to marry her.
Failure to do so will lead to a quick trip to the local village elder and police station and some very choicy decisions.

Homosexuality is illegal in Malaysia but nobody really cares unless it serves to remove someone in politics. Just walking around some shopping malls, and especially in Parkson's, you'd think Kuala Lumpur was the gay capital of Asia. In fact, many of my Indonesian friends who visit Malaysia are very surprised just how liberal Malaysia really is.

But good advice about age of consent and sex outside marriage. My advice is to not mess around.

Good advice from Fred too. As for 'weed', you've gotta be a fool to have anything to do with any kind of drugs here in Indonesia.

Indonesia has a very relaxed attitude to homosexuality, but not totally.
There are a few people who get well miffed at the very idea of gay blokes, but the vast majority just don't care either way.
I've seen very camp men working in various industries, including education, all without any sign of their workmates being even slightly bothered about their sexuality.
However, LGBT rights are minimal, and outward attempts to push them are unwelcome in general, and hated by more extreme religious types (Of several religions, not just one).
It's a sort of "Live and let live, but don't shout about it" policy.

Salem_SBY wrote:

Large collections of smiles,,, hehehe,,, this is the most part i like here, Indo ppl are smiling all the time,, which is really Excellent. It gives me loads of positive energy, keep it up indonesianz...

That's a massive boost for Indonesia.
Thailand is supposed to be the land of smiles, but they aren't even close to Indonesia.
Positive energy up to yin yang, and it's fantastic.
A lot of foreigners are flummoxed by that amazingly friendly attitude, especially when they're new here.

enduringword wrote:

One very important advice that is often missed.

Learn the language where you are in.

Or else you will feel like an outsider and wont adapt well at all.

Fortunately for you. Indonesian language is easy to learn.

I snipped the mildly naughty word, but the advice is very good.
Learning the local tongue has two advantages, the first being the obvious ability to shop and generally interact.
The second is the even warmer than usual welcome from locals when they realise you're doing your best to learn Indonesian. I think they see your attempts to learn as a compliment to the country.

Age of consent for heterosex is 16

That's pretty much the world average, give or take.
However, expat men tend to be more than a bit older than 16, so I would be less than encouraging to anyone having a relationship with such a young girl.
The point is good, and it'll save you having to marry the maid if you can't keep the snake in it's cage.

Actually, the opening question is a tough one to answer in any specific detail.  Indonesia has so many totally diverse cultures, this really requires that the person considering expat life here needs to learn the cultural norms that are specifically applicable where they plan to live.

The general observations already mentioned…smiles, soft spoken, avoid expressing anger, and learning the national language (Bahasa Indonesia, which is not the same as the local language) are surely excellent “rule of thumb” general guidelines, but it is also important to note that certain cultural norms and taboos exist here in one Province that would not apply to another. 

For example, in the Province of Aceh, where they have adopted elements of Sharia Law, drinking alcohol, homosexuality, and public displays of affection are punishable acts, (public canning), whereas in Kuta, Bali, this is not a problem…indeed, it's more a way of life. 

Aceh has a number of “cultural restrictions” some of which would be unlikely to cross one's mind.  For example, a woman seated behind a man on a motorbike must sit side saddle, and not straddle the male driver. 

Even here in Bali we have specific and somewhat unique cultural norms, for example, patting a kid on the head (a sort of “atta boy” gesture popular in the West) would be insulting, as the head is considered the holiest part of the body to the Hindu Balinese. 

In the more conservative areas of Indonesia, particular attention is needed during the fasting month of Ramadan.  Eating or drinking in public is rude if done during the fasting hours (sunrise to sunset), and while a tamu (guest) is not likely to encounter problems doing this, they would gain far more respect (and more smiling faces), by showing consideration of that custom. 

With no intention to even attempt to compile a list of “do and don't” applicable to each Province, culture, or religious beliefs, suffice it that my point is merely to point out the need to consider this issue in a less broad, and more specific manner.

Never attack religion, any religion.
In many western countries, religion isn't serious, but it's very high or top of the list in Indonesia.

More to point I think is, never "appear" to be attacking a religion.  In reality, I think it's far more often that a tamu is being perceived as attacking a religion rather than overtly or intentionally doing so.  And of course that is most likely to happen when said tamu is unaware of the local culture or customs.  Thus the importance of knowing the local culture as best as possible. 

Culture and customs here are of course inexorably woven into the fabric of religion, in particular, with Muslims and Hindu.

Smile, Accept, don't to be rude nor aggressive. Except the unacceptable initially. Stop thinking western values or ways of doing things will help, they won't.
Understand people will help and do their best and even if its not good enough, thank them and despair later.
You can't be angry with people that know no different and may not have had the same upbringing as you. You shouldn't show wealth in public or dress down to scruffily.
Try not to judge.
Go with the flow, enjoy the sunshine and sunsets and eat as much as you can as the food is great. Don't do drugs or anything illegal. Don't get drunk in public or drink in public. Always be polite and helpful. Immediately stop moaning about the call to prayer as its a waste of energy after the 2nd day of being here and ignore the rats, cats, mosquitos, cockroaches, centipedes and other things in your new life as they are now part of it.

If you can do that, or once you have realised you have to do that,  then settling in doesn't take long at all and all is good except the Indonesian TV stations they are never good but how boring would it be if everything was perfect?

haha... I never watch tv... especially indonesian TV. As they said, free to air tv caters to the lowest common denominator of the masses needs. The needs and intrigues of  most Indonesian channels is really very low and could be term childlike naive.

By the way...
Aceh do has syariah laws. It is a special region. However it is expressly stated that syariah laws only apply to Muslims there.

Dont worry about breaking normal standards, as long as it is not illegal. Indonesia is a secular country even though the Muslims are majority. That is what is great about.

There is even a mountain called "sex mountain" where yearly pilgrimage are made, and having sex with strangers means a  blessing of good luck.

Yes , I didnt know it until I read it. With so many places, beliefs in Indonesian archipelago, there are bounds to be oddballs. For example, black magic is expressly forbidden by law. But white magic is allowed.

“However it is expressly stated that syariah laws only apply to Muslims there.”

That is not correct!

“Non-Muslims, including both Indonesian and foreign tourists, can be prosecuted under the Qanun Jinayat if caught committing one of the aforementioned acts with a Muslim, and if Indonesia's criminal code (KUHP) does not include the alleged crime.”

Also, non-Muslims can choose whether to be tried under sharia law or the regular Indonesian criminal code.

Source:  http://www.benarnews.org/english/news/i … 55848.html

There is one advantage to watching free air Indonesia TV by the way.  It's called, news.

Even the Vatican covered this noteworthy recent change to Sharia Law in Aceh:

http://www.news.va/en/news/asiaindonesi … -sharia-la

“There is even a mountain called "sex mountain" where yearly pilgrimage are made, and having sex with strangers means a blessing of good luck.”

This practice/custom has been banned since November 2014 by Governor Ganjar Pranowo. 

http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014 … mukus.html

“haha... I never watch tv... especially indonesian TV.”

Like I said, it's not a bad idea to watch local Indonesia TV news once in a while…if only to stay current with what's going on.   

In Indonesia... There is one thing about proposed laws or even laws itself.
It would not necessarily translates to enforcement.

Anyway, Aceh if want to be radicalised by extreme or restrictive syariah laws, it will be easy and a hotbed for terrorism. So it is in the interests of the federal central government to eliminate any bylaws from the provinces that contradicts with common sense. It has been a regular practice by the Central Government to repeal such many laws from provinces around the country.

Oh by the way... I still find free to air tv with their advertisements on Indonesian tv is a waste of time.

That is why now you have cable, videos on demand and netflix and internet streaming.
This is the 21st century, free to air tv is becoming irrelevant in the decades to come.

The same with newspaper print. So many newspapers who did not go online and rely on traditional print only went out of business long ago.
That is why Kompas went to online and tv streaming, which is the right move for a newspaper.

“In Indonesia... There is one thing about proposed laws or even laws itself.”

If you want to try that out in Aceh, then be my guest.  Personally, I wouldn't suggest it.   

But, more to point, the topic here is tips on how to best thrive in Indonesia.  So, with that in mind, when in Aceh, do as the Acehnese, regardless of whether or not you think those local customs and culture makes sense to you or not.

As any Indonesian who knows their history well, Aceh is a unique and special case.  It was eventually set up as a semi-autonomous Indonesian province in order to end decades of civil war after Soekarno reneged on his 1948 promise that Aceh would be allowed to rule itself.   

You write,

“So it is in the interests of the federal central government to eliminate any bylaws from the provinces that contradicts with common sense. It has been a regular practice by the Central Government to repeal such many laws from provinces around the country.”

With Aceh, that's not as easy, or as simple as you make it sound.  Moreover, if Aceh is putting “more muscle” into their Sharia Laws, it can be presumed that is what the locals want as part of their culture and customs. 

As for my last word regarding “free TV” it seems that you might be unaware that for the vast majority of Indonesians, that is all they can afford.  So, while it is indeed the 21st century for many more fortunate Indonesians like yourself, the fact is, that isn't the case for most Indonesians.

Aceh put alot of extreme syariah laws in place, This include stoning adultery and a whole lot of other provisions such as caning and lashings that normal Indonesian cities wont allow.
The spirit of allowing Aceh to pass its syariah laws initially is on the condition that it doesnt impinge on the non-muslims. Progressively Aceh has sets beyond its scope by including stoning and 100 lashings in its syariah laws over normal trivial things outside Aceh. If Aceh is so holy, put corruption as well on its behavioral laws. Rather than regulate what people dress, and how people behave daily.

If Aceh wants to enforce the extreme laws of Syariah of stoning, that is in place already. I hope it does soon.  There will be a national outcry. When there is national outcry, things got changed pretty fast with the heavy media attention. To date, all is talk, and no enforcements.

Recently ISIS got media attention on its syariah stoning practice. "Four women were raped by ISIS fighters – then stoned to death for 'committing adultery', it has been reported
The victims were arrested even though ISIS militants are said to have caught them being abused during a raid in the city of Mosul.
They were brought before a sharia court which ordered them to be publicly executed without giving any details about their alleged abusers.
Read more at:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article … ltery.html

On Aceh laws on another news:
Home Ministry spokesman Didik Suprayitno said his office had yet to receive information regarding Aceh's bylaw.
However, he added, “basically all local regulations must be in line with national laws”. Moreover, he said, all local regulations would be reviewed first by his office.
http://www.thejakartapost.com/news/2014 … dkN1B.dpuf

I stand by my comments. That what Aceh syariah laws are doing is against National interests, laws and basic human rights. It will get corrected, if they overstep their bounds. It just needs national attention and time.

And you will be surprised of what most Indonesian can have.
Five years ago, it wont happen. But now, many maids have smartphones and internet connection. They could know more things than you faster. The rates of Indonesian having a smartphone user or Tablet user, as opposed to notebook, is rapidly increasing and overtaken.

As the world progress, tech changes.
There is movement for free internet by Facebook and free internet google balloon/satellite by Google.
With the advent of many new Tvs being produced nowadays include smart Tv connection. Or a cheap device added.

So, as I said again. Free to air tv is becoming irrelevant. Not this year. But certainly next decade or two.

enduringword wrote:

As the world progress, tech changes.

So, as I said again. Free to air tv is becoming irrelevant. Not this year. But certainly next decade or two.

As tech advances and becomes cheaper, education becomes easily available to the masses, as does information.
That has it's good and bad side as rubbish such as porn gets thrown at you, but it also means the maid gets an education of sorts, realising some employers are ripping her off.
Prepare for more savvy maids, that lack of education usually means they're from poor families, not that they're stupid.

As for TV, it's pretty much repetitive rubbish all over the world, but the internet provides on demand programming whenever you feel like it.

Indonesia still has pretty slow internet, but it's getting better as time passes, so streaming is becoming available as standard.

The Daily Mail please deh

In India, a locally produced smartphone is touted as selling at 4 USD.

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/tec … 021708.cms

Unbelievable cheap right....

The price of smartphones have been increasingly cheaper year on year. Last I saw, a 4G smartphone could be around 40 USD.
Only big brands like Apple is defying gravity..

lukereg wrote:

The Daily Mail please deh

I was at a fish show, a really big national event, when a saw a story unfold.
The following weekend that story was in the daily mail, but their version was a work of fiction, having more brown stuff than a field full of male bovine.

Basically, that crappy rag is full of lies, half truths and total rubbish.

Fred wrote:

lukereg wrote:

The Daily Mail please deh

I was at a fish show, a really big national event, when a saw a story unfold.
The following weekend that story was in the daily mail, but their version was a work of fiction, having more brown stuff than a field full of male bovine.

Basically, that crappy rag is full of lies, half truths and total rubbish.

I am surprised that Dailymail has such low reputation.
I have never been to England. So  I didnt know.
I frequent news.com.au - an Australian site. It often directs some news items to Dailymail as source.
I guess they might be classified as tabloid newspapers then... the more sensational and juicy tidbits the better. Sensations sell in everything.

However, that story seems to come out of several newspapers websites.
How true, is hard to know.
But the atrocities of ISIS has been highlighted many times in the media over several years. Either it is western propaganda to counter ISIS propaganda. Or some real truths inside.
Still... so many people were reported from different nationalities were joining ISIS in the beginning.

enduringword wrote:

Fred wrote:

lukereg wrote:

The Daily Mail please deh

I was at a fish show, a really big national event, when a saw a story unfold.
The following weekend that story was in the daily mail, but their version was a work of fiction, having more brown stuff than a field full of male bovine.

Basically, that crappy rag is full of lies, half truths and total rubbish.

I am surprised that Dailymail has such low reputation.
I have never been to England. So  I didnt know.

The mail is a very political paper, usually pushing a mild right wing agenda, so anyone left of centre hates it with a passion. Also, anyone who enjoys the truth dismisses it as "a crappy rag".
It isn't alone, but The Mail has a special contempt reserved for it as it markets as a mid to top range newspaper, not just a comic such as The Sun.
Having seen first hand what a joke their standard of journalism is, I'm going for it being an insult to intelligence.

It is good to know.
Every country has them.
Very few media is even handed in their treatments.

Hi everybody,

Just to inform you that some inappropriate threads have been removed.

Can we please stick to the topic that i have launched? it would be much appreciated, thanks.

Priscilla

I would disagree about the need for special training to help expats adapt to Indonesia. I really do not think it is necessary and not only that but if it means employing trainers and spending time that just adds on cost especially when these days companies are trying to cut costs.

To be noted is that many expats come from Asian countries such as Malaysia, Singapore, China, India, Korean, Japan, Taiwan, Bangladesh and these expats often stick closely to their companies and mix with their fellow countrymen and pick up things as they go along.

For western expats which I think you are referring to, common sense goes a long way, and a few general rules are all that is needed such as be polite, don't get angry, don't talk down to locals, be friendly, be generous, don't be loud and don't be arrogant. Of course you can include using your right hand to take or receive something, and a few other simple rules. But perhaps a Lonely Planet Guide or similar introduction to a country's customs would be adequate. In fact, to anyone who is being sent oversees for the first time I would expect them to read up on the country they are going to and then just go there and enjoy it.

Countries such as Saudi Arabia and India and certain African countries might have a lot more need for training.

Hansson wrote:

I would disagree about the need for special training to help expats adapt to Indonesia. I really do not think it is necessary and not only that but if it means employing trainers and spending time that just adds on cost especially when these days companies are trying to cut costs.

As a westerner arriving here with little clue, a one day training session would have been very useful to help me avoid cultural cock ups I found myself committing.
It wouldn't have taken much, so wouldn't have cost that much to arrange.

Have to agree with Fred on this one. Any type of training, however little it may be is very helpful to a newcomer. Mixing with expats on the job does very little towards learning.

Local English language newspaper give you a handle on what's going on here.

http://en.tempo.co/http://jakartaglobe.beritasatu.com/http://www.thejakartapost.com/

I would also agree with Isabellele's comments, especially if the western expat is going to be in a position where he or she manages or employs locals. 

The additional cost for some cross-cultural training could very well end up being far cheaper than the errors and misunderstandings that could arise.

The US military, when assigning staff to Indonesia as attaches/advisors, etc. does exactly what Isabellele suggests.  We've had mid level officers renting our old house while here in Bali for over a month doing exactly that…language and culture training. 

As for an expat marrying into a local family, they'll get plenty enough of “cross-cultural” training form their spouse and in-laws…that's for sure.   

I have only been in Indonesia for 17 years and I dont feel qualified to comment yet. I still learn something new every day.  Instant experts often change their opinions over years  .... for the better. When in Rome do as the Roman do as best as possible
Adrian