Open Season on Ripoff Realtors

Mr. Whytehorse ...

Seems like if your goal is to help your mother, just ...
* take 20K out of the bank ...
* buy your 10K of land ...
* pay the 10k for materials and labor ...
* move Mom to Ecuador ...
* throw a party for her, and ...
* start whining about something else!

Sorry, sir, but the real estate business is profit oriented and it's YOUR job to find a reputable broker and negotiate your best deal.  I'm from the US and it is absolutely rife with unscrupulous real estate brokers.  I'd guess it's similar in Canada [where you're apparently from according to your profile] as "realtors/people are realtors/people" around the world.

Why are you picking on Ecuador?  Just move on, do your job and stop wasting your time venting on this blog, as all you're really accomplishing is exposing your own "idiosyncrasies" ....

BTW, I am in the process of retiring to Ecuador and expect many surprises both good and bad along the way.  My overall satisfaction in Ecuador will probably be determined 50% by my attitude and 50% by Ecuador's intrinsic plusses and minuses.  So, if my attitude is poor [e.g., expecting Ecuador to change to please you] my experience will be poor regardless of where I move.

My goal in replying here is simply to offer some perspective to you.  I truly hope your mother finds her paradise and that you survive/thrive in the process.

   Carlos    aka "El Bueno Gringo"

PS  I am quite a curmudgeon myself and can whine with the best of 'em, so I just try to pick and choose my battles and remain aware of my own baggage. 

I'm not complaining. Just telling it like it is. I think it's unethical to let people walk into real estate scams. Most people retiring to Ecuador aren't aware that they have no legal protection as a buyer and that realtors don't have licenses there and that those friendly gringos over there are just telling them whatever they want to hear to separate them from their money.

In fact, the first thing most people do is go online and search google for "ecuador real estate" and up pops SEO optimized con artist sites like vivium.com asking $420k for a house or ecuadoriancoastalproperties.com asking $255k for a 3 bedroom. Next down the list is all the craigslist robo-postings by ripoff realtors with maybe 1 in 100 posts actually real owners.

Anyway, I already said I'm going to pass on Ecuador because the ripoff realtors are scouring the countryside as we speak snatching all the deals and flipping houses to unsuspecting retirees at outageous markups. I think it's too late for Ecuador. The losers are firmly entrenched and they have VIP taxis waiting for you at the airport for 10x the price of a limo and they will whisk you off on an eclusive real estate tour of properties 10x the price. When you finish the tour and decide to learn Spanish and beat the street to get a better deal you'll be greeted by an army of copycats and metoos running the same scam with a twist.

By the time you spend a year shaking off leeches and picking a community which hasn't been ruined by gringo pricing, you'll have spent $10k+ on tours, transport, and accomodation.

I hear you, but to quote a character from the movie "Ghost Busters" ...

No matter what country you look for real estate in ...  "Who you gonna call?" 

Realtors are realtors, the world around!  I worked in Real Estate in the US just long enough to see the industry from inside and it's not a pretty picture.  There are a handful of reputable professionals in a boatload of brokers.

I also used to audit Banks and Savings & Loan institutions in my earlier career as a CPA [Deloitte & Touche], so ...

Don't even get me started on mortgage backed securities ...

Good Luck!

   Carlos

Not sure why, of all the characteristics of a country you should be focusing on for your mother, you've chosen just this one characteristic and decided to focus on it?

If you're looking for all the bad, that's exactly what you'll find.

I personally don't care what country you choose. (Why not Mexico, for instance? Much closer to the US/Canada.) But it's just plain stupid and short-sighted to "write off" an entire country for this perceived injuctice. Frankly, you might as well write off the whole world if you plan to exclude any country where there are people who will be happy to rip you off, because they reside in every country on the planet.(Maybe you could send your mom to the moon?)

Your defensive, hostile attitude will bring you and your mother only grief, and blind you to so many possibilities you now cannot see.

How about, instead, you first ASK your mom whether (1) She wants to learn a new language (2) Would welcome or dread learning about and living in a new culture, and (3) Would love or just be frustrated by a slower pace of life? THOSE are the important factors.

Then ask her what kind of climate she wants.

Those are the most important factors. Then, since you're a good son/daughter, send or take her to the places in each possible country your exhaustive research (not just the surface preliminaries) tells you would make HER most happy?

I think you might want to get MOM to give you some chill pills.
Tell your mother to rent like the rest of us.
THEN DECIDE her future

The rest of you turn this & this guy off you. This blog is bogus and you will never get anyone who pens this crap to smarten up

VIP taxis? Have you even been to Ecuador??? Of course all of the real estate listed on the internet is a rip-off. You have to come here... rent for awhile... learn the culture... the language... then, find a good deal. Geesh.

amyf wrote:

VIP taxis? Have you even been to Ecuador??? Of course all of the real estate listed on the internet is a rip-off. You have to come here... rent for awhile... learn the culture... the language... then, find a good deal. Geesh.

Maybe I don't want to fly to another continent, learn a new language, and pay rent just so I can find out the price of land in Ecuador. One would think that with the internet and all these forums and expats that this would be easy information to come by. Instead, there seems to be an endless supply of internet troll ripoff realtors. What people paid for their land seems to be a jealously guarded secret.

To be honest, I think I would hate Ecuador if I had to live there always watching my back so I don't get stabbed by all the house-bubble-flippers whose sole purpose in life is to rip off retirees for a quick buck. Never knowing who you can trust, people always trying to sell you insurance or some get rich quick scheme like selling junk on amazon or some lame ass health spa. haha

good luck

whytehorse wrote:

Maybe I don't want to fly to another continent, learn a new language, and pay rent just so I can find out the price of land in Ecuador.

Unfortunately, that's the way it works best, in Ecuador and in other countries that are foreign to oneself.

I can't understand why anyone would buy in a foreign country without experiencing it for a while through renting. Insane, from my viewpoint -- you have no idea whether you'll like a place until you've experienced it up close and personal.

I'm currently in the Philippines and have seen several expats who bought and then got stuck with difficult-to-sell properties when they realized this wasn't the place they thought it was.

If your mom thinks she might like Ecuador, she should move to (pick a city), live there for at least six months (probably better a year), decide if it's for her, and if so, then buy. If not, move on to Peru or somewhere else.

Being there for a while also gives her the chance to know other expats who can direct her to honest real estate people -- or maybe a chance to buy a bargain condo from one of those idiots who bought too hurriedly and are looking to get out.

Good luck to her.

Bob

dreams-of-latin-america wrote:

Not sure why, of all the characteristics of a country you should be focusing on for your mother, you've chosen just this one characteristic and decided to focus on it?

If you're looking for all the bad, that's exactly what you'll find.

I personally don't care what country you choose. (Why not Mexico, for instance? Much closer to the US/Canada.) But it's just plain stupid and short-sighted to "write off" an entire country for this perceived injuctice. Frankly, you might as well write off the whole world if you plan to exclude any country where there are people who will be happy to rip you off, because they reside in every country on the planet.(Maybe you could send your mom to the moon?)

Your defensive, hostile attitude will bring you and your mother only grief, and blind you to so many possibilities you now cannot see.

How about, instead, you first ASK your mom whether (1) She wants to learn a new language (2) Would welcome or dread learning about and living in a new culture, and (3) Would love or just be frustrated by a slower pace of life? THOSE are the important factors.

Then ask her what kind of climate she wants.

Those are the most important factors. Then, since you're a good son/daughter, send or take her to the places in each possible country your exhaustive research (not just the surface preliminaries) tells you would make HER most happy?

I already asked her those questions. She and I have both lived in foreign countries, learned languages, know all about tropical climates, etc.

I was going to help her go to Costa Rica but it didn't take much research to find out it's expensive so I looked at Panama and same thing. So I scoured the globe for countries based on cost of living and Ecuador came up as being low cost. Then I started seeing rave reviews and hearing how great it is from all these people. So I looked into it pretty seriously. Anyway I'm sure there are bad people in every country and Ecuador is not unique in that respect. The key thing is that Ecuador is really popular now and so that's where all the scammers are heading now that they've "played out" Costa Rica and Panama.

I'm real sorry if my attitude comes across as hostile and defensive. I just think it's time someone spoke up about the ripoff realtors instead of just letting them get away with ripping people off and not even giving them so much as a warning.

Hmmm...from Stinkville?.

BobH wrote:

whytehorse wrote:

Maybe I don't want to fly to another continent, learn a new language, and pay rent just so I can find out the price of land in Ecuador.

Unfortunately, that's the way it works best, in Ecuador and in other countries that are foreign to oneself.

I can't understand why anyone would buy in a foreign country without experiencing it for a while through renting. Insane, from my viewpoint -- you have no idea whether you'll like a place until you've experienced it up close and personal.

I'm currently in the Philippines and have seen several expats who bought and then got stuck with difficult-to-sell properties when they realized this wasn't the place they thought it was.

If your mom thinks she might like Ecuador, she should move to (pick a city), live there for at least six months (probably better a year), decide if it's for her, and if so, then buy. If not, move on to Peru or somewhere else.

Being there for a while also gives her the chance to know other expats who can direct her to honest real estate people -- or maybe a chance to buy a bargain condo from one of those idiots who bought too hurriedly and are looking to get out.

Good luck to her.

Bob

Well that's what we planned on doing but she doesn't have enough money to fly to a bunch of countries so we have to narrow it down to one or two. The problem is we're trying to do research to find out if she can afford to live in a country and instead of facts, we get endless con artists

whytehorse wrote:

Well that's what we planned on doing but she doesn't have enough money to fly to a bunch of countries so we have to narrow it down to one or two. The problem is we're trying to do research to find out if she can afford to live in a country and instead of facts, we get endless con artists

I hear you, and I sympathize, but I really don't know of another way to do it.

If she doesn't have the money to live in a country renting for a year before buying -- then she sure as heck doesn't have the money for a risky investment. And buying property in a country she might end up hating is a very risky investment.

In addition to not knowing whether she'll like the country, you have some other major risk factors:

... If I were buying even in another city in my own country, I'd be risking buying in the wrong neighborhood.
... In a foreign country, you're not familiar with the business practices or the legal code -- very dangerous place to make a major investment.

Expensive as trying it out first might look, it seems a lot less scary than investing all my savings in a crapshoot.

Bob

I guess it's important to be hip to any kind of scammer anywhere on the globe. During my first inquiries about Ecuador someone tried to sell me assistance getting a resident visa for $1,000. Very high pressure. I later found out that is a fair price but absolutely ridiculous when I haven't even gotten my new passport yet or left the states

Looking past Whytehorse' issues, there still seems to be a prejudice underlying this thread; that realtors are all scam artists. There are certainly are enough of those, especially considering the method Whytehorse is using to find property. While most Ecuadorians do not use realtors, those agents that do exist to serve those who do not speak Spanish or do not understand how the culture works, are not all scam artists. In fact, many are quite helpful and honorable in their actions and intentions.

I know this is said often: you really need to live here for a while before you buy. But it cannot be said too many times. I would add to that: if you are convinced it is a certain way here: you will most certainly find it exactly to your expectations. Such is life.

Joseph K wrote:

... While most Ecuadorians do not use realtors...

… Than how do they go about buying real estate? I am really confused…

Whytehorse,

Where did you get this $666/acre price from?  That absolutely does NOT apply to the whole country.  Maybe their are pockets of areas where you can find land at that price, but to throw such a general number at an entire audience living in or interested in living in Ecuador is more misleading than the "Real Estate Tours" your discussing. 

Is this $666/acre land anywhere near shopping or medical facilities?  Is it on a hill side that is prone to mudslides?  Is their access to potable water, gas, or electricity?

Do you know what type of materials $10K affords you?  Are you and your mom able to build this house yourself with your bare hands, or will you need to hire help?  Do you know how to create architectural plans and drawings?  Will your house be earthquake resistant? (This is earthquake country). 

The number ONE rule of real estate is LOCATION, LOCATION, LOCATION! 

I am sure there are spots in Ecuador where you can buy land at that price, don't get me wrong, BUT you get what you pay for ANYWHERE in the WORLD.  I bet their are sections of North Dakota or Alaska where you can get that type of deal also.  I heard in Detroit they are giving away houses why don't you move there?

I am not a moderator of this forum but when I see such negativity posted from someone it sparks reaction.

Take everyone's advice in this forum.  VISIT FIRST.  Find a locale you are interested in.  RENT.  Then decide if you would like to buy.  Then find a reputable real estate agent through word of mouth through the Expat community or pick up enough Spanish and try to work with a local agent.

SunSpotter wrote:

… Than how do they go about buying real estate? I am really confused

This is an excellent question since it highlights one of the most important things to understand about living in any country other than the one in which you grew up: the cultural differences. First, a few things to understand before I attempt to answer this.

Ecuadorians typically have very large immediate and extended families, often residing all across Ecuador. For this and other reasons, Ecuadorians are well connected and tend to be very social. It is similar to small towns in the U.S., but with less focus on gossip and a broader range of connectivity. This is also a very congenial and helpful society where people gladly help one another (without an exchange of money). As is often mentioned in this forum, people are very friendly. Ecuadorians are rarely in a hurry. It is understood that everything takes time and one only needs to be patient. Cars are not the norm and people walk much more than those in first-world countries. Ecuadorians would not think twice about spending two hours walking around looking for something they needed or wanted.

If an Ecuadorian needs to rent or buy housing, the first thing they will probably do is tell everyone they know. If you consider the math in "degrees of separation" then you know it only takes about three degrees of separation to cover a major sector of a population, especially one as well connected as it is in Ecuador. Just "putting the word out" so to speak will net a wealth of options.

The next thing to do is look at the local papers. Housing (buy or rent) is normally advertised there. Again, you will get more options.

Finally, and probably the most sure-fire approach, is to simply pick the neighborhood you want and start walking around looking for signs. These signs are typically small, maybe tucked in a window, but they are there. You would also ask. Maybe just poke your head into a business and ask if they know of anything for sale (or rent, depending on what you need). In fact, ask anyone you want. It would be rare for someone to be rude and most will gladly share what they know. If you are in an area where there are high-rises and there is a doorman, ask him. He probably knows everything going on in that building.

Doing all of these will most likely get you what you need, but it won't work in every instance. In that case, there are places which do list real estate and you could inquire within. I only know of one in Loja, but there may be more. In larger cities, there probably are many more, but following the three methods listed above will still work just about everywhere. One thing is fairly certain; Ecuadorians are not going to pay someone to take them around looking for housing nor would they typically pay someone to sell their house. Most Ecuadorians would find such behavior strange indeed.

Joseph,

Taking this approach to finding property is assuming the person knows enough Spanish to read and write escritorios, compras y ventas, and all of the other documents associated with buying a property here.

Yes. I understood the question to be "how do Ecuadorians  find housing?" Sorry if I was unclear about that. But the larger point has to do with cultural confusion, which I think is one of the harder barriers for expats to overcome. My personal love for this country has everything to do with the culture and nature of the people precisely because it is so different from where I came from. The fact that the net cost of living here is less ls just the period at the bottom of the exclamation point.

Joseph,

Agreed.  One of the hardest things people face here is the difference in culture.  I myself search for things American sometimes, such as a simple hamburger, just to feel comfortable.

Mike

LOL
French toast with real maple syrup. What I wouldn't give for that!

Thank you, thank you very much for this invaluable insight gentlemen!
Wow! Talk about cultural confusion… I would have never in a million years thought of any of these approaches!
The more I research what life in Ecuador is like, the more I tend to agree with Joseph K saying “My personal love for this country has everything to do with the culture and nature of the people precisely because it is so different from where I came from. The fact that the net cost of living here is less is just the period at the bottom of the exclamation point”. I cannot express my feeling better. Thank you!

Just a reminder that my earlier post about Realtors was based upon Realtors in the US.  Unfortunately, Realtors are not the only profession in the US largely populated by greedy and unprofessional persons and conduct.

For example, take MY former profession [guess why I left it behind, years ago, in spite of the big paychecks and future career "prospects"] ... CPA's who "audit" publicly traded companies.

This audit "industry" is the poster child for conflicts of interest.  It actually gives the Congress/Lobbyist cesspool a pretty good run for the "1st Place" trophy.

   Carlos   aka "El Gringo Bueno"

PS  I, too, need to vent from time to time.  However, at some point it becomes time to move forward in spite of challenges.  Moving forward might mean following the prior advice on how to successfully shop for R/E in Ecuador but it also might mean continuing your search for a pristine economic environment in which to feel safe and comfortable.  When and if  you find such a place, please let all of us know where you found it, if you don't mind. 

That's why I can't wait to get there. Find a new culture to embrace. Have taken my "Three months to Latin American Spanish" off the shelf. I worry when Mike longs for a plain hamburger. How soon will it be before Mcdonald'd opens its first franchise in Quito???? NO, NO, NO....or IHOP for Joseph. I'm really hoping the concept of fast food never catches on in Ecuador. Then we'll know there are too many American expats.

suefrankdahl wrote:

I worry when Mike longs for a plain hamburger. How soon will it be before Mcdonald'd opens its first franchise in Quito???? NO, NO, NO....or IHOP for Joseph.

I recall reading that McD opened in Cuenca recently -- that would lead me to assume that they are already in Quito and Guayaquil. Don't know about IHOP.

I don't share your antipathy for such places. I seldom eat at McD in the US, but I find myself dropping in regularly here (Philippines), mostly when I need a fix of 'comfort food'. There is a KFC nearby as well -- it had probably been ten years since I had eaten at KFC in the US, but I've visited it several times here.

Sue,

McDonald's already has multiple locations in Quito and McCafe is actually quite desirable here.  I do enjoy a McDonald's burger but the particular burger I crave most is from In and Out and Carl's Jr.

Joseph,

I actually found delicious Pancake mix called "Santa Lucia" here you can buy at SuperMaxi.  It is pretty authentic and they also have American Syrups.

Quito has the following American restaurants.

Chili's
Friday's
Burger King
KFC
McDonald's
Dunkin Donuts
Subway
Quizno's


If I am missing anything let me know.

Mike
www.themiddleoftheworld.com

The pizza places.  Pizza Hut, Papa John's, and Domino's are also in Quito.

McD's is under construction in Cuenca. It may be too late to stop it.

Themiddleoftheworld wrote:

If I am missing anything let me know.

There is also a Tony Roma's (I think that is how you spell it) in Quito. I had barbeque chicken there and was very disappointed. There is something about red sauces that Ecuadorians seem to be unable to master. Pizza here is okay, but the red sauce is the weakest aspect of every pizza I have tasted in Ecuador.

Themiddleoftheworld wrote:

Joseph,

I actually found delicious Pancake mix called "Santa Lucia" here you can buy at SuperMaxi.  It is pretty authentic and they also have American Syrups.

Okay Mike, I have to admit it; I am quite the snob when it comes to certain foods. They have Miel de Maple here (McCormick and other U.S. or Canadian brands). But, heavens forbid, most are made with high fructose corn syrup and all have artificial flavoring. My knickers immediately bunch into a knot just thinking about it. :-).

Yes, SuperMaxi just started carrying the Santa Lucia brand about the time I arrived here. It is better than most pancake mixes in the U.S. Weird, isn't it. I am just glad that you can get really decent coffee beans here and that almonds are plentiful so I can make my own almond milk. But oh, how I miss real maple syrup. I know, I am a broken record on this one.

Oh yes I forgot all of the Pizza places because I don't really do Pizza. 

I also found Smithfield Virginia Ham available at Cafe Espanol in between Amazonas y Juan Leon Mera on Wilson.

Themiddleoftheworld wrote:

McDonald's already has multiple locations in Quito and McCafe is actually quite desirable here.  I do enjoy a McDonald's burger but the particular burger I crave most is from In and Out and Carl's Jr.

Here's a review of a McD in Quito on a student blog from a young lady who is a vegetarian and clearly hates McD -- and she is full of praise for it: "I found one of the classiest McDonalds in the world. It's in Quito on the corner of Amazonas and Naciones Unidas, just past Parque Carolina." She goes on to say that the smoothie is the best she ever had.

I checked yesterday when this subject came up, because Subway is my favorite of the QSRs, and I was pleased to see that there are 16 in Quito -- so I'm sure to be close to one.

Now, if only we can get them to open a Taco Bell, all will be perfect.

(I actually came across a Taco Bell in Shanghai a few years ago).

I guess your right. Nothing like McD's french fries. Ieat too much fast food here

Carls' Jr famous star burger on special for $1.29. Jr. Whopper at BK also $1.29. I'm told you can lose 5# a month if you quit eating fast food Looking forward to that.

I love DD coffee. It's on every corner back in Connecticut where I'm originally from. Almost gagged on my first cup of dark roast (Starbucks)at Seatac airport. I'm more of a tea person.

Am hoping to end up in a smaller town on the coast so there won't be fast food. Love to cook and can make a super red sauce. Lots of Italian food and cooking on the East coast so I'll be able to make my own pizza. What kind of cheese do they have?