Seeking advice/tips on mzungu-kenyan relationships

pinguinoma wrote:

AlejandroRivera wrote:

pinguinoma wrote:

wena perro , es dificil ver un chileno en kenya ,
= son re piola las minas de kenya ( si las comparo con chilenas )
ud. sabe

jajaja muy cierto, hay chicas muy bonitas por estos lados

ten cuidado eso compadre mira k algunas son traicioneras ( como dice el loco de mas arriva ) / [ te lo digo por experiancia ... ;/

Latinos en la casa!!! Chicos, sí,hay chicas bonitas en Kenia (There are beautiful girls in Kenya) and we are grateful to God for that.

Wow!I dont think I have every read a long thread to the end,the way I did this one. Mixed feelings.

This is what I can say, as a Kenyan. Most of what has been said is true and I have a few observations

Inter-racial relationships are difficult, but they work. I even have a couple friends, American husband and Kenyan wife, Norwegian husband and Kenyan wife, Kenyan husband and American wife, Kenyan husband and British wife. For most of these couples, I knew then before they got married. The major issue had been the general Kenyan expectation of the foreigner to have more money and better standing in society, which in most cases has been true becuase most expatriates are paid up to 10 times what a Kenyan is paid for the same job. Some of these couples, however, are 'normal' Kenyans, in terms of their earnings so the money is not the main factor.

That not withstanding, the people in these relationships were out for a true relationship,not money. One has shared a story where she has had to  defend her husband besause all the in-laws were looking up to him to 'rescue' them financially. So,if this girl truly loves you, she will not join the rest of the people in draining money out of you.

What we tend to forget is that this local girl/guy has their fears and concerns as well. Not all inter-racial marriages/relationships have encouragin stories so they take a risk. Some people tend to be shunned when they date a foreigner or treated differently, not in a nice way, which is something that locals in these relationships have to deal with, at a personal level. When all is said and done, the two people in the relationship make the ultimate decision.

The problem with these Kenyan/foreigner relationships is that most of the foreigners both male and female are simply blind and miss to see the obvious.
Is it a wonder that 80% of mzungu/african relationships in Kenya are mainly based on former-prostitute/older dude types?

Do you guys ever wonder why all these women in these relationships never seem to have any type of career?
Ever stop to wonder why even with all the cash you shower your women they never seem as cultured as a lot of the other ones in the pubs you decide to visit?

Simple really. Most comfortable, well brought up Kenyan women, while having no real issues against relationships with whites will not go out with you. The stigma has already been created over time.
If you are going out with a jungu you are nothing but a slut. That's the simple perception and is a local fact because that is generally the case.

My advice, quit hanging out in all those clubs you hear about from your globe trotting backpacker friends and you might meet a 'real' Kenyan woman.
How? Try this (I convinced a friend of mine to try), on one of your long summer breaks or similar, take a break, visit Kenya and enroll at say Nairobi university for a semester. It must be the more mature evening classes. Your target is not the college crowd but the upward bound Kenyan women doing her masters or similar. You will be astounded at the difference as compared to your clubbing nitwits out for rent money.

Just my thoughts

drewpal wrote:

The problem with these Kenyan/foreigner relationships is that most of the foreigners both male and female are simply blind and miss to see the obvious.
Is it a wonder that 80% of mzungu/african relationships in Kenya are mainly based on former-prostitute/older dude types?

Do you guys ever wonder why all these women in these relationships never seem to have any type of career?
Ever stop to wonder why even with all the cash you shower your women they never seem as cultured as a lot of the other ones in the pubs you decide to visit?

Simple really. Most comfortable, well brought up Kenyan women, while having no real issues against relationships with whites will not go out with you. The stigma has already been created over time.
If you are going out with a jungu you are nothing but a slut. That's the simple perception and is a local fact because that is generally the case.

My advice, quit hanging out in all those clubs you hear about from your globe trotting backpacker friends and you might meet a 'real' Kenyan woman.
How? Try this (I convinced a friend of mine to try), on one of your long summer breaks or similar, take a break, visit Kenya and enroll at say Nairobi university for a semester. It must be the more mature evening classes. Your target is not the college crowd but the upward bound Kenyan women doing her masters or similar. You will be astounded at the difference as compared to your clubbing nitwits out for rent money.

Just my thoughts

Really you to hit the nail,
I can give my opinion from the point of view (the white man).
the fact is that women, Kenyan (real) are very difficult to conquer and establish a relationship with her ​​(and more difficult even if you intend to marry), it is not easy (and being a white man presents no ease, and nothing like) is a long, hard, and very complex,
kenya real woman, is as difficult as a woman Mzungu,. and I dare say it is more difficult

's it. challenging. (I've tried twice and both times have failure. Spend an enormous amount of time years, money, and effort.). Any achievements
(((Women easy,,, as you said you are women of easy life ... and if you agree with Mzungu man usually looks so easy, and fast. It is unfortunate I must say.)

Now. Many friends have told me that women in rural areas. are best material for wife, but for my work will be monstrous. I'll have to learn Swahili perfect addition to their customs and live a long time in this area (you may have to create a business in Kenya to have a permit for two years in a row)

In my opinion, people are people, regardless of skin colour or geographical location. Operating through stereotypes can cause alot of people to miss out on true genuine people. So what if a young girl dates an older guy? or an older woman dates a younger guy? or a white girl goes out with a black guy? or a white guy dates a black woman? We cannot always stick to the norm in order to abide by what is acceptable to society..Anybody can be a good or a bad partner but i dont believe its dependent on their skin colour..or job..or country of origin, or any of that stuff.Even what might seem like a really "proper" relationship so to speak, might have its own skeletons...

With respect to the OP, seen your young age I can only advise you to keep your sensors open for any red flags. No need to be paranoid though, just aware that you might get hurt. But that could happen anywhere in the world for various reasons.

Talking from my own experience, I know my current Kenyan (Kikuyu) lady for 25 years. We first met in Europe, dated for a couple of years and almost decided to get married but finally parted ways, mostly my fault I have to admit. She stayed in EU for 13 years and she's fairly well travelled. We found each other again 3 years ago. Now we're determined to get married after all those years and we will eventually settle down in Nairobi. We're more in love now than we've ever been and we know we can trust each other.

I think it has a lot to do with maturity although it's not always a matter of age. Certain people never grow up. A woman (man too) who is playing you for whatever reason is immature and self-centered.

Like someone astutely said before, you have to set boundaries up front. Think with your brain, not your genitals and don't be afraid to be straightforward. Like, "listen I like you girl but I'm not in just for sex and you better not be in just for money".

Remember love and sex takes two and if both enjoy it it's a 50-50 "deal".
You will see by her reaction if her feelings are genuine. If she gets defensive or angry, that's a huge red flag.

Realistically speaking, I know many Kenyans mostly around my age. Unfortunately I've encountered a few cases where women get married to a wealthy mzungu and keep the young but broke boyfriend on the side. One for money, one for sex. I've seen quite a few lie about their age and a few other things which are not even worth lying about. But they are not the majority and times are changing. I think this might be the old school upbringing from the early independence days. Mzungu wants a Kenyan woman, mzungu has to pay.

I'm in no way generalising but those things exist.

Me and my GF bump heads at least once a month over those issues and always did but I know I can trust her. It's important to talk things over but also to stick to your principles if they are righteous and fair. It's about mutual respect.

Good luck!

very well spoken.
possibly some are for relationships. others simply do not,. lol
but one thing is true. Money will always be the "money", and what money can buy will depend on the holder's moral (...)

pinguinoma wrote:

what money can buy will depend on the holder's moral (...)

Very true. That's where my GF and I have a clear mutual understanding. Money pays the bills and buys things, full stop.

When you have an apple tree you don't have to axe it down to get to the fruits.

Anyway despite a few colonial hangups that Kenyans still might have, more or less understandably among young people, Kenya is more on par with European countries than the USA in terms of maturity when it comes to so-called "inter-racial" dating. I was married to an African American woman and while we lived there, boy we had to run the gauntlet many times. The prejudice runs deep and is unfortunately exported to other parts of the world. Fortunately it seems that Europe and Kenya are quite immune to that. However I see worrying trends in the UK and France where especially BF/WM relationships are under public scrutiny even though they might be based on mutual respect and deep love.

In the US I was always tempted to say "mind your own business!". The public hostility put a lot of strain on the relationship. It's very unfair. And for what? Your own self-righteous opinion?

Anyway I never felt this kind of prejudice in Kenya. And it's not only because my origins are in a country that never enslaved or colonialised anybody. (We were always the victims in Europe.) I feel welcome in Kenya and people generally mind their own business or are very amicable towards us. Perhaps it also has something to do with our rather mature age.

The environment is critical. If you have a negative charge, that affect the couple.
Either directly or indirectly.
While living in their own world ... Sometimes when I met the parents of the girl. ( the Father ask me:: how is your country? Mzungu¡, Coz do we know of some stories, from England or United States, very sad stories, of how you people see and how is the deal 4 as).
It is unfortunate to hear that, it really so hurts ... But
Fortunately my country, does not have problems with that, ( the black people are treated with respect and more, always have the best jobs, and all them is easy, I am a witness to it, I have a black friend in my country (from Jamaica )  man live his dream come true

Careful careful....
Don't turn this into a 'my country folk' love blacks more than 'their country'...
Being Kenyans, we really don't give a hoot... if you catch my drift...

True that, drewpal.

The thing is the OP was looking for advice on mixed relationships. Although it might not make a big difference where in the world you go as a black person on your own, encountering a bit more or less prejudice, it can make a big difference where you go as a mixed couple. Especially BF/WM.

I agree about the age difference, but certainly not about the tribe.  My wife is a kikuyu.  We are the same age and happily married for 15 years.  Although I am not ageist, I think that it does make a difference.  I see alot of relationships between very young Kenyan women (girls really) and much older mzungu men.  The man turns out to be relatively wealthy..............hmm, now I wonder why they are really together.

I'm a Kenyan girl in a relationship with an American so I could offer some insight. As has already been said, being single here holds the same meaning as anywhere. It means you're not in a committed relationship. About defining your relationship, I'd say it's best to do it from the onset. That way you both know whether you're exclusive or open to see other people as well.

Again, as has been said, we don't typically just introduce anyone we're seeing to our family. If she's asked you to meet hers, that's a big indication that she's serious about you two. I'd say many girls are more traditional when it comes to dating so the guy is expected to foot expenses and such. But, this doesn't mean you're a cash-cow. So keep an eye out for any red flags suggesting so.

About meeting her friends, she could be hesitant because perhaps they're against the idea of interracial relationships or she doesn't trust them around you or some other reason. We can only speculate so the best person to ask is your partner herself.

If you have any particular cultural concerns, the best person to ask would be your partner. Different tribes and families have different values. Relationships are a gamble regardless so just be cautious and follow your gut. I wish you the best.

Hi,
Read your post and though I am not a relationships expert, I wish to offer some advice.

1.It would be better if you took time to find out what both of you need or expect from the relationship.  Be honest towards each other and to both your selves.

2.Take a piece of paper and write down what your values when it comes to a relationship are.

If she asks you to see her parents, please know that could mean she is asking you to marry her. 

When it comes to gifts, it is very difficult to know what would be the ideal unless you first meet and know them.

Take time to meet and know other ladies as well, this will help you learn.

All the best and I wish you well.

To the OP,

...can only add these few words to this interesting thread; take your time in getting to know your lady friend and do not make any important relationship decisions under pressure or haste.

A difference in Culture does not change certain human basics and traits such as the need to develop a habit of an open honest communication right from the onset.

I would suggest that most of your questions would be best answered by your girlfriend.

You will find that as sound as the advice in this long thread may be, most may be generic and stereotypical in its very nature and may not accurately address what is essentially a unique relationship based on two unique beautiful people!Give it your best shot!

Best of luck!

Do come back and update us on how you got on!

Follow ur heart.at the end of the day,its btwn and her and all others r tgird wheels.good lyck tho

wow good to hear, was dating gal from kenya everything was going well I flew over met all her family they loved me, & I did them(Im white) she came here, then2 months later she went stone cold. I live in Thailand but US citz, divorced 2 yrs ago so working thru financial stuff but hope to be clear in few months, not sure what happened but she said she needed to focus on her 2 sisters shes not seen since 2013 to bring them close to her or her to them cause their being mistreated far away at school so maybe cause I couldnt help them now , mayb why she lost interest, not sure, but we were togeter 8 months, big downer for me, but thx for the hope & pep talk. Any input any of yall or how to meet nice gal ther let me know. Im  athletic build, good looking, stable fun loving 55 yrs old but I pass for 45 or younger depending on whose guessing, I skateboard, latin dance etc. I think black gals r the sexiest gals for whatever reason since i was a kid, disney jungle book influenced me I guess?, anyhoo, I just want an incredible gal to settle with if she can keep up with my lifestyle activities & energy

Maybe she didn't want to live in Thailand, but didn't really know how to tell you?  In my experience, a lot of Kenyans love their home country and would ideally want to live there, or at least have a partner who would be willing to live in Kenya.  When I met my wife, it was one thing that she needed assurance about.

really great input, thx so much

How do they treat black Americans in Kenya?

Haha, I think it's just like we treat fellow Kenyans...except there's more interest and attention drawn to you because of your accent mostly. Lol. I have several African-American friends and I see that.

So would the women be artraxcted to African American ken I heard Kenyans treat whites as gods is that true

I think so...lol. Which is sad but most of the Kenyans who especially didn't grow up around international communities are that way. Someone like me who grew up with internationals in my school, at home, etc doesn't see mzungus as gods since over 70% of my friends are already internationals...but someone that only sees mzungus on TV or some times in the streets would act pretty different if they encountered and interacted with a mzungu. I can't speak for all women but I think attraction depends on many factors..lol. Most likely being African-American will be one of the most obvious factor, but not the most important one

I disagree that 'whites' are treated like gods.  But, they are always assumed to be wealthy and prices tend to rise significantly for mzungu's.

Hqow would black americansnbe treated there

I don't think that you should have any concerns.  Its possible that (from your accent) you also would be assumed to be wealthy.

Its not unusual for Kenyans to have emigrated to the US and return for visits, for example.

Kenyans are quite non judgemental when it comes to race and foreigners (but tribalism is a problem within Kenya).

I have been married to my (Kikuyu) wife for 21 years and have never had any criticism from Kenyans about this and have been fully accepted by her family and society.  Not like the UK - non of the hang ups that particularly Jamaican people in the UK seem to have - making silly comments about 'keeping it pure' and so on and my wife constantly being reminded about her skin colour!